AK in 223 or Mini-14?

[breakingcontact]

Is the AK in 223 as reliable as the 7.62x39 AK? (All else being equal.)
Is the Ruger Mini-14 "AK reliable"? (with good mags of course)

I really like the Saiga/Arsenal AK in 223. But not for the prices they are going for. With the mini, I could get an entirely American made gun for $700 vs around $1000 for the 223 AK.

I want the 223 round. Not in an AR15.

If this goes all AR vs AK...moderators, please shut it down.

 

[TurtlePhish]

Both are very, very reliable with good mags. Get whichever one you like better. If you want American-made, you really aren't losing much, if anything, to the AK.

 

[meanmrmustard]

I'm going to be the first to suggest the Mini 14, for that particular caliber.

Do I think that the Mini is better than an AKM? Hell no!!!

But, the AK was designed around, or in conjunction, with the tapered wall cartridge in mind. That is one of the reliability cues that gives the AK platform it's edge. Ive seen the AK fail with straight walled cartridges, namely 556. I wouldn't have believed it had I not seen it with my own eyes.

The Mini excels with use of the .223, and if that's what you're after I suggest it if not an AR.

 

[Jackal]

Mini 14 by far. Much better quality than the Russian rifles. Be sure to get a 580 series. I have had 2 Mini's (basic blued and stainless factory target) and they are just as accurate as my 2 AR's (1 M4gery, 1 Ultralight). The factory target rifle is good for 1/2 moa, all day, whereas the basic rifle is good for about 1.5-2 moa (maybe better, but I have not tried many loads). Kinda funny story: I was out shooting the target Mini for the first time and after my first 3 rounds, I inspected the target. There was only 1 bullet hole (50 yard sight in). I thought I had 1 hit, 2 off target flyers. Nope. 3 bullets, 1 .224 hole. Scary.

The 580 series is like a different rifle in terms of performance compared to the older series. If Ruger had designed it this way from the start, there would be a lot fewer AR15's floating around.

Remember: Mini vs AK is the same as M14 vs SVT-40. Neither are bad, but one is better.

 

[brunowbe]

I can't speak to the Saiga in .223, but I do have a Mini14 and a Saiga with the 16 inch barrel in 7.62x39.

Comparing the two, they are both reliable and accurate (more accurate than me), but my overall preference is the Mini14. To me, it is a more comfortable rifle to shoulder and shoot, it just feels better (in this aspect, the Saiga regardless of caliber should be comparable).

To be fair though, my Saiga's trigger is not converted yet (that is going to be remedied this winter), so that may or may not tip the balance towards the Saiga.

As to costs, a stock Mini is easily more expensive than a stock Saiga, but if you plan on modifying or converting the Saiga, the costs will about equal out or begin to tip towards the Saiga being more expensive.

 

[johnnydollar]

I've got about $950 tied up in this one: Mini 14 Tactical (.223) in an Archangel Sparta stock with MagPul MBUS sights. No reliabilty issues, and I like the way the rifle handles with the aftermarket stock.

 

[Double Vision]

If that's my choice, I'm picking the Mini all day long.

 

[bozzman3]

A newer model Mini 14 will be way more accurate then any Ak rifle.That includes Arsenals.Both are super reliable so thats a tie.AK has the military look where the Mini looks more civilian.

 

[M1key]

I have both...a 580 mini and a converted Saiga 16 inch. With the best ammo for each they will shoot equally well.


M

 

[MIL-DOT]

I'm a big AK fan, owning or having owned many. I had a stainless 580 series mini, and happily let it go. Even in the "new & improved " 580's, accuracy pretty much sucked ( for what I was led to believe with the new 580's.) Then add ridiculously expensive factory mags ( the only one's you can be sure are reliable), plus the headache of break-down and re-assembly, and ALL AK's blow the mini away.
Another factor that I always consider with all my toys/hobbies, is re-sale potential. Value and ease of re-sale with the mini-14 isn't within a light-year of the AR's and Ak's
I don't necessarilly hate the mini,but I like both the AK and AR way better.

 

[meanmrmustard]

A newer model Mini 14 will be way more accurate then any Ak rifle.That includes Arsenals.

Now, if you said all things being equal, the Mini might group tighter than an Arsenal, you'd be debating. Your statement is flawed.

I'm assuming you've never heard of Tech Sights? They extend the sight radius of the AK platform and improve accuracy greatly. We are talking 1.5 MOA or better. Many opportunities to observe this in video form.

I'd say, based on testimonials, my own experience, and those of folks I know and trust, the Arsenal and Mini are on par in this respect. I would never say "way more accurate" without first weighing variables.

P.S.: also, I may just be picking nits, but your comment on the looks of the guns have been discussed by legislation trying to limit the purchase/ownership/usage of modern sporting arms. If I remember correctly, liberal media also used terms similar to yours ("military looking" and "looks more civilian") to muddy waters. Law enforcement officers acting on behalf of gun owners presented to a board how an AK47 and AKM looked identical. They then took a Mini 14, stripped its wood stock and flush mag, put it into synthetic folding stock with bipod and extended mag, showing the "looks" don't change the inherent design of the rifle. Sporting arms are sporting arms. Please do not feed the Libs.

 

[mberoose]

Tough pick, but I'd probably go with the Mini-14. And I'm an AK fanatic.....but also a Mini-14 owner.

FWIW, I have 1 stock Ruger mag and 5 aftermarket mags (Precision Magazines, USA Magazines) for my Mini-14, and the reliability difference (i.e., unflappable) is indistinguishable. I've had 1 malfunction EVER in thousands of rounds out of my Mini, and it was the ammo's fault (Herter's, just rebadged Wolf)....was one of those underpowered, weak rounds that many of the Ruskie brands have from time to time.

 

[toivo]

I have a 581 series Mini-14 and a Saiga 16" in .223/5.56. They have both been 100% reliable: no jams or failures of any kind. I haven't really compared them in terms of accuracy, but they both have no problem hitting center-mass on a silhouette target at 100 yards.

 

[Swing]

Mini-14. I've run'em for an unbelievable amount of years and, as long as quality mags are used, there is zero concern with reliability.

 

[Walkalong]

Of the two choices, I would pick the Mini-14 if the caliber must be .223.

 

[35 Whelen]

Mini-14. I had a 580 Series and accuracy was HORRIBLE despite bedding, and a host of other modifications. Got a 581 Series and, Ahhh....bliss. Maybe I'm just lucky, but I have one Ruger 20 rd. mag, a ProMag 20 rd. and a no-name 30 rd. Never a single instance of misfeeding, etc. with any of them.

35W

 

[Girodin]

Based on my experience with both, I'd take a converted saiga over a mini every time. You can convert a saiga or perhaps even a Vepr these days and come out around the same price or less than mini.

My 5.56 saiga has proven just as reliable as my 7.62x39s (and even more reliable than one). I wouldn't worry about reliability with either platform (assuming quality mags for each).

 

[Jeremy2171]

I have no love for the Mini-14...

I do however LOVE my Yugo M90/M95s in 5.56. Bought them as kits and built them a few years back.....1/7 chrome bore..

Built one as a folder (they were both folders) then the other as a fixed stock with scope mount.

I enjoy them very much and I have about 6 factory mags I also bought plenty of bulgarian 5.56 mags and use them as my shooting mags.

I have since ditched the railed topcover and use a standard AK mount with the ACOG now.

I swapped stocks and put the Tabuk stock on my Tabuk and was heading out for some grenade launcher practice


With or without irons it will outshoot a mini-14 all day long...

 

[benEzra]

Is the Ruger Mini-14 "AK reliable"? (with good mags of course)

Probably yes, *unless* it gets very hot. By most accounts, mini reliability goes down when they are shot enough to really heat them up and dry them out, like you might in a carbine class. John Farnam has written fair amount on that. My 188-series mini never failed in 2K+ rounds, but I never got it that hot, so I can't speak from personal experience on that either way.

 

[aka108]

I've never had any luck with Rugers. The Mini 30 I owned was horrible in the accuracy dept. I like the simpliciy of the AK platforms.

 

[JustinJ]

My Russian Arsenal AK74 holds 5 shot groups below 2" with military surplus 7N6 ammo. I have no doubt that with match ammo, such as is available to a 5.56 version, it could do significantly better.

Based on accuracy reports i've read i don't believe a stock mini will outshoot a quality AK in 5.56.

Another option, regarding mags, there are adapters available that will allow an AK to accept AR mags.

 

[Jackal]

As an option: You could always get a nice M1 carbine. Like shooting .357's from a Mini 14.

Yes, I like my Mini 14 and my Underwood M1. Simple, reliable, accurate and look/feel like a real rifle.

 

[stubbicatt]

Given your options, I would choose the Arsenal SLR106. I have seen this particular rifle shoot very well indeed. Magazines are available in many places, but K-Var usually has a good selection of modern, Circle 10, mags.

 

[MIL-DOT]

Being kind of a traditionalist, I prefer my AK's in x39. But,if given the choice, I'd still go with the AK in .223.
I had a 580-series stainless mini, and I really didn't dig it too much. Dis-assembly, and especially RE-assembly is a PITA, especially compared to something uber-simple like an AK ( and even an AR.) The factory magazines ( which are all I would recommend you use) are expensive as hell and not that terribly common ( again, compared to AR's and AK's).
Another factor I always consider when buying toys, (from guns to bikes to guitars) is re-sale value. An AK or AR is vastly more tradable or sellable than any Mini-14 is.
Also, even though I had the "new & improved" 580 Mini, I thought accuracy was mediocre, surely nowhere near an AR.
As much as I like Ruger, both the company and their products, I gotta vote AK on this one.

 

[22-rimfire]

I would choose the Mini 14 in that caliber if reliabilty is crucial. They run dirty all day long. Accuracy is another question that you didn't ask. But for me, paper plate accuracy at 100 yds is all I ask or need. I am not going to use one in competition.

I will say that I am not a big fan of the AK platform unless it is in a situation where you are shooting a lot because the Mini's do heat up.