81 year old woman shoots intruder, police take her gun.

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gomer

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http://www.al.com/news/press-register/index.ssf?/base/news/1192526279114750.xml&coll=3

Wounded man will be charged with burglary Tuesday, October 16, 2007By SUSAN DAKERStaff Reporter
Ethel Sanders, 81, was startled awake by noise coming from her laundry room on Monday morning, she said. She grabbed her .38-caliber pistol and moved to the porch steps of her shotgun house in north Mobile.

Standing on two bad knees, without the aid of her walker, she opened the door to the laundry room to find a nearly naked intruder, apparently washing his clothes.

"There was a man, well, a boy," Sanders said. "He had all his clothes off. ... I just shot out."

The force of the pistol shot knocked her to the ground. She said she found herself in a puddle of the man's blood.

The man grabbed her pistol, pointed it at her and then snatched his clothes from the washing machine, she said.

As he ran from her home on Edwards Street, Sanders said, a neighbor called police.

About 8 a.m. officers found the nearly naked James Penn, 25, at the nearby Plateau Community Center, said police spokesman Officer Eric Gallichant.

Penn had been struck by a bullet that went through his leg to his stomach. He was taken to University of South Alabama Medical Center, where he was expected to survive, Gallichant said.

When Penn is released from the hospital, he will be charged with first-degree burglary, Gallichant said. The spokesman said that Penn is homeless and had broken into Sanders' home to do his laundry.

This may not be the first time that Penn had been there. Recently, a neighbor saw some clothes drying in the sun on Sanders' fence and asked her about them, she said. "They thought it was my grandson," Sanders said. But it wasn't, she said.
When she went outside to check the clothes, they had vanished.

Sanders said she had seen Penn in her neighborhood previously, walking up and down her street.

Sanders said she knew his mother, who lived around the corner until her death a few of years ago.

"I feel sorry, I got a grandson, I wouldn't want anybody to do him like that but if he went inside someone's house they could," she said.

Sanders said she feels vulnerable in her neighborhood. Her windows are covered with burglar bars because someone once tried breaking into her living room. She said she bought the pistol four or five years ago to protect herself, but had never fired it until Monday.

"Whenever I hear noise, I just go grab my gun," she said. Sanders' husband died in 1982. She still wears her wedding ring but on her index finger.

"I got no help, I do the best I can," she said. "My health's all right except for my knees." Her only child, a daughter, wants Sanders to come stay with her, but Sanders said no.

As long as she's on her own, she feels that the gun is necessary. But police took it Monday as evidence and told her she would get it back when Penn's case is over.

"I need it 'cause I stay here by myself," she said
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In the meantime, there is a hatchet sitting next to her bed.

Poor lady, having to depend on a hatchet now.
 
That is normal procedure, especially since the BG took it from her; it now becomes an element of another crime. That's why you should always have at least two of every gun you own.
 
And if someone does decide to loan her a gun for the time being, please take her to a range and show her how to fire it without falling over! I'm not making fun of her, here, but if she's only ever fired a gun once, and she fell down, clearly she could use some basic training.
 
The Moral of this Story is:

Always shoot the BG with the cheapest and worst weapon you own.

I'm making a butchered Jap T44 bolt gun that I bought for 95 bucks my home defense gun. It shoots. Or maybe a single shot Ithaca .22 that shoots about two feet to the left at 25 yards. i got it for free.

No way I am using any gun I paid more than 100 bucks for. Going to grab the plastic flashlight as well.

Note to self: WWW.aimsurplus.com for those cheap commie pistols
 
That's why you should always have at least two of every gun you own.

Two of every gun I own? That's kind of silly. Do you think they take one of each as a sample? I figured they'd only take the one involved. If I've used every gun I own in a self-defense situation, I'm probably got bigger problems than having them all seized. I could see having a spare home defense gun, but one of each? Why would I possibly need a spare pump action .22?


Always shoot the BG with the cheapest and worst weapon you own.
...
No way I am using any gun I paid more than 100 bucks for

So, you're only willing to lose $100 of property to protect yourself? See, I'm a little different. I'd even use my $1200 AR and risk it being gone forever if it was a choice between my life, my family's lives, or a piece of plastic and metal.

I suppose if I were going to make a habit out of shooting people and having my gun taken, I might want to reconsider it, but that will hopefully never happen, or perhaps only once, I'm willing to gamble an extra couple of hundred dollars.

I would hope that if it every came to that, I wouldn't be trying to remember how much I paid for each gun as I went for one.

Going to grab the plastic flashlight as well.

I suppose you don't eat anything other than ramen noodles since you are just going to flush it down the toilet anyway.

Granted, it is fairly arbitrary to say that one only values their life at a certain amount and that there is some magical amount of cash that, once reached, shows one truly values one's life. It could certainly be said that if I truly valued my life, I would spend $5000 a month to have a private security firm drive by my house several times a night to ensure all was well. However, that's not really the point.

When I look for a gun for defense, price is not a prime consideration. Sure, I have to live within my means, but there are more important considerations for me. Effectiveness, utility, reliability, and so forth all weigh in more heavily than price. I want to have an effective and reliable weapon first and foremost. If I can get it at a great price, that's even better.

But I'm not going to pick a price due to fear of losing it. I suppose that is the difference. I choose to worry about having an effective and reliable weapon more than I choose to worry about what it will cost me if I have to use it. And honestly, if you have to use it, the price of the handgun may well the smallest fraction of the costs you incur. If you have to spend $50,000 in court costs, you probably won't feel the difference between a $100 and a $1000 gun.

By the same token, if you can find a gun for $75 that you trust to get the job done, more power to you. I haven't found that gun.
 
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Better to have an inanimate object taken away for a year or two than be dead. You can always go buy another gun.
 
This poor woman is just doing the best she can. I think she fell down because of some very serious medical issues and would probably fall down again under similar circumstances.

This is a tough one, it's obvious to me that she can't really exert effective force with any other tool, but she failed to use it effectively and I don't know if it's because she just can't physically move any more, or because she didn't know what to do or how.

As for the other issue... elderly person on fixed income, I'm pretty sure the one gun is all she can afford.

And personally I pay for an effective tool for this purpose, not necessarily the cheapest one. My formula is that I figure out what I spend on 6 months car insurance, and try to budget roughly that much less 20%. I see subsequent purchases as increased coverage.

A firearm used for defense of one's person, etc. is like a Dixie cup in the context of its actual intended use. It gets used once and then thrown away to the authorities. If you happen to get it back in a few months or years, great, but for purposes of utility it's effectively the same as throwing it in the lake once the authorities take it away from you.

My guns purchased for defense are throwaways: modern mass produced tools. They're fun to shoot guns sometimes but I can replace them tomorrow if I had to. While I hate to lose any good tool, I have no personal attachment to any of them and value my life more than any of them. I wouldn't relegate something like a classic Colt to this role for instance, unless I was willing to throw it in a lake to save my life. That's honestly why I got into plastic wunderpistols, I wanted something that was an effective tool that wasn't horribly expensive or irreplaceable.
 
.

Maybe the police should have a loaner program for this type of situation.

Basically, if they can take your gun, you don't really own it.
 
Penn is homeless and had broken into Sanders' home to do his laundry.

If I hadn't lived in Spenard for awhile I would think this sort of thing is unusual. I found a guy sleeping on my clothes one time! The worst of all is when they use the laundry room for a toilet. That of course was in a common area, but I'm not sure they knew or cared. If you leave your back door unlocked in certain neighborhoods they'll come in and make themselves at home like feral cats.

The man grabbed her pistol, pointed it at her and then snatched his clothes from the washing machine

The firearm was taken as EVIDENCE. The man grabbed it, so it's absolutely part of their case against him. I'm not sure what else the police could have done here without risking the loss of charges against him.
 
The article says she has weak knees, that is likely why she couldn't stand up after shooting. She was just barely able to stand as it was, a gun recoiling was all it took.

It does illustrate the importance of having an extra gun in case one is needed as evidence...
 
Quote:That's why you should always have at least two of every gun you own.

Two of every gun I own? That's kind of silly

Well, it might be silly to buy two M1's (Of course, then again, probably not) I think the idea being that you never know what gun you might have to rely on for SD/HD. You might buy a Taurus or a used Ruger 9mm for SD, but if you're in the bathroom and the closest gun is your Kimber or your $1500 AR, you're sure as hell going to use whatever's handiest to stop your intruder. I think that's the concept embodied here, though it might be better worded as "You should own two of every gun you own that you might reasonably be expected to use in a SD/HD shooting."

On the other hand, it could just be a good excuse to get more guns into the safe :)
 
Actually it was a great example.

You're assuming everybody can afford to buy two guns. Poor folks might have to scrape for months to buy just one. (especially with "Saturday Night Special" laws making cheap guns unavailable in some areas)
 
Never been to a range. Never fired the pistol. 1 shot 1 hit Maybe NYPD should hire her to teach their people.
I really like this old woman .No need for a hicap pistol, No fancy sights, just a plain old can't do the job 38 spl wheel gun.
 
I'm going to cut to what I feel is the important part - if someone here lives close to this lady how about we pass the hat to replace her self defense weapon ? I will chip in what I can .
 
I hope someone finds it in their heart to loan her a revolver until she gets her gun back from the gestapo.
 
plexreticle, what exactly makes these cops "the gestapo"? As I poitned out, the firearm had been used by the defendant and is quite clearly evidence. They HAVE TO TAKE IT or risk seeing the guy walk on any charges related to threatening her with a firearm or using a firearm in the crime. The law does not allow them to leave such evidence with the woman. It has to be taken and secured, with a clear chain of custody right up to trial.
 
Shotgun House + Mobile = Welcome to the jungle

Anybody that has to live there should be issued a gun, I know cops who don't go down there alone. That said, the poster here who wants to loan a strange woman in the heart of the 'hood... :scrutiny:
 
Saw the video of the interview with the woman. Best line was from her neighbor that they interviewed...

"She's bedridden, but there ain't nothing wrong with her trigger finger" :D
 
Hi ilcylic,

The woman has two bad knees. She wasn't on her walker. Old people on walkers can get knocked over by the wind from a fan. Don't dis on the old lady OK? Under the circumstances one shot one hit is a pretty good average.

Selena (with an 81 year old grandmother on a walker from bad knees)
 
Hi Whited,

Any item that is used in a crime can be seized as evidence to the crime. LEO's must issue a receipt for such items to the rightful owner on demand but the seizure under the terms mentioned in the article were legal. In a stretch they could have seized the washing machine legally.
(Please note the last sentence was sarcasm.)

Selena
 
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