A reason for women to really learn how to shoot

[oneounceload]

http://seattle.cbslocal.com/2013/05...e-are-no-cops-to-help-her-due-to-budget-cuts/

An Oregon woman was told by a 911 dispatcher that authorities wouldn’t be able be able to help her as her ex-boyfriend broke into her place because of budget cuts.

“Uh, I don’t have anybody to send out there,” the 911 dispatcher told the woman. “You know, obviously, if he comes inside the residence and assaults you, can you ask him to go away?

SERIOUSLY? A 911 dispatcher tells her this? She couldn't get the state police there?

The woman responded: “Yeah, it doesn’t matter, if he gets in the house I’m done.”

Police say Bellah choked the woman and sexually assaulted her. He was arrested by Oregon State Police following the incident.

She should have shot him.

The police response? - This is classic -(and SO wrong)

The sheriff’s department even put out a press release warning domestic violence victims to “consider relocating to an area with adequate law enforcement services.”

Just reinforces that old adage - When seconds count, law enforcement is only minutes away - except here, it isn't coming at all.

 

[M-Cameron]

the thing is, a lot of people still dont realize the police have no legal obligation to help you....

you can call up 911 being stabbed, and they are well within their rights to tell you to pound sand......

hell, there could be a cop 10' away from you watching you being assaulted.....and he is well within his rights to sit there and watch it happen.

 

[Skribs]

Not specific to women, although maybe the anecdote is. The government is cutting funding all over. Local police are affected, but so is the federal government. With reduced military, we need a deterrent not only to crime, but also to foreign governments.

I'm not even going to go into a rant on how, with less police force, we should ignore victimless crimes, as that's getting a bit off topic for this forum.

M-Cameron posted whilst I was typing (yes I used "whilst" just to sound sophisticated). I remember a video from last year where the pro-gun talk show guest was saying the Supreme Court has ruled the police have no duty to protect a specific citizen, and the anti host said "but their motto is to protect and serve!"

 

[usmarine0352_2005]

.

You left out the fact that because of the budget the police department had let go 23 of its 29 officers as did the other neighboring department (let a majority go) and the cops only work Monday to Friday.
.

 

[CoRoMo]

I don't believe the department's budget necessarily had to be cut, causing them to reduce their force. There were mountains of programs, bureaucracies, and other government departments that consume millions of dollars that could have had their budgets further adjusted so that first responders do not get impacted.

But this will help produce a citizenry that is eager to surrender more of their income to the government that will continue to mismanage it as always. Afterward, when the .gov needs more, they'll just cut back on first responders so that the need can arise again.

 

[Al Thompson]

We start talking about .gov spending and this one will close.

 

[TrickyDick]

I just think that people need to realize that they as a person need to accept the awesome responsibility of owning and operation a firearm. I don't want to force people into something they don't want, but when it comes to protecting themselves and/or family, people need to step up and accept the responsibility of doing so. And as much as they might dislike firearms, it seems to be the most adequate way for a single being to provide protection for multiple people.

 

[MathurinKerbouchard]

Jesus wept.

 

[mljdeckard]

Sorry. We just suck. Why don't you move?

 

[Resist Evil]

As you sow, so shall you reap. Not all efforts to protect oneself from evil will necessarily be successful, but no effort at all guarantees a bad outcome.

 

[Texan Scott]

See, my wife's response would be, "So if he gets in, who's gonna come get his body?"

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The police response? - This is classic -(and SO wrong)


Quote:
The sheriff’s department even put out a press release warning domestic violence victims to “consider relocating to an area with adequate law enforcement services.”

I find the statement refreshingly honest. Basically they are letting folks know that they can't protect them. Would you rather them lie and tell people to be patient and wait for the police to arrive, to not do anything drastic, to not "take the law into their own hands" (I hate that one)?

Budgets are real. We all want the best police protection possible, but folks generally are not happy with any notion of increased taxes to cover the expense of the necessary officers.

As I recall sometime back (2012 or early 2013), there was an IL or WI sheriff that made some sort of comments about people needing to arm themselves because of budget cuts and that his department could not be counted on to get to folks.

SERIOUSLY? A 911 dispatcher tells her this? She couldn't get the state police there?

From the article you cited...

Oregon Public Radio reports that an unidentified woman called 911 during a weekend in August 2012 while Michael Bellah was breaking into her place. Her call was forwarded to Oregon State Police because of lay-offs at the Josephine County Sheriff’s Office only allows the department to be open Monday through Friday.

I have called 911 in several geographical areas over the years. If 911 does not go to the correct department (such as to the nearest rural department), the department handling the call does not have the authority to dispatch units from the other departments or from the state police. They instead transfer the call to the appropriate department/agency. This is what was done there.

 

[M-Cameron]

I just think that people need to realize that they as a person need to accept the awesome responsibility of owning and operation a firearm. I don't want to force people into something they don't want, but when it comes to protecting themselves and/or family, people need to step up and accept the responsibility of doing so. And as much as they might dislike firearms, it seems to be the most adequate way for a single being to provide protection for multiple people.

they dont need to accept the responsibility of owning a firearm.....they just need to accept the responsibility of protect themselves, it doesnt need necessary need to be with a gun.....now obviously a gun is one of the most effective SD tools available.....but if you dont like guns, keep a baseball bat, bear spray, knife, master judo.....hell,anything is better than a cell phone with 911 on speed dial.

 

[swalton1943]

If she had asked " Can I shoot him?" what would be the response?

 

[MedWheeler]

The dispatcher is quoted as saying:

You know, obviously, if he comes inside the residence and assaults you, can you ask him to go away.

Regardless of how she got to be in the situation where she cannot send help to someone in desperate need of it, a better response would have been "..inside the residence and attempts to assault you, you do what you need to."

If EMS dispatchers can coach a layperson through CPR, I think a police dispatcher should at least be able to tell someone to arm herself with "any weapon available and fight."

 

[conw]

1) I agree with DNS: if 80% of the force is laid off, what are the cops supposed to do - a) pretend nothing changed, b) have a bake sale, or c) tell the truth?

2) The following quote is given with zero context. It doesn't even make sense without the statement before it. I won't draw any conclusions about what it meant or why it was said, without context.

“You know, obviously, if he comes inside the residence and assaults you, can you ask him to go away? Do you know if he’s intoxicated or anything?

 

[X-Rap]

I don't know what the proper time frame should be but we really must rid ourselves of this notion that we are entitled to immediate response to any danger in our lives.
Be prepared to defend ourselves and family from fire, crime, sickness. We must regain the idea that we are the first responders and release ourselves from the huge burden of funding the ones we now believe are there to do it.

 

[leadcounsel]

I don't know what the proper time frame should be but we really must rid ourselves of this notion that we are entitled to immediate response to any danger in our lives.
Be prepared to defend ourselves and family from fire, crime, sickness. We must regain the idea that we are the first responders and release ourselves from the huge burden of funding the ones we now believe are there to do it.

well put

 

[Fred Fuller]

Some people choose not to protect themselves. Is this not a choice they are free to make if they wish to do so, for whatever reason? The woman mentioned in the OP most likely had a kitchen drawer full of knives, or a knife block on the counter. There was likely a mop or a broom in the kitchen also. And no doubt any number of other potential improvised weapons available.

This episode, as sad as it is, illuminates in part why I stress MINDSET so much. A person has to see themselves as being worth defending, absolutely first of all. This is a core belief. And some people apparently do not have much of a sense of self worth at all. This is so sad...

 

[beatledog7]

...this notion that we are entitled to immediate response to any danger in our lives...

We are, in point of fact, entitled to this. But "We the People," not some government agency, are the ones who will have to provide it. It's an entitlement to act, not an entitlement to be acted upon.

 

[M-Cameron]

If she had asked " Can I shoot him?" what would be the response?

i remember listening to a 911 call where a woman asked that very question.....

the 911 operator said, " i cant tell you you can shoot him, but you do what you need to to protect yourself"....

then followed by several shots in the background.

 

[Certaindeaf]

"Learning how to shoot" does little without a gun.

 

[TrickyDick]

they dont need to accept the responsibility of owning a firearm.....they just need to accept the responsibility of protect themselves, it doesnt need necessary need to be with a gun.....now obviously a gun is one of the most effective SD tools available.....but if you dont like guns, keep a baseball bat, bear spray, knife, master judo.....hell,anything is better than a cell phone with 911 on speed dial

And as much as they might dislike firearms, it seems to be the most adequate way for a single being to provide protection for multiple people.

The responsibility is there, and whatever they may choose, their tool of choice will show how much they cherish their life.

 

[ASCTLC]

There's a lot of focused blame on budgets there but people need to get their heads out and realize a non-rseponse from LE is possible from a fully staffed force simple because they're all dispatched to a previous and higher priority event. So budgets are a shallow arguement because being one's self first responder, as previously mentioned by many, is a requirement not just a recommendation.

And I'm with Fred on this; some people just refuse to stand up for themselves. Tragic way to think but you just can't make some people care, it's not going to happen.

Andy

 

[Double Naught Spy]

If EMS dispatchers can coach a layperson through CPR, I think a police dispatcher should at least be able to tell someone to arm herself with "any weapon available and fight."

If the person doesn't already know this in their own home, I am not sure that all the help in the world from the dispatchers will help. Even if we didn't own firearms, we have a kitchen loaded with knives, fire extinguishers, sporting equipment, tools (a really nice Estwing rock hammer), fireplace etc. and a bunch of other knickknacks that can be used.

Even without firearms, we would be anything but defenseless. Most homes have a lot of the same things.

There's a lot of focused blame on budgets there but people need to get their heads out and realize a non-rseponse from LE is possible from a fully staffed force simple because they're all dispatched to a previous and higher priority event. So budgets are a shallow arguement because being one's self first responder, as previously mentioned by many, is a requirement not just a recommendation.

True enough. I did a ridealong with my local PD a few years ago, at night. Our town of 85K has 5 patrol zones and at night there is one officer per zone. One officer had stopped a car full of people and needed help (not an emergency call, mind you) and three of the four other units on patrol showed up. We were last and not needed and returned to our area, but that illustrated for me how easily it was that just one thing could happen and the whole city becomes virtually without any sort of reasonable response, not that response was amazingly fast in the first place.