6.5 CM ?

[joneb]

I am thinking this maybe my next rifle cartridge, but which rifle?
I'm leaning toward something in the $650 range so the Ruger American or the Howa 1500 seems like a good option. I could go as high $1K for a Tikka but is it worth the extra $'s
What am I missing?
I would use this for hunting and target shooting.

 

[jmr40]

I bought a Ruger Predator in 6.5 CM just to get into the cartridge cheap. For $400 it is an extremely accurate rifle that functions well. You should be able to get the Tikka lite for $700, maybe less. It will PROBABLY be a bit more accurate than Ruger or Howa, but there are exceptions to every rule.

With a $1000 budget a Tikka CTR would be an option. They are tack drivers on the target range, but scoped weight will be 9+ lbs. Bordering on too heavy to hunt with, especially in rugged terrain. The standard Tikka can be under 7 lbs scoped and is one of the lightest options. It would be near the top of my list for hunting in rugged terrain. A standard Howa is also a very heavy rifle ( about the same as the CTR), and they don't even have a heavy bull barrel. My Ruger splits the difference in weight at about 7 3/4 lbs scoped.

For mostly target shooting and occasional hunting in flat country I like the Tikka CTR. I don't think you can go wrong with the Ruger and you can get a decent scope and still keep the budget under $700. I'd buy the newer version that takes Accuracy International style magazines. They come with a 3 round detachable magazine, but will take 5 and 10 round magazines. The 3 or 5 round magazines don't protrude far enough below the stock to be a problem while hunting and are a much better magazines than the originals. Cost of the rifles is the same. If you plan on hunting in more rugged terrain the lighter Tikka is worth the extra money. They are a little more refined than the Ruger.

http://www.tikka.fi/en-us/rifles/tikka-t3x/t3x-compact-tactical-rifle#technical_specifications

http://www.tikka.fi/en-us/rifles/tikka-t3x/t3x-lite

https://ruger.com/products/americanRiflePredator/specSheets/26973.html

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/47490

 

[TN Outlaw]

I second the Ruger American Predator. For a decently built gun that is light enough to carry and in a stock that you won't mind dragging through thickets, it's also known for shooting very well too.

For your price range the Howa 1500, WBY Vanguard, Tikka, Bergara, Savage, plus several more would make fine rifles. For the rifle plus quality glass under 1K, I suggest the Predator.

 

[LoonWulf]

Ive owned a couple ruger americans, but not the predator, and the 6.5CM i owned was a 1500.

I liked the 1500 better out of the box, better trigger, smoother action, and a stock that fits me better. With about 20 mins of work I like the Americans just as well as the 1500s, except the stock, and they are significantly lighter.
Of the tube guns, including the T3s, I like the Americans the best. They arent as smooth as the Tikka, or have as nice a stock, but are generally accurate, about the same weight. They also cost less.

Right now my two favorite open aciton push feeds are the Howa1500/Vanguards, and the Bergara B-14s.

That tho is all personal preference. At this point, its hard to buy a bad rifle for general hunting and target shooting, pretty much everyone is turning out good quality products at very impressive prices. Handle as many as you can and find one that feels good to you, If you have to spend a little more to get it Id do it.

 

[VoodooMountain]

For me it would depend on use

American for hunting

Predator for hunting and some target use out to 500 or so.

Howa for good quality gun that would see mostly 100-200 yard groups with some hunting thrown in. Probably your best bet from what you describe.

Savage 12 for serious target work. They are just so easy to modify for your needs and the barrel is easily replaced when shot out.

 

[cdb1]

I would go Winchester M70, Bergara, Weatherby Vanguard or Tikka. In that order. The reason I put Tikka last is because I don’t care for DBM’s and small ejection ports, it has nothing to do with quality.

Some will say the Vanguard and Howa 1500 are the same. I don’t think of it that way because IMO Vanguards have better, stocks, fit and finish. Howa has closed the gap because they are now using what I believe is the same trigger as the Vanguard.

 

[joneb]

Thanks for the replies and things to chew on , I have a Howa 1500 in .308 win. with a 22" sporter barrel that I really like. I have a Ruger American Ranch in 7.62x39 that is a joy to shoot.
With the Howa I get three great great shots and then I assume the barrel is heating up and effects accuracy? With 16" barreled RAR the accuracy suffers far less with more rounds through barrel at a lower velocity. I have considered the 6.5 CM in 20 to 22" for this reason, I know there is a give and take with target vs hunting rifles and you can't have both but is there a compromise?
I am ok with the Ruger American trigger on my RAR 7.62x39, but on a long range rifle it could be a issue.
As for long range shots on antelope in Eastern Oregon can be a real challenge with shots exceeding ranges you would expect.

 

[LoonWulf]

Thanks for the replies and things to chew on , I have a Howa 1500 in .308 win. with a 22" sporter barrel that I really like. I have a Ruger American Ranch in 7.62x39 that is a joy to shoot.
With the Howa I get three great great shots and then I assume the barrel is heating up and effects accuracy? With 16" barreled RAR the accuracy suffers far less with more rounds through barrel at a lower velocity. I have considered the 6.5 CM in 20 to 22" for this reason, I know there is a give and take with target vs hunting rifles and you can't have both but is there a compromise?
I am ok with the Ruger American trigger on my RAR 7.62x39, but on a long range rifle it could be a issue.
As for long range shots on antelope in Eastern Oregon can be a real challenge with shots exceeding ranges you would expect.

You do have to compromise between a true target rifle, and a walking hunter.
General purpose target, and general purpose hunter can be the same guns. They are usually to the heavy end of the "sporter" type rifles, mostly due to a slightly heaver barrel profile, ala Remington 700s, and by association B-14s.
The Ruger American Predator is in this class, and is one of the lighter options.

If your willing to tote more weight, than you can get a varmint/long range weight rifle, some that still sports a sporter stock. These usually weigh in around 10-12lbs loaded, feature heavier barrels, and often but not always heavier thicker stocks. pretty much everyone makes something like this, including Howa.
I dont really like the thick forends unless my primary use is prone or off a bench, so generally these arnt rifle types I own, unless i restock them or buy a cheaper version that just has an opened up sporter stock.

If your willing to take some time you can polish out a Ruger American bolt, and trigger pretty nicely. There isnt much to be done if your gun has a long trigger pull, or at least i havent come up with a good option to adjust it yet.
my RAM has a good smooth 3lb trigger, but the pull is kinda long. I may leave it at that tho as i want to remove the blade from the trigger, it bugs me.

 

[eastbank]

take a look at the rem 700 SA sps in .260 with a 24" barrel and 1/8 twist, it gives nothing up to the 6.5 cm. I paid a little over 450.00 for mine and it shoots very well.

 

[someguy2800]

Thanks for the replies and things to chew on , I have a Howa 1500 in .308 win. with a 22" sporter barrel that I really like. I have a Ruger American Ranch in 7.62x39 that is a joy to shoot.
With the Howa I get three great great shots and then I assume the barrel is heating up and effects accuracy? With 16" barreled RAR the accuracy suffers far less with more rounds through barrel at a lower velocity. I have considered the 6.5 CM in 20 to 22" for this reason, I know there is a give and take with target vs hunting rifles and you can't have both but is there a compromise?
I am ok with the Ruger American trigger on my RAR 7.62x39, but on a long range rifle it could be a issue.
As for long range shots on antelope in Eastern Oregon can be a real challenge with shots exceeding ranges you would expect.

A properly stress relieved and free floated barrel will not string or open up groups as they warm up. It should still hold a group when too warm to touch.

I would spring for the Tikka. It really is a step above the others. Excellent barrels, excellent trigger, excellent action, excellent stock and bedding.

 

[FL-NC]

I have the RAR predator in 308, with the shorter barrel (18"?) I installed a surefire brake to dampen recoil and put it into a Boyd's laminated stock. Also added a Harris bipod. I am 100% satisfied with this rifle, it runs very well on Winchester 150 grain power point, but it did not like M118 175 grain SMK. I chose 308 for the broad availability and pricing of 308 factory ammo. My friend has the predator in 6.5 CM that he set up in the identical stock. It shoots better than my 308 (sub MOA). Here is my 308. The newer RAR rifles use an improved magazine over the ones we have.

 

[Bushpilot]

Right now my two favorite open aciton push feeds are the Howa1500/Vanguards, and the Bergara B-14s.

That tho is all personal preference. At this point, its hard to buy a bad rifle for general hunting and target shooting, pretty much everyone is turning out good quality products at very impressive prices. Handle as many as you can and find one that feels good to you, If you have to spend a little more to get it Id do it.

The reason I put Tikka last is because I don’t care for DBM’s and small ejection ports, it has nothing to do with quality.

Yep...
All the rifles mentioned thus far are good rifles IMO. I agree with Loon, it's almost hard to buy a bad rifle theses days... I think the Howa 1500 is one of the real deals in the bunch.

I don't really like small ejection ports either although the rigidity created by having such an enclosed receiver is probably one of the reasons many of these type of rifles tend to shoot well, are so light and is likely the trend for the future... The Ruger Americans are good rifles but, again like Loonwolf, I don't care for the stocks... I also like the Remington SPS, except for the lousy stocks.. The same goes for many of the Savages...

 

[Poper]

The reason I put Tikka last is because I don’t care for DBM’s and small ejection ports, it has nothing to do with quality.

When I bought my first Tikka, I didn't care for the polymer detachable box magazine. (I like DBM's in general, my go-to rifle is a Rem. 788) However, I can honestly say, the only rifle I have that feeds as smoothly from the magazine is a Sako 85. And I paid almost 3x the money for the 85! Oh, and it has a staggered DBM.

Why do I prefer the DBM?
1) Easier to reload under field conditions.
2) easier to clear/make safe (JMHO)
3) Personal preference - I don't like loading through the ejection port. I drop a round into the chamber, close the bolt put it on 'safe', snap a magazine in place, drop a loaded spare into my pocket, leave camp for my nature walk... Ah! Gotta love it....

 

[VoodooMountain]

Thanks for the replies and things to chew on , I have a Howa 1500 in .308 win. with a 22" sporter barrel that I really like. I have a Ruger American Ranch in 7.62x39 that is a joy to shoot.
With the Howa I get three great great shots and then I assume the barrel is heating up and effects accuracy? With 16" barreled RAR the accuracy suffers far less with more rounds through barrel at a lower velocity. I have considered the 6.5 CM in 20 to 22" for this reason, I know there is a give and take with target vs hunting rifles and you can't have both but is there a compromise?
I am ok with the Ruger American trigger on my RAR 7.62x39, but on a long range rifle it could be a issue.
As for long range shots on antelope in Eastern Oregon can be a real challenge with shots exceeding ranges you would expect.

The length of barrel doesn't dictate poi shifts when it gets hot but rather how concentric the barrel is.

Shorter barrels are generally easier to find accurate load for though.

A lot of the poi shift is luck of the draw but starting with a high quality barrel and free floating stock certainly helps.

And spotter weight barrels also cool off much faster than heavy barrels. I never see this mentioned in posts.

 

[joneb]

The length of barrel doesn't dictate poi shifts when it gets hot but rather how concentric the barrel is.

Shorter barrels are generally easier to find accurate load for though.

A lot of the poi shift is luck of the draw but starting with a high quality barrel and free floating stock certainly helps.

And spotter weight barrels also cool off much faster than heavy barrels. I never see this mentioned in posts.

For a hunting rifle I like to have three good shots.

 

[Big_Sloppy75]

I bought the Savage 12FV at cabelas last Black Friday. It goes on for about 230 after a rebate. I love the gun, but good luck hunting with it, way too heavy. I love taking it out to the range, and it’s not bad to coyote hunt with shooting sticks

 

[Crowman]

I bought a Ruger GSR Scout Rifle chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor last September and made meat in November. Great stalking rifle. This one has the synthetic stock and the barrel is about two inches longer than the 308 model. I put a Leatherwood Hi-Lux 2-7 x Scout scope on it mounted forward. Brush is very thick around me and most shots on whitetails run between 40-60 yards on mountain ridges. Sweet combination. Super accurate as well. Had my longest shot at 85 yards through a 6” hole in the brush. Deer walked in the window...winner-winner, venison dinner.

The 6.5 Creedmoor is the one on the bottom with camo stock.the upper one is the first one in 308 Winchester.

The 6.5 Creedmoor rocks. So does the GSR Scout.

 

[792mauser]

I lucked into a Savage 10ba stealth in 6.5 Creedmoor cheap a while back. With no real idea what I was in for.

I loaded up about 90 rounds to try it out. My random slapped together with non favorite powder, probably 50 year old projectiles and garage sale 20 dollar per k primers turned into 2.5 inch groups to just about 1 inch.

Gotta say is a keeper. I need to get some better components and the Savage is terrific!

 

[Hokkmike]

I am thinking this maybe my next rifle cartridge, but which rifle?
I'm leaning toward something in the $650 range so the Ruger American or the Howa 1500 seems like a good option. I could go as high $1K for a Tikka but is it worth the extra $'s
What am I missing?
I would use this for hunting and target shooting.

Friend just bought a Sauer 6.5 CM for exactly $650. They guarantee 1/4 MOA of accuracy at 100 yards for 10 years.

 

[LoonWulf]

Friend just bought a Sauer 6.5 CM for exactly $650. They guarantee 1/4 MOA of accuracy at 100 yards for 10 years.

What model is that? I can find a 1moa guarantee, which is what most manufacturers who have one use, but that's about it.
Those Sauers are pretty rifles, even the synthetics.

 

[joneb]

Friend just bought a Sauer 6.5 CM for exactly $650. They guarantee 1/4 MOA of accuracy at 100 yards for 10 years.

Thanks for the heads up I will look in to the Sauer rifles, I also noticed Sauer will be chambering for the 6.5 PRC which looks interesting.

 

[Hokkmike]

What model is that? I can find a 1moa guarantee, which is what most manufacturers who have one use, but that's about it.
Those Sauers are pretty rifles, even the synthetics.

I did handle it and played with a it little. I have a SAKO Finnlight in 6.5x55 so wasn't inspecting it to buy it. My friend was the actual shopper. Sorry I don't remember the model number. I might add that my friend also topped it off with a 4x12x40 Sauer scope. It was a synthetic stock- very pretty. Good 3 stage safety, low arc bolt, and five round magazine. If I didn't already have a gun a really, really, like I would seriously consider one.

 

[Gtscotty]

Tikka CTRs are heavy for a hunting gun, but are usually fantastic shooters. The regular T3xs in 6.5 come with an M+ marked mag that is longer than the M marked mags that come with other short action Tikkas, I think they allow something like 2.95" oal, nice for hand loading the heavies. The regular T3x with something like a SWFA 3-9x40 FFP would make a nice range/hunting combo rifle. Unfortunately Tikka (Beretta) just instituted a stricter MAP policy, so finding SS T3xs anywhere for under $749 is going to become tougher. They were a great deal at $600 -$650, maybe less so at $750.

I'd also look at Browning X-Bolts, they are pretty light, ergonomic and tend to shoot quite well. Winchester just started making 6.5s so a featherweight might fit the bill as well. My 6.5 Kimber shoots well in a Hunter stuck, but it's really aimed more at mountain hunting than range fun.

I think the perfect length for an unsuppressed hunting Creedmoor is 22". My Kimber was cut to 20" and threaded for a can, and velocities with RL16 are still quite good.