Anyone load Maxam CSB-5 in 9mm/40 cal Pistol

[1SOW]

Does anyone use this powder for pistol?
I never knew about it until today.
Single base powder, wiiiiide load range and 9mm charges with a little less powder weight than SR 7625 or n320,.

 

[1SOW]

This powder is said to be from Spain, and in the past wasn't available in the U.S. Now it appears it is available, but not too many shooters have experience with this in pistol.
RIO uses Maxam for shotgun ammo they sell.

They don't seem to sell 1# bottles, only 8# jugs; so I was hoping someone had some experiece with it in pistols.

 

[rcmodel]

Quite frankly, I never even heard of it until you posted.

rc

 

[49willys]

Where did you get it?

 

[KansasSasquatch]

Besides Maxam's website, the only mention of it I can find is people claiming on other forums that they have bought 55# drums of it straight from the company and selling it in smaller quantities.

http://hi-techammo.com/ has CSB-1 listed for sale in 5lb quantities for $100 plus shipping/hazmat, but that's the only place I can find selling any Maxam powders.
Note***** If you buy any CSB-1 make sure you know what you have. There's also a CSB-1P and the data appears to be different.

 

[1SOW]

It's a very large company in Spain, that has hasn't exported to the US until recently.
It's shotgun powder used by "Rio" ammo and evidently all over Europe. The trap and skeet guys appear to know of it. There's a CSB 2.3,4, &5
More info: http://americanreloading.com/img/Maxam CSB-5 Load Data.JPG

 

[Potatohead]

Nordeste may know something about it, he's from Spain, or at least in Spain i believe, and loads 9mm.

 

[1SOW]

Thanks Tater, I Pm'd him.

 

[Potatohead]

No prob, hope he can help!

 

[16in50calNavalRifle]

I believe Rio is the branding for Maxam products in the US (until now limited to shotgun ammo). Maxam plans to sell components in the US market beginning this year, I think.

And some of their products have already shown up, apparently.

Hi Tech Ammo in MO has 5-lb jugs of CSB-1 (it's listed under "surplus military powder" but is new production). They recommend using Hodgon Universal data for it, and send along a sheet for several loads in 9mm, 45ACP, 357mag, 40S&W and 44mag. This data matches exactly the current Hodgdon website data for Universal.

Loaded my first test rounds today (38spl and 45ACP). Meters very nicely - large, dry non-clumping flakes - in a Lee Auto Disk using the charge bar. I got a jug as back-up reserve if my decent stocks of normal handgun powders are exhausted before the Great Powder Shortage ends.

Good idea to PM Nordeste. (who here would ever have guessed we'd be querying Spanish reloaders for powder info?)

 

[1SOW]

I had a pic of CBS-5 but can't find it. It's not a flake powder.
Here is Maxam's decription:
CBS-5 Caliber Primer Projectile Load (gr.) Powder Load (gr.) Velocity (m/s)
12 G-1000 28 1,4 400
28/65 G-1000 15 0,82 405

Shape: sphere Color: grey Dimension: 1,7 mm. Thickness: 0,3 mm. Density: 490

 

[angus6]

american reloading carrys the csb-5

 

[Nordeste]

Anyone calling me here?

I am in Spain, and I'm from Spain, both are correct . I know Maxam products and I use their Optima A, which is known as CSB-1 also, and as far as I know is to be used according to your Universal powder data, or so I've heard. It's a flake powder, medium burn rate. It could meter better, but with the Lee Auto Disk I get acceptable .1 variances. The load I'm using is 4.5 grains under a copper plated 125 grain TC bullet, HN brand. I get 1050 fps out of my SP01 Shadow. To get the same velocity, I need 4.7 grains in my Star 30M. Looser chamber, I guess, in the 30M. It's a single base powder. Quite versatile. Used for shotgun, 9 mm, .40 S&W, .45 ACP and even rifle reduced loads. I wouldn't call it "clean", though. It's cleaner than the French Vectan BA-9 (which is the only other alternative over here :banghead, but it leaves quite a bit of gunk after a shooting session of, say, 300 rounds. It has a slower cousin called Optima R that can be used for stout 9 mm loads, or for the .38 Super to make major PF. Can't remember which "CSB" or "PSB" denomination corresponds to Optima R, though, but I'll look into it.

That CSB-5 is new to me, but it looks like it's a bit on the faster side, compared with the Optima A/CSB-1. A picture would be greatly appreciated.

Here is a pic I got from the net of Optima A/CSB-1. Tomorrow I'll snap one at my own powder so you can see what the current batches look like. If you get a good deal on any of these, I'd say go ahead.

 

[Potatohead]

And from across the mist he appears...I hereby dub thee our "Spain asset".

 

[Nordeste]

And from across the mist he appears...I hereby dub thee our "Spain asset".

I like that!

Here's a pic of what the Optima A looks like. To me, it looks like a mix between the CSB-1 and CSB-3, although I have to confirm this. Hope it helps. Does it look similar to anything you have available over there?.

Maxam powders:

http://www.shooterspagetx.com/rio/components_powders.htm

 

[1SOW]

Thanks Nordeste.
Our Universal Is very similar in shape but not color. Alliant "Unique" is similar in shape and color. The SIZE is difficult compare without a reference.
You can see some comparisons of our powders I posted here: http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=62199.0

 

[Nordeste]

Good info, there . I would be a much happier man if I only had just half of those to choose from.

 

[1SOW]

Actually, so would we!
Many of those powders are very hard or impossible to find during this period of political chaos. Fires and other problems at some manufacturing plants have also contributed to this problem. Additionally those that ARE available have gone up in price a lot over the last year or two.

Vihtavuori is one favorite for competition use, and it's very scarce. I use n320.
Hope the MaXam options work out for pistol range and competition shooters.

 

[Nordeste]

I feel your pain, man, but... 1/2 kg of Optima A costs 42€ here, and that is slightly over a pound. 1000 primers go up to 45€ (Sellier&Bellot), but still, reloading is worth it as you can tune your loads to your pistol and a box of the cheapest ammo available here (Magtech FMJ) is 12€ . The reason, the law here requires that gunpowder is transported in a way similar to what transporting toxic nuclear waste would be. That makes the price skyrocket. Then, it's only the Vectans and these Maxam products you can choose from. No Vihta, no American powders. That's all and it isn't readily available always. If you know that your LGS has powder, run!. It will run out soon.

 

[1SOW]

I guess our complaining is showing how spoiled we've been. I wouldn't be able to shoot 10% as much as I do now at your prices.

On the CZ forum, a reloader got some of the first Maxam CSB-5 available here and will be working up 9mm 147gr and 124gr bullet loads for his "CZ". I'll watch for the results. If they run well for his minor PF comp. loads, I plan to try some for my 75 Shadow.

I'll pass on what I learn.

 

[MagicD]

CSB-1

Loaded up 50 rounds for .32 H&R mag using CSB-1 at Universal loads....3.0 to 4.0 grains with bullets wts 83 hBWC to 115 SWC ...excellent results especially 90 gr Sierra HP
Powder seemed cleaner than Unique or W231

 

[Nordeste]

Loaded up 50 rounds for .32 H&R mag using CSB-1 at Universal loads....3.0 to 4.0 grains with bullets wts 83 hBWC to 115 SWC ...excellent results especially 90 gr Sierra HP
Powder seemed cleaner than Unique or W231

Does that CSB-1 look similar to the Optima A photo I posted above?. Good to know it has worked well for you .

 

[1SOW]

Nordeste, Optima A is a different color. Here is pic comparing SR 7625 (a small ball powder and an even dark color with CSB-5. This CSB-5 is a uniformly light color and the owner said it was a very light weight powder. "It almost floated into the powder measure and powder scale". He also said that it a uniform size (just under 1mm) particle. The box labelled it as a ball powder, but he said it was more of thicker flake powder.
:

 

[MagicD]

Color of the CSB-1 very similar to your CSB-5

 

[1SOW]

MagicD, If I'm reading the available charts right, the CSB-5 is faster burning than "1,2,3,4". Which showed they got faster as the went nup to #5.
CSB-6 ,7,8,9 looked to go slower burning again.

P.S. I searched for a burn rate chart that included the Maxam powders and couldn't find one: any language, any place. That would be handy for some rough comparisons.