6mm PPC questions

[Poper]

The nice thing about The Highroad is there are many members that are far more knowledgeable in regards to firearms than I am! So, I would like to ask for some expertise, insights and advice regarding my most recent wild hare.

I have an old Winchester M70 chambered in .243 WSSM in the back of my safe that has been collecting dust. I'm thinking I might like to rebarrel it in 6mm PPC.
The WSSM case is 1.670" long and the 6mm PPC is 1.503" long, so no issues with the 6mm PPC fitting the very short WSSM action and barrels are available from most barrel makers.
The case head for the 6mm PPC is .445" and the case head for the .243 WSSM is .535" so a new bolt face is going to be required. Will this require replacing the entire bolt or is it possible to replace the head of the bolt only?

 

[CarJunkieLS1]

I do believe the Model 70 is a one piece bolt so therefore the bolt would need replaced and properly headspaced to the new barrel.

If it were me and you wanted to replace the barrel I'd go with another 243 WSSM barrel as brass is able to be bought and so is factory loaded ammo.

 

[rkittine]

Or, if you want to go with a cartridge that is considered more a Bench Rest Caliber and want to use the bolt you have, you could go 6mmBR Norma.

Bob

 

[Offfhand]

Pardon the question, but I have to ask: what do you expect to achieve, or what benefits, you're expecting from the 6PPC that you don't already have with the .243 WSSM?

 

[Walkalong]

Or, if you want to go with a cartridge that is considered more a Bench Rest Caliber and want to use the bolt you have, you could go 6mmBR Norma.

Bob

This is the easy answer, re-barrel to 6 BR and use the same bolt. It is also super accurate, as is the PPC, assuming that is what you are looking for.

 

[George P]

You might find some good info here as well:

https://www.6mmbr.com/index.html

 

[Poper]

Pardon the question, but I have to ask: what do you expect to achieve, or what benefits, you're expecting from the 6PPC that you don't already have with the .243 WSSM?

Primarily, better accuracy. The .243 WSSM is particularly hard on brass. Winchester brass rarely lasts more than 4 firings and this particular example groups best near the maximum powder charges. Also, the case is long compared to the OAL of the cartridge. The magazine and throat are relatively short which means bullets are seated deep into the case. Pointed bullets like Berger have trouble feeding from the magazine.
Also, 6mm PPC brass is available from Norma so I wouldn't have to form it.

Or, if you want to go with a cartridge that is considered more a Bench Rest Caliber and want to use the bolt you have, you could go 6mmBR Norma.

This is the easy answer, re-barrel to 6 BR and use the same bolt. It is also super accurate, as is the PPC, assuming that is what you are looking for.

I like this idea. I shall explore it some more. This particular M70 action is exceptionally smooth to operate. It feels like it has had some custom tuning done but I know it has not because I bought it new in the box a long time ago. And I like the extra short receiver and bolt travel.

ETA: Thank you all for your time and insights. I knew I couldn't think of everything I could do with this rifle!

 

[rkittine]

Though the 6PPC in competition is a more winning cartridge at 100 and 200 yards, the 6mmBR Norma is right behind it and really shines at 300 - 600. You could even consider something like a 6mm Dasher. Lapua even makes some really accurate factory 6mmBR Norma ammo and there is brass, where for the 6PPC you typically will reform Lapua 220 Russian.

Bob

 

[GooseGestapo]

AFAIK, The 6mmBR uses the .473” case head like the parent case, a small rifle primer .308 match case.(confirmed at 6mmBR.com).
The .243WSSM the uses a .585” bolt face of a belted magnum.
He’ll need a different bolt, still.
The 6BR will offer better barrel life and tighter tolerances.

Added; Norma makes excellent 6mmPPC brass. No need to reform .220Russian brass.

 

[rkittine]

I did not realize that about the WSSM. Have never owned one of those. I have tried both the Norma Brass and brass I made from Lapua 220 Russian and much prefer the Lapua, though you are right you either have to buy it from a reformer or do it yourself.

Bob

 

[Walkalong]

AFAIK, The 6mmBR uses the .473” case head like the parent case, a small rifle primer .308 match case.(confirmed at 6mmBR.com).
The .243WSSM the uses a .585” bolt face of a belted magnum.
He’ll need a different bolt, still.
The 6BR will offer better barrel life and tighter tolerances.

Added; Norma makes excellent 6mmPPC brass. No need to reform .220Russian brass.

Well bummer, I read it as just.243.....

 

[horsemen61]

Ttrl

 

[horsemen61]

@Poper I can’t wait to see what you do with it! Please keep us posted!

 

[eastbank]

i have a 6x47 remington 40x that is close to the 6ppc and it is a ex shooter and shoots 1/4-3/8" when i,m up to it. and a factory ruger 77 in 22 ppc that does the same thing.

 

[redneck2]

The bummer that always pops up is that you’ll have more in the re-barrel and bolt than you’d have in a new rifle, particularly if you sold the old one and applied the funds towards the swap. But, something like a 6br would be pretty awesome My S-I-L has a heavy barrel Savage. Real shooter

 

[Nature Boy]

To me this is a no brainer. 6BR

 

[Gtscotty]

Kind of going the other way, but I think a fast twist 7mm SAUM or even 7mm WSM would be a pretty interesting option. Although If your Winchester is one of those shorty WSSM actions, I guess that probably wouldn't work.

 

[horsemen61]

The nice thing about The Highroad is there are many members that are far more knowledgeable in regards to firearms than I am! So, I would like to ask for some expertise, insights and advice regarding my most recent wild hare.

I have an old Winchester M70 chambered in .243 WSSM in the back of my safe that has been collecting dust. I'm thinking I might like to rebarrel it in 6mm PPC.
The WSSM case is 1.670" long and the 6mm PPC is 1.503" long, so no issues with the 6mm PPC fitting the very short WSSM action and barrels are available from most barrel makers.
The case head for the 6mm PPC is .445" and the case head for the .243 WSSM is .535" so a new bolt face is going to be required. Will this require replacing the entire bolt or is it possible to replace the head of the bolt only?

Any updates?

 

[Reloadron]

I have an old Winchester M70 chambered in .243 WSSM in the back of my safe that has been collecting dust. I'm thinking I might like to rebarrel it in 6mm PPC.
The WSSM case is 1.670" long and the 6mm PPC is 1.503" long, so no issues with the 6mm PPC fitting the very short WSSM action and barrels are available from most barrel makers.
The case head for the 6mm PPC is .445" and the case head for the .243 WSSM is .535" so a new bolt face is going to be required. Will this require replacing the entire bolt or is it possible to replace the head of the bolt only?

I can tell you how I went about doing it, building my 6PPC rifle. I did it as a part of a NRA smithing course given at Montgomery Community College in Troy NC. This was maybe 25 or more years ago and my instructor was a great
fellow named Mr. James Messer. I believe James is no longer with us sadly. I started with a full contour blank from Shilen (pretty sure it was Shilen. I used a Remington 700 action originally chambered in 223 Remington. I opened the bolt face and made an insert I brazed in. Also we milled a slot on the bolt and installed a sako extractor. A Google of Sako Extractor Remington 700 Bolt will get plenty of hits. I don't see where it can't be done with a Winchester bolt. I reamed the chamber using a 6PPC tight neck reamer. I saved about a 1" cut off my barrel and reamed my reamer neck into it. That makes a gauge to use for neck trimming brass later.

We used 220 Russian brass (Lapua) and sized it using 6PPC sizing dies. Gave it a powder charge and cheap 6mm bullet and fire formed the brass.

Then one day I failed to ream my necks enough. Bolt was hard and tight closing and even harder to open and extract. Then it got stuck and I began tapping it with a rubber mallet. Things got ugly and I broke the bolt handle off. Never did manage to braze that bolt handle on right. Thought about asking PTG (Pacific Tool and Gauge) if I sent them the action could they machine a new bolt for me. The rifle has laid in the back of my safe for over 20 years now. My bolt face modified was 0.454". Using the Sako extractor available then from Brownell's was the way to go. Fireforming Russian 220 brass from Lapua was also a good way to go.

I could maybe ream the barrel out to 6mm Remington and just get a new bolt made from PTG.

Ron

 

[Poper]

Any updates?

Not yet.
Ubfortunately, my step-father ended up in the hospital emergency room with an inflamed pancreas and inflamed gall bladder. Immediately thereafter, my mother fell. now I am in the throes of placing my mother in an assisted living unit nearby and my step-father has decided to relocate to an assisted living unit near his daughter in another state 2100 miles away. The logistics of all of this moving, sorting and reorganizing has consumed every minute I have outside of work. And my #1 son will be getting married early in June.

Suddenly, this has turned into a "One of these days..." projects.

 

[horsemen61]

Not yet.
Ubfortunately, my step-father ended up in the hospital emergebcy room with an inflamed pancreas and inflamed gall bladder. Immediately thereafter, my mother fell. now I am in the throes of placing my mother in an assisted living unit nearby and my step-father has decided to relocate to an assisted living unitnear his daughter in another state 2100 miles away. The logistics of all of this moving, sorting and reorganizing has consumed every minute I have outside of work. And my #1 son will be getting married early in June.

Suddenly, this has turned into a "One of these days..." projects.

I am sorry to hear of your troubles I do understand family comes first

 

[Poper]

I am sorry to hear of your troubles I do understand family comes first

Not troubles, really. Just those things that must be addressed that consume time and sometimes money. And, you are correct, they are more important than our hobby!

 

[lightman]

Not yet.
Ubfortunately, my step-father ended up in the hospital emergebcy room with an inflamed pancreas and inflamed gall bladder. Immediately thereafter, my mother fell. now I am in the throes of placing my mother in an assisted living unit nearby and my step-father has decided to relocate to an assisted living unitnear his daughter in another state 2100 miles away. The logistics of all of this moving, sorting and reorganizing has consumed every minute I have outside of work. And my #1 son will be getting married early in June.

Suddenly, this has turned into a "One of these days..." projects.

Wow, it sounds like your wagon is really loaded! Good Luck in all of this!

 

[Poper]

Wow, it sounds like your wagon is really loaded! Good Luck in all of this!

Yeah, well, I left out the part of #2 son has decided to relocate to the PNW. He is the tenant of our rental house. I will have to paint it inside and do some deferred maintenance on it to get it ready to sell. Just what I need!! Another time consuming project!
I am sure it will all work out...
It always does!

Then it is back to the fun stuff..... Guns!

 

[gotboostvr]

Yeah, well, I left out the part of #2 son has decided to relocate to the PNW. He is the tenant of our rental house. I will have to paint it inside and do some deferred maintenance on it to get it ready to sell. Just what I need!! Another time consuming project!
I am sure it will all work out...
It always does!

Then it is back to the fun stuff..... Guns!

Well, now is a good time to be selling a house at least.