A Real Sorry State

[jjadurbin]

...not sure where to post this item or if it's been posted before ...but I found it chilling. Curious as to anyone's opinion.

https://dailycaller.com/2019/12/20/new-zealand-gun-buy-back-fails/

Many New Zealand gun owners have refused to participate in a mandatory buyback program of military-style semi-automatic weapons implemented after the Christchurch massacre in March.

Despite a penalty of up to five years in prison, up to two-thirds of firearms banned by the legislation were not turned in before the Friday deadline by New Zealand gun owners, the Washington Post reported.

While 47,000 semi-automatic rifles have been collected, according to police statistics, a government commissioned study determined that the small nation likely contains between 56,000 and 170,000 now banned weapons, according to 1 News.

New Zealand’s largest gun rights advocacy group, the Licensed Firearms Owners Council, remarked that the buyback program has been an “unmitigated failure.”

Police Minister Stuart Nash blamed the government’s inability to enforce its buyback scheme on a lack of gun registration. “The problem is we just don’t know exactly how many guns are out in the community, this is why we need a register, to enable Police to better track firearms,” he said, according to 1 News.

On March 15, 2019, a right-wing extremist opened fire on two mosques in Christchurch, New Zealand during Friday prayer, killing 51 worshipers and injuring 49 others. As a result of this terrorist attack, New Zealand’s parliament quickly passed legislation to ban all weapons similar to the ones used by the shooter.

When it was first proposed, New Zealand’s plan to confiscate military-style weapons was praised by members of the American left. Several Democratic presidential candidates, most notably New Jersey Sen. Cory Booker and former Texas Rep. Beto O’Rourke, have been vocal with their support for similar programs.

However, some experts said that the failure of New Zealand’s confiscation efforts bode poorly for similar programs proposed in the United States.

“The great majority of American rifles and handguns are semi automatic. I can’t imagine American gun owners going along with this [buybacks], even to the modest level of compliance that New Zealand seems to have gotten,” Eugene Volokh, a legal scholar from the University of California, told the Post.

The Post also noted how the vast majority of New Zealanders support more gun control, and that the country lacks constitutional protections for the right to bear arms — unlike the U.S.

 

[I6turbo]

MANY millions of dollars spent and they reduced the number of guns in the country from 1,500,000 to 1,450,000. And no doubt, the criminals did NOT turn their guns in.

 

[herrwalther]

Only thing chilling is the left is learning from NZ mistakes. Instead of an outright ban like NZ, most Democrats are still playing fiddle to the "common sense gun control" platform. An outright ban here would be met with similar if not more non compliance and even violence.

Otherwise this is a good story of another country refusing to be disarmed on a political whim.

 

[Walkalong]

Police Minister Stuart Nash blamed the government’s inability to enforce its buyback scheme on a lack of gun registration. “The problem is we just don’t know exactly how many guns are out in the community, this is why we need a register, to enable Police to better track firearms,” he said, according to 1 News.

Sounds like the antis here. Take note.

 

[JeeperCreeper]

I read an article about it, published in another country. In the website, I was reading the comments from non-american citizens.

What was scary was the pure hatred for America and American gun laws, with people spouting off about "nationalism" and "xenophobia" as reasons why Americans love their guns and have gun violence. I found it ironic as they were hating another culture and found theirs superior. Hypocritical much?

I find the article in my search history. As you can see, the writing and comments are very biased.

https://www.thejournal.ie/new-zealand-guns-4944738-Dec2019/

 

[25-20 WCF]

Gee, reading this piece you’d have thought that the buy-back program was a huge success....

https://www.foxnews.com/world/new-zealand-assault-weapon-ban-mosque-attack-collection


.

 

[berettaprofessor]

I read this on Fox, which, interestingly had a different slant...that 50000 guns had been turned in, which was a great success.
https://www.foxnews.com/world/new-zealand-assault-weapon-ban-mosque-attack-collection

Ooops, sorry, 25-20 WCF was faster by seconds

 

[lionking]

I read an article about it, published in another country. In the website, I was reading the comments from non-american citizens.

What was scary was the pure hatred for America and American gun laws, with people spouting off about "nationalism" and "xenophobia" as reasons why Americans love their guns and have gun violence. I found it ironic as they were hating another culture and found theirs superior. Hypocritical much?

I find the article in my search history. As you can see, the writing and comments are very biased.

https://www.thejournal.ie/new-zealand-guns-4944738-Dec2019/

There are Americans who say the same thing about other Americans. Fact is though on any news site that allows comments, most comments are pro gun ownership, Yahoo being a good example. Also, countries like New Zealand have censorship on media, freedom of speech is not protected in many other countries.

However there are many outside the U.S.A that are pro gun ownership they just don't openly say it for various reasons. Factor in the fact that the U.S.A is a massive country with many times the gun owners of other countries and have a documented right to own firearms and this means many of those in the U.S.A are not going to openly submit to registration and confiscation as some have had to do in other places.

This doesn't mean that gun ownership is free and clear here though, some states have come down hard on it, some would try to do that at a national level, their success in doing so well.....that remains to be seen.

 

[FROGO207]

Might be that many owners of the AR's simply removed the gas tube and made them into single shot with MAG rifles. IMHO we need to reverse this anti stuff here this next election. The far left needs a good shellacking this next election for all the things they stand for not just being anti 2A. WE ALL need to become 2A lobbyists. Sick of sitting back and letting them yell and beat us into a corner? Then push back.

 

[LNK]

If we actually made candidates swear to protect the entire bill of rights, all would be good. Best way is to ask them on camera if any rights should be abolished, any wavering and post video to YouTube or 4chan.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

I read an article about it, published in another country. In the website, I was reading the comments from non-american citizens.

What was scary was the pure hatred for America and American gun laws, with people spouting off about "nationalism" and "xenophobia" as reasons why Americans love their guns and have gun violence. I found it ironic as they were hating another culture and found theirs superior. Hypocritical much?

I find the article in my search history. As you can see, the writing and comments are very biased.

https://www.thejournal.ie/new-zealand-guns-4944738-Dec2019/

Keep in mind many anti-American commentors are actually Chinese and Russian trolls and bots. They have entire campuses dedicated to state sponsored misinformation and counter propoganda operations.

 

[Trunk Monkey]

Otherwise this is a good story of another country refusing to be disarmed on a political whim.

It's not a political whim it's a long term plan. They want you disarmed

 

[Spats McGee]

I suspect that many gun owners in the USA, when we heard about the buyback plan, had similar thoughts. Something along the lines of, "Well they're in for an ugly surprise." I think many of us knew that noncompliance was headed their way.

 

[herrwalther]

It's not a political whim it's a long term plan. They want you disarmed

Gun grabbers yes. Political whim of going back and forth between politicians who protect the 2A and those who don't. American government has checks and balances that work better than other countries. A President here cannot issue a top down ban of every semi-automatic in the country by executive order without having judges weigh in or civil lawsuits from 2A groups. A whim in New Zealand is a gun ban. A whim in Canada had universal gun registration that was deemed too expensive to maintain for no discernible benefit, so they axed the program entirely.

 

[94045]

I think this may be the 3rd time posted. Mod will like merge or close this thread.

In reality most items like this actually come down to psychology. People don't actually speak out against others based on deeply held belief but on a "Us vs Them" basis. You have "Normal People" (People who think like us) and Abnormal People (Everyone Else). This is the reason that students with leftist ideas will claim to vehemently support the first amendment and yet protest against a conservative guest speaking on their campus. It is a form of tribalism and common to both sides of the political landscape. Everyone should be free (except people that hold different beliefs from me).

Someone that truly believed in freedom and was anti-gun ownership would give speeches against private gun ownership while defending your right to own them. They would say something like "I would hope no one would choose to own a firearm but everyone should be free to make that choice as tyranny is no choice at all".

 

[Jammersix]

I don't believe anyone has any idea how many gun owners refused to participate.

 

[JohnKSa]

New Zealand’s largest gun rights advocacy group, the Licensed Firearms Owners Council, remarked that the buyback program has been an “unmitigated failure.”

It's not a failure at all. Everyone who didn't turn in a gun is now a criminal. They now own guns they can't use. AND the fact that they didn't turn the guns in means that the government didn't have to shell out money to buy them--the non-compliance actually saved the government money.

The only people hurt are the people who didn't comply. They now own guns they can't use, that they can't sell and they didn't even get the reduced value for them that the government would have given them had they complied and turned in the guns.

It might be a failure if there was some sort of deadline imposed ON the government to get these guns out of private hands. But there isn't. The deadline only applied to the gun owners. The government doesn't care how long it takes to get all those guns. Their goal was accomplished by making the guns contraband and making their owners criminals. They can afford to wait for years, even a lifetime or two to get them all. Even if they never get them all, they still accomplished their goals.

 

[Walkalong]

Only if they, at some time before they end up in jail, get the legislation thrown out and pro gun legislation passed, will it be a failure.

Right now the government is happy to sit back and wait.

Not that I don't think it's great, I do, but it started something they may or may not be able to finish, time will tell.

 

[Speedo66]

"A real sorry state" Oh, I thought you were talking about any of several states here.

Nothing like making thousands of criminals with a stroke of a pen and perhaps radicalizing them at the same time.

 

[theotherwaldo]

Leftists (and many other political and religious groups) apparently believe that anything that makes their opponents look like criminals or supporters of criminals is a good thing.
From their point of view, the failure of this "buy-back" is really a success.

 

[bdickens]

If we actually made candidates swear to protect the entire bill of rights, all would be good. Best way is to ask them on camera if any rights should be abolished, any wavering and post video to YouTube or 4chan.

Believe that if you want.

Politicians only do three things: they lie, they lie and they lie.

 

[Trey Veston]

I read an article about it, published in another country. In the website, I was reading the comments from non-american citizens.

What was scary was the pure hatred for America and American gun laws, with people spouting off about "nationalism" and "xenophobia" as reasons why Americans love their guns and have gun violence. I found it ironic as they were hating another culture and found theirs superior. Hypocritical much?

I find the article in my search history. As you can see, the writing and comments are very biased.

https://www.thejournal.ie/new-zealand-guns-4944738-Dec2019/

I used to post on the largest Christian forum on the internet before I was driven away for posting conservative and pro-American content. It's considered "un-Christian" these days because Jesus was a hard-core woke Socialist, don't you know...

Anyway, there was a gun forum that was constantly trolled by people declaring the desire to protect yourself and your family from criminals was "evil" and that if you carried a gun for self-defense, you weren't a true Christian. Just crazy.

There was one thread in another section in which a young woman from the UK was going to be visiting America for business and was scared because of our proliferation of guns and our gun-culture. She was terrified of seeing guns, even ones carried by law enforcement. Several other posters shared her concern and it was massive piling on about how bad America was.

I did a little research and showed her how she was much more likely to be sexually assaulted and/or robbed in the UK than the US, especially where she was planning on traveling to. I also showed how many other countries had higher rates of violence and sexual assault than the US but had strict gun control.

My post was flagged and I got a warning from a moderator for it being "insensitive and rude". We are losing the war for truth. Even when you can engage a person on a personal level and provide them with the facts, they don't want to hear them and reject them.

 

[Walkalong]

Well, with that, we are done.

We don't do religion, we don't do politics, and we don't do bashing other forums.