5.5 inch blade non-serrated folder?

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Mark-Smith

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Are there any good plain edge 5.5 inch blade length folders out there? One that caught my eye was the cold steel XL Voyager tanto, but it's a bit steep at $90.

cs29xt.jpg


Anything else along similar lines y'all would recommend? Anything over 5.5" is illegal here in Texas sadly (including daggers AND bowie knives!! :what:)
 
It's no great secret that I'm no major CS fan, but any decent folder with a blade that long isn't going to be cheap. That $90 seems fairly reasonable to me...but I find the XL Voyager cheaper. (I'd go for the clip point, not the "Tanto".)

And that's huge. I bought a Spyderco Resilience for a friend, and handled it before I mailed it to him. It's over a inch shorter than you're looking for, and it's enormous.
 
I've got the fixed blade 5.5" CS Kobun:

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Phenomenal knife, but some times a pain in the butt to carry, and it's smaller than it's larger brother on my desk, the 7.5" Oyabun (which I'd carry everywhere if that were legal):

vyp1nd.jpg

If a fixed blade from CS can come in at $35 for 5.5", why would a folder be listed for almost triple the price? I'll give some for 'costs money to make a folding mechanism' but $90 for an extra 2" of blade length seems dubious at best.

All that aside, if 5.5" is the legal maximum, I'd prefer to stick with that length rather than go below it.

And tanto point > clip point :p
 
Um, okay.

Everyone's welcome to their opinion, but the "American Tanto" point is really best for stabbing into metal. As long as you're not planning to be attacked by trash cans, other blade shapes are more useful.

When it comes to carrying the "most" of something, those of us with CCL/CCW could usually legally carry a N frame .44 Magnum or .45 Colt. But, legality or not, it's just not convenient or practical to carry something that large most of the time. I'm unfortunately a little curious why you would carry a 7.5"-bladed knife around everywhere. And "because I can" isn't a real answer.
 
There aren't very many 5" inch folders out there because most state and local laws prohibit carrying anything 4 inches or longer, CA and TX and a couple of others excepted. Because of those legal restrictions most manufacturers don't produce many, if any, folders with blades longer than 4 inches making it difficult for 4+" blade fans to find as many products as 4-".

With that our of the way, Cuda Maxx; Cold Steel Paradox (note: butterfly), Vaqueros, and Espada are all that come to mind.

tanto point > clip point
a common myth that simple inspection retires by looking at custom "utility" knives and the ratio of "tanto" tips to drop or clip or other types.
 
The Magnum brand of knives by Boker has some pretty large folders. The Power Trooper is one, and there are a few others that I can't recall the names of. They're inexpensive($20-$30 range), but I've never seen any of them in person, so I don't know if they're junk or not.
 
JShirley said:
When it comes to carrying the "most" of something, those of us with CCL/CCW could usually legally carry a N frame .44 Magnum or .45 Colt. But, legality or not, it's just not convenient or practical to carry something that large most of the time. I'm unfortunately a little curious why you would carry a 7.5"-bladed knife around everywhere. And "because I can" isn't a real answer.

5.5" to be exact, and in addition to a Glock.
A.) Knives don't need reloading.
B.) Certain parts of the work day involve me going in places where firearms can't be carried. One is responsible for one's own defense, and to choose to be defenseless is foolish at best.

hso said:
a common myth that simple inspection retires by looking at custom "utility" knives and the ratio of "tanto" tips to drop or clip or other types.

In this case, it stems from personal preference. Look, I've forged my own knives, pounded them out on an anvil, ground 'em, sharpened 'em, made custom scales for 'em. It's not like I don't know full well the utility of each variety of blade edge and shape. I'm not looking to cook in the kitchen or for a blade suited for daily utility uses. I don't even imagine a universe where this particular one would need to be sharpened more than twice in that many decades in the course of it's normal use.

It would be nice if someone could ask for advice, and simple answers to questions could be given, rather than "What you *really* want is X". A forum is only as good as the people on it, and if no good advice can be found, what's the point in posting?
 
Are there any good plain edge 5.5 inch blade length folders out there?

Well... i think the key word in this sentence is "good". From your later description, i can say that you have a LOT more experience with knife-making and probably general knife knowledge than I do and i'll defer to that. That being said, for that much steel and knife, i would think you'd have an idea on the value of such a knife (and hence cost) in order to be something you'd want to trust your life with.

It would be nice if someone could ask for advice, and simple answers to questions could be given, rather than "What you *really* want is X". A forum is only as good as the people on it, and if no good advice can be found, what's the point in posting?

HSO: 22K+ posts
JShirley: 12K + posts

I won't hesitate to say you likely have more experience than I do but just a modest bit of advice, I think it's worth listening to what they have to say. Posts aren't everything but if you spend a little time here, i think you'll find that they're worth listening to.

Good luck with your search.
 
if no good advice can be found, what's the point in posting?

The Americanized Tanto tip is a bit controversial any more in the knife world and debate goes on about the utility of it. Endorsing that design opens the discussion up to the counter arguments that are part and parcel of that debate. Suggesting that opening the discussion advocating a design as better and then opposing any rebuttal or counter argument doesn't serve anyone's interest in getting good advice.
 
I haven't heard of the controversy, if you could fill me in. I'd be appreciative.

I favor the design from personal experience. Serrated is a real pain if you ever need to sharpen it. I like a straight edge on my knives as I find it easier to sharpen than a curve, or some elegant but very hard to maintain complex curve / concave curve edges.

If you're ever in a situation, god forbid, where you're forced to take a knife to a gun fight, the closer the thing is to a short sword, the better in my opinion. Some practical aspects of carrying a 10" inflexible length of metal and rubber do apply though, and if it digs into you when sitting, or creates a noticeable outline, it'd be nice to not have to deal with those issues.

Unfortunately, as a law-abiding sort, you have you work with what you are legally restricted to. I doubt I'd ever have need to defend myself, but as the saying goes, 'fortune favors the prepared'. The last thing I want to do is be stuck in an environment where I can't legally carry my gun, only to face someone crazy bearing a gun with no respect for those laws with my bare hands.

If a 5.5" plain tanto point for $50 or less in the 'will stay locked open under impact' is not to be found, I suppose I'll have to consider other points and styles. That said, I know what I like and have good experience with for a given application.
 
Mark-Smith said:
In this case, it stems from personal preference. Look, I've forged my own knives, pounded them out on an anvil, ground 'em, sharpened 'em, made custom scales for 'em. It's not like I don't know full well the utility of each variety of blade edge and shape. I'm not looking to cook in the kitchen or for a blade suited for daily utility uses. I don't even imagine a universe where this particular one would need to be sharpened more than twice in that many decades in the course of it's normal use.

It would be nice if someone could ask for advice, and simple answers to questions could be given, rather than "What you *really* want is X". A forum is only as good as the people on it, and if no good advice can be found, what's the point in posting?

As an observer I'll comment: maybe you need to relax and you might learn something. Actually you did ask a legit question in your most recent post so great.

But to address this post...

You came and posted a pic of a knife with a tanto tip, asking for suggestions on a knife.

Someone gave you a suggestion/opinion about tanto tips.

You posted more Americanized tantos and said "tanto > clip point :p"

Someone else who really knows a heck of a lot about knives, and was telling the truth (the *only* advantage of the Americanized tanto is for metal penetration) replied substantively.

Now you are saying you wanted advice, and asking "if you can't get good advice what's the point of asking." The answers given are independently verifiable as good advice if you define that as accurate advice. If you define good advice as that which agrees with what you already believe, what is the point in asking for advice?
 
As an observer I'll comment: maybe you need to relax and you might learn something.

I suppose it does appear hasty, however, THR is infamous for someone asking a question only to have another poster tell them 'No, that's not what you want, *this* is what you want'. When people start off with posts that appear to be in that vein, my patience rapidly disappears.

However, it can be hard to judge intent on the internet, so I'll try to avoid being hasty in such.


My quip that tantos are better than clip points was tongue-in-cheek, as yes, I realize the utility of a tanto style blade is limited at best.

If I wanted something aside from a tanto-style, I'd ask for suggestions towards that end. If there is literally nothing out there that meets what I'm looking for, some indication of that would be useful as well.

My experience compared to the collective experience of the posters found here does pale by comparison though, and I'll readily admit there's heaps I don't know.

If someone wants to say 'The tanto style is a recipe for trouble because of X, Y and Z compared to style X, which deals with those issues.', that's one thing.


In a defensive situation, honestly the only things that appear to matter are:
'it's sharp enough'
'has a good grip area',
and in the case of folders 'the lock won't fail during use'
(note that that's not 'the lock won't fail if you're using the knife as a pry bar').
'The blade comes to a point' is also better than the converse.
And as always, the longer the better within legal bounds.

I suppose you could, worst come to worst, use a ball point pen as a defensive tool, a chair, a pen knife, something with a 1.5" blade, etc. But why do so if you can spend a little time and get the best thing for the job? That said, I'm open to recommendations for 'this is better and this is why it's better!'
 
Fair enough, and I know what you mean...I see threads where people recommend Glocks for "which revolver," but I don't guess I see that too much on this subforum. I don't think I saw you specify tanto, because the way I read it you said you prefer tanto. I think hso can post the reasons specifically, like the cutting/stabbing tests, that he dislike tantos. And it's only fair that you might ask why he felt that way and ask for proof of his claims.

I think you should look at one of the big spydercos. The ergonomics of a knife will make a lot of difference in the way you use it, more than a flat, dead numerical value that means different things in the face of different ergos/profiles.

The spyderco military would probably be great but is outside your price-range. It's 9 1/4 OAL I think. The resilience is within your price-range and is 9 3/4 I believe. Both have G10 handles and leaf shaped blades. I think the leaf shaped blade offers the best combination of heft, balance, slice power/belly, and penetration.

I realize those aren't 5.5 inches but they are probably the closest thing on paper to what you wanted other than cold steel...and they are better knives in my book and if you hold them, you may have the qualities you think you will get with a 5.5" blade.

A bigger handle and somewhat shorter blade offers more hand positions, more utility (why not carry 1 blade for everything), and still has the reach of a big folder. A lot of the bigger folders like the Vaquero are not balanced appropriately to get the most out of the 11-12" overall length, so you might not even get any extra reach out of those versus a well balanced Spyderco like I mentioned.
 
A useable handle that's 5"+ is very important I'd like to get as close to 5.5" as possible for both blade and handle length, but a good handle on a folder is sadly a rare thing. Definitely will take a look at those spydercos you mentioned.

I've had a few folders, but all of them 3.5" or shorter on the blade length. None of them something I'd go for as a self-defense tool over a 5.5" fixed blade.
 
I haven't heard of the controversy, if you could fill me in. I'd be appreciative.

A recent article that Michael Janich wrote for the September, 2010 Tactical Knives issue triggered a very strong response from CS's Lynn Thompson. It is the most recent good example of the argument about the merits of the Americanized Tanto. I put a thread up about it shortly after the TK issue came out explaining I had done similar penetration tests years ago with similar results. Other arguments about it started almost as soon as it was introduced. I don't think it is an awful point, just no better than others and terribly over-hyped.
 
Texas != San Antonio

I'm gonna presume that since you said "Texas" and "locking" in the same breath, you're on the Dallas/FW side of the state.

If you should find this ideal knife you seek, you should be advised that, as of my last reading, San Antonio still has a ban of locking folders of all flavors.

It would appear that your primary use for this folder is defensive.

Do you then also carry a more reasonably sized general purpose knife for opening boxes, cutting string, slicing apples, and all that stuff?

 
Do you then also carry a more reasonably sized general purpose knife for opening boxes, cutting string, slicing apples, and all that stuff?

I've got a small leatherman for all my utility needs, works great for its intended use, no complaints.

I shall have to make sure to remember that if I'm ever in San Antonio. For a city in Texas, that's downright strange... Of course, wet/dry regions and related laws also make one's head hurt heh.
 
San Antonio at least when I lived there, was the most liberal city in Texas. It was like the Carmel of Texas. Anywho, I use to love tantos, but unless I carried a second or third knife, I ended up hating them for utility use. Here's why,

Hard to sharpen, more so than any plain edge clip or other design. Especially if chisel sharpened.

Useful for stabbing only.

The design that freaked most non gun or knife people out when I had to pull it out to say, open a box or cut a plastic something using it as a utility knife if I didn't have a second knife.

I now carry various other blade designs drop point, clip, warncliff.

Pretty much anything other than a tanto. I have a couple nice Tantos, neither of which are all plain, both combo edges. I carry them but also carry a slip joint as a utility knife when I do carry a tanto.
 
Yeah, San Antonio has some of the strangest knife laws around.

I a defensive situation, honestly the only things that appear to matter are:
'it's sharp enough'
'has a good grip area',
and in the case of folders 'the lock won't fail during use'
(note that that's not 'the lock won't fail if you're using the knife as a pry bar').
'The blade comes to a point' is also better than the converse.
And as always, the longer the better within legal bounds.
Truer words have not been uttered.:D
 
I carry a XL Voyager Clip point. clipped in my pocket every day For nearly 20 years before that I carried a Large Voyager clipped in pocket In those days I drove truck in all 48 and into Canada The knife was always at my side . I retired it when it finely broke the plastic clip. I have a Kobun also. Its the older carbon blade model. I just find the Folder more useful and if need be I can slip back on the handle and gain another inch or two on reach If needed for SD. I have way larger folders than the voyager 8 to 10 " blades


IWB easy. IN KY my permit allows carry of these larger knives.
 
The best of what you want IF you can find it and then AFFORD it!

Gordon,

Actually, "the best" Mad Maxx comes from Darrel Ralph's shop directly, but that drives the price up just a little. Of course, you can get it now as an assisted opener and with a DLC coating unlike the CUDA Maxx. The price comes out very nearly the same considering what CUDA Maxxs are auctioning for. ;)


htm-mm-DLC-220-O.jpg
 
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Mark, regarding the utility of a smaller blade, google southnarc and check out some of his articles like the one on Rearic's site (donrearic.com) called "A narcotic agent's hideout knives" or something similar.

He makes some great points about CQC where a 6-7" OAL knife with a ~3" blade or less might be more useful than a monster of 10" OAL or more.
 
I can only say what works perfectly for me.

If I had to defend myself with a folding knife, the Spyderco Chinook would be my first choice. The Chinooks' handle shape makes them harder to carry than some other folding knives that I feel are close to the defensive ability of a Chinook.

If you want a dedicated SD folder, I would get something with one of the strongest possible locking systems. The Spyderco Military and Resilience are both great knives, but are both liner locks. If defense is the sole purpose of this knife, I would suggest a Spyderco Manix 2 or Paramilitary.

No, these knives aren't as long as you'd like, nor are they any form of tanto, but I also have no direct knowledge of exactly how strong the Cold Steel knives are. I do, however know that Spyderco has destroyed both of these knives, and the pressure it takes is such that you will never generate it with any stab or cut.

I doubt you'll be able to find a Chinook. If you're willing to carry a huge blade, the wide handle of the Chinook might not be an issue for you to carry in a pocket, as it was for me. IF you could find one, and IF you could afford it, that would be my first choice. The other two I mention can be found for around $80 and $100, respectively. And they're worth every penny.

John
 
a few possible options

while not quite to ur 5.5 inch request the spyderco catcherman in aus-8 sports a 4 and 3/4 inc blade. It was intended as a kinda folding fillet knife but it had a nice sharp point and a thin profile so i would thing it could be plenty stabby for you. However, it will also run u more than 90 dollars on the secondary market as they have been discontinued.

From looking around on line after seeing your post ur options pretty much boil down to the voyagers in $90.00 range ... perhaps the Rajah's though they seem better suited to hack than stab.

If you are willing to go higher Extrema Ratio,Dark ops, and Tops knives make some pretty sizable folders as i recall.
 
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