Accurate Loads in 9mm

[Skinnedknuckles]

Just when I thought I had a good load, I seem to have fallen off the accuracy wagon. A 124 gr Berry's Plated HP over 4.6 gr of HP-38 was giving good velocity (1015 fps average) and cycling my new SR9 well. But shooting off a rest at 25' I can't keep 5 shots in 3" with that load. With 2 commercial loads I can group 5 in less than 1-1/4" so I don't think it is me or the gun.

Other loads with that bullet and HP-38 or Silhouette aren't up to the standard of the factory loads I tested but they are better than my "standard". Lighter loads of HP-38 seem more accurate so I'm going to back down a bit and see what I get.

Two questions for those with more experience than I. First, is a round nose or flat point bullet more likely to be accurate that the large Berry's HP? My Silhouette loads with Precision Delta JHP bullets at the same load were a bit more accurate than the Berry. Somewhere I got the idea that a blunt bullet (HP or FP) was inherently more likely to be accurate than a round nose.

Second, does COAL have much effect on accuracy (I know it can affect velocity/pressure) in pistol cartridges as it does in rifles? I'm loading purely for target/plinking but do want something fairly close in recoil/flash/POI to my HD load which is the Federal 124 gr Nyclad HP (which just happened to be the most accurate cartridge I've tested). I haven't done much with COAL but make sure they feed well and don't go below the recommended minimum.

 

[IMtheNRA]

Your experience with Berry's bullets is similar to mine. I found their plated 115-gr RN bullets produce groups about twice the size of Winchester 115-gr FMJ component bullets. Fine for pins or steel, but not when I want to make the smallest groups possible while shooting paper.

 

[LiveLife]

A 124 gr Berry's Plated HP over 4.6 gr of HP-38 was giving good velocity (1015 fps average) and cycling my new SR9 well ... But shooting off a rest at 25' I can't keep 5 shots in 3" with that load. With 2 commercial loads I can group 5 in less than 1-1/4" so I don't think it is me or the gun.

Two questions for those with more experience than I. First, is a round nose or flat point bullet more likely to be accurate that the large Berry's HP?

3" at 25 feet? I averaged slightly larger than 1" shot groups at 10 yards (30 feet) with 124 gr RN and 4.5 gr of W231/HP-38 at 1.135" OAL (see target pictures below). If you are looking for accuracy, your best bet is the Hollow Base RN Thicker Plated bullets (HBRN-TP).

My reference target load has been Winchester 115 gr FMJ with 4.8 gr W231/HP-38 loaded to 1.135" OAL which is comparable to Winchester White Box in performance. Out of Glock 22 with Lone Wolf 40-9 conversion barrel, it produced 1.5-2.5" shot groups at 15 yards (45 feet).

When Berry's released their HBRN-TP bullets, I did some comparison testing on this thread with their regular 124 gr RN flat base bullets along with my reference load of 115 gr FMJ - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=7217193#post7217193

Berry's - 124 gr RN:
4.5 gr 10 Yards - 1.0" average, mild recoil
4.5 gr 15 Yards - 3.5" average, mild recoil

Berry's - 124 gr HBRN-TP:
4.5 gr 10 Yards - 1.5" average, mild recoil
4.5 gr 15 Yards - 2.0" average, mild recoil (double shot on top left)

The most accurate loads were 124 gr HBRN-TP bullets loaded with 3.8 gr of Bullseye and 4.0 gr of Titegroup at 1.135" OAL (Lyman #49 lead load data used for Bullseye since HBRN-TP with longer bearing surface seated the bullet base deeper in the case neck. Targets were shot with G22/LW conversion barrel at 15 yards) - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=7266869#post7266869

Second, does COAL have much effect on accuracy

The longer the OAL, closer the bearing surface of the bullet will be to the start of rifling to reduce the high pressure gas leakage around the bullet. Less gas leakage will lead to faster chamber pressure build up for greater accuracy (due to this reason, most match shooters will use the longest OAL that will reliably feed/chamber in their match pistols).

I usually recommend the barrel drop test to determine the Max OAL that will drop freely into the chamber and spin without hitting the rifling. Then you should function test by manually feeding from the magazine to determine the ideal working OAL that will work with your pistol/barrel/magazine which may be shorter than Max OAL.

I load for multiple pistols of my family/friends/neighbors who may accompany me to the range, so I need to load to the OAL that will work reliably in all these pistols. IME, 115/124/125 gr 9mm FMJ bullets loaded to 1.135" OAL will do that.

 

[tightgroup tiger]

I can tell you from experience that the shorter the OAL in a SR-9 the worse the accuracy will be.
I load at 1.135 OAL in my SR-9 for the best results with Berry's 124gr. I just ordered some RNHB-TP for mine before Christmas but Berry's processing and shipping on an order now is about 3-4 weeks so I won't have them for a while.

 

[918v]

A very mild load of AA#7@50 Feet

 

[918v]

 

[918v]

 

[918v]

These are all with the stock factory loose barrel BTW.

 

[mizer67]

The most accurate cheap-ish load in 9mm I've found across multiple guns is:

124 PD JHP
1.12 OAL
5.0 grains N340
Speer case
CCI 400 SPP

Avg 10-round group @ 25 yards (3 groups):

Glock 17 Gen4 (w/fitted Jarvis barrel): 1.47"

I have to reduce the powder charge and OAL to fit it in my CZ Shadow Custom due to shorter lands, but it shoots 1.32" avg. 10-round groups @ 25 yards with a very similar load @ 4.9 grains and a 1.09" OAL with the rest the same.

 

[J_McLeod]

My reference target load has been Winchester 115 gr FMJ with 4.8 gr W231/HP-38 loaded to 1.135" OAL which is comparable to Winchester White Box in performance. Out of Glock 22 with Lone Wolf 40-9 conversion barrel, it produced 1.5-2.5" shot groups at 15 yards (45 feet).

IME, 115/124/125 gr 9mm FMJ bullets loaded to 1.135" OAL will do that.

I don't shoot 124s, but I use almost the exact same load for my XD9. Montana Gold 115gr FMJ with 4.8gr W231/HP-38 loaded to 1.135" OAL. Only time I use something other than 1.135" is with 95gr bullets.

 

[rfwobbly]

My testing with multiple 124gr Berry bullets showed the HP to be their worst performers. If accuracy is what you want, then try one of their many "hollow base" versions. Those are their target bullets. Even the 115gr hollow base is getting rave reviews.

 

[Skinnedknuckles]

I can tell you from experience that the shorter the OAL in a SR-9 the worse the accuracy will be.
I load at 1.135 OAL in my SR-9 for the best results with Berry's 124gr. I just ordered some RNHB-TP for mine before Christmas but Berry's processing and shipping on an order now is about 3-4 weeks so I won't have them for a while.

Thanks for this tip. When new, I was having issues with weak ejection with my reloads using Silhouette and checking COAL's from Hodgdon's site I saw I was seating the Berry's PHP longer than their recommencations. By shortening the cartridge COAL with both Sihouette and HP-38 I got better ejection so I standardized on 1.085" without doing good accuracy checks.

As the gun has loosened up, I don't have the ejection issues anymore.

Following your suggestion, I loaded up 10 cartridges at 1.125" and 10 at 1.135" after determining that I was just starting to get bullet/land contact at about 1.145" and test cartridges at 1.135" seemed to load without problem. Now to see what the accuracy does and if either has any feeding issues.

 

[MSgtEgress]

If the load WAS accurate and now it isn't, what has changed? Different lot # of powder? Different primers? Have you trimmed the cases lately? The 9mm headspaces on the edge for the cartridge mouth. If the unloaded brass has different oals this could cause problems. Also the bullet seating depth has a greater effect on pressure due to the increase/decrease of case volume. In a 9mm a little change in bullet seating can make big pressure variances.

I know you said you didn't think it is the gun but when is the last time you cleaned the copper fouling out of the barrel? How is the muzzle crown look?

Hope you find the answer

 

[Skinnedknuckles]

If the load WAS accurate and now it isn't, what has changed? Different lot # of powder? Different primers? Have you trimmed the cases lately? The 9mm headspaces on the edge for the cartridge mouth. If the unloaded brass has different oals this could cause problems. Also the bullet seating depth has a greater effect on pressure due to the increase/decrease of case volume. In a 9mm a little change in bullet seating can make big pressure variances.

I know you said you didn't think it is the gun but when is the last time you cleaned the copper fouling out of the barrel? How is the muzzle crown look?

Hope you find the answer

Honestly, I don't know that this load was ever accurate. I was in the process of changing my loads to HP-38 (didn't really like either 700-X or Silhouette) and had done some basic workup when a lot of things changed, primarily because I bought an SR-9 and started to have ejection issues. I focused on proper function in the SR-9 and some chronograph work and things looked OK over the chrony and at steel plates but I hadn't done the accuracy tests. When I got the rest out and shot some groups, I couldn't believe what I was seeing.

The barrel is clean and polished and the crown in undamaged.

I tested some new cartridges today loaded with 4.6 gr and also 4.3 gr of HP-38 at 1.125" and 1.135" COAL, up from the 1.085" COAL that I had been using. It was a small sample, but the 4.6 gr/1.135" was an improvement and the 4.3 gr/1.125" seemed to be the best combination. I saw a few holes that make me suspicious that the bullets aren't awlays stable as the holes weren't round/symmetrical and a couple almost looked like keyholes, but that more likely was the combination of a thin paper target without complete support.