Apples and oranges

[Oldschool shooter]

I know that's what I'm asking. I am looking to buy a 9mm pistol. It will be used almost exclusively as a range gun. My choices are S&W sd9ve and Walther P1, 2 completely different types of pistol. Asking for pros and cons of each, or any other suggestions in the same price range. Thanks.

 

[BlindJustice]

I have no experience or interest in the S&W 9 you mention.

The Walther P1 is the AFAIK post WWII P-38 with an aluminum
alloy frame and should not be fired with +P ammo.

My Range 9x19 is a CZ 75B all steel reliable and uber accurate

R=

 

[beamon]

By contrast, I have no knowledge of the P1, though I have great admiration for Walther and their PPS is my EDC.

That said, I'm giving hard thought to the SD9 VE as a HD and range gun. As you probably know, it is an update to the "Sigma" that had issues with a great number of folk. The SD VE, by comparison, has addressed those issues and is now being praised by the same people that scorned it before. It's a striker fired pistol as opposed to the Sigma and the trigger, by all accounts, is now a short clean break with an easily defined reset, albeit a bit long.

I've got small hands and short fingers which means I have to fondle one, a bit, to see if I can properly reach the trigger. Not a problem on single stacks, but double stacks have to be tried on a case by case basis. If it fits, I'll buy a SD9 VE. Now, to find one!

 

[9mmepiphany]

Your real choices are between:
1. a polymer frame and an alloy one
2. a striker action or a DA/DA one
3. a staggered magazine or a single stack one

Having extensively shot both, I found the Walther both more accurate and more reliable

 

[Jaymo]

I like oranges better than apples.
I like pears better than either.

I don't have a strong opinion on either of your choices.
As far as Tupperware bottom feeders go, I like the Ruger SR9.
As far as steel bottom feeders go, I don't think you can easily beat a CZ75.
I have a 9mm TZ75 and a .45 EAA Witness. Same gun sold by different importers.
Italian made copy of CZ75. Two different calibers. Two different frame sizes.
Both have been excellent.

 

[Oldschool shooter]

I hadn't given the CZ much thought, but maybe I should. It's a little more than I was looking to spend, but the price is doable. I have shot a friends P1 and liked it quite a bit, and have never shot a polymer gun. The few autos that I own are more oldschool than I am, 1903 pocket hammerless, pre-war 1911, and a Colt Challenger from around 1950, all steel guns. Not in a hurry to buy, and willing to look at any other recommendations. I find the level of knowledge and experience here to be extremely helpful and greatly appreciated!

 

[Walt Sherrill]

The S&W will be reliable, but unless you get the trigger worked on, you'll likely not shoot it much. (Or you'll shoot it enough to master the trigger.)

The Walther P1 is OK, but most of the ones I've seen or shot are only so-so in terms of accuracy. They are handsome weapons, and except for the alloy frame, just like the WWII P38. Some have had durability problems.

A USED Ruger SR9, SR9c, P35, or P345 might cost just a bit more than the guns you're looking at, and provide better service and reliability. You can often find used Witness (CZ-pattern guns) in 9mm or .45 for similar prices, and there are bunches of NEW Turkish-made CZ-pattern guns that are apparently quite nice for around $300. I think any of these guns would be better choices uniess you have a particular reason to pick the S&W or P1. I saw a Walther PPX offered by CDNN for $279 in their latest mailing/catalog, and I would buy one of those before picking either of the two you asked about. You have more options than you think in the price range you're looking at.

 

[JTQ]

The S&W will be reliable, but unless you get the trigger worked on, you'll likely not shoot it much. (Or you'll shoot it enough to master the trigger.)

Spot on. Working that trigger requires some effort.

The now out of production Ruger P95 used to sit in the same price range as the S&W gun, and I suspect the new SR9 is close enough, at least in my book.

Ruger SR9 http://www.ruger.com/products/sr9/index.html?r=y

 

[Normandy]

The somewhat weak aluminum frame of the post-war P1 has been addressed on many of the pistols you will find. A steel reinforcing pin through the frame, just above the trigger, makes the frame stronger. Easy to spot, and if you do get a P1, just make sure it has the steel pin.

You might also find some post-war P38s out there, for similar prices.

For sheer pleasure of shooting, my suggestion is the P1/P38.

 

[Kiln]

The SD9VE is just fine. The trigger is a little heavy (around 8 lbs I think) but they're solid guns. My dad just bought one and it's excellent.

 

[jrmiddleton425]

Another vote for the CZ-75. The extra cost is worth every penny. They are scary accurate...like it doesn't make a "group," it makes one big hole.

 

[alientrainwreck]

If you like the older guns and dont want to spend a fortune I would look for a hungarian made Browning highpower clone their well made and are really good shooters as well also not to hard, I forget the model number its something like P9R Hungarian..

 

[bannockburn]

I have tried the trigger on several S&W SD9VE pistols and wasn't all that pleased with it, even more so if you want to use it primarily as a range gun. I have a Manurhin P1 and while the DA trigger is nothing to write home about the SA trigger is very serviceable. Makes for a fun range gun with the added bonus of having some interesting historical perspective to it.

 

[Awsomepossum]

PSA has a sell right now for a 290$ Beretta 92f. Maybe go to the range and try each one out.

 

[Tallball]

I have an SD40VE. It is "meh" to me. It functions reliably, but the trigger is mediocre and I am not crazy about plastic guns in the first place.

 

[Oldschool shooter]

I have heard the complaints about the sd9ve trigger, read somewhere that a new apex trigger spring takes it from 8.5 lbs. down to about 5.5 lbs. locally the p1 is selling for $360 and the S&W for $329, with a spring kit, not much difference. CZ is running about $650 and no local shops have a Hungarian FEG - HiPower clone, for me to check out.

 

[RON in PA]

Look at the Ruger SR9E. Reliable, good trigger, great ergonomics and a great value.

 

[Lucky Derby]

Between those two, I'd go with the Walther.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Owned & shot both. For range use and self-defense, the SD wins hands down. It really no comparison. The SD has higher capacity, a rail, a better trigger, & better ergonomics.

Now, if you wanted the P1 as a collectible, then the P1 wins in that category. The SD will never be a collectible in a couple of lifetimes.

Just went back and re-read some of the posts regarding the trigger. Yes, it is heavier than the P1's SINGLE ACTION mode. However, the SD's trigger consistent. If you learn to shoot it, it will be many times better than the traditional DA/SA P1. Try the DA 1st shot trigger on the P1. Heck of a lot longer and heavier than the SD's.

 

[9 fingers]

I have a P1 and like it a lot and think it is very cool. But a range gun it ain't.
I am not familiar with your other choice, but as mentioned above, their are many other better choices. I have a CZ75b and it is excellent. If $500ish is too much then look to one of the clones. There are some good guns out there for $300 or so. Heck the Walther PPX is available for $279 at CDNN sports. I have not shot one but it has to be a better range gun than a P1.

Here is another one, all steel, good quality, good accuracy and about $320, the Zastava CZ999, kind of a Sig 226 copy.
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/.../products_id/714007829/CENT+ZASTAVA+CZ999+9mm

9 fingers

 

[Walt Sherrill]

RE: CZ-99 and CZ-999...

It's a SIG P226 lookalike, but that's where the similarity ends. It's apparently based on the Walther P88. That's not a negative, necessarily, but it's not SIG COPY or SIG CLONE. It just looks like one.

It may still be a good purchase. I've heard nothing but good things from owners, but I'd be concerned about parts, down the road. That might be true with any gun, however, as even the BIG gunmakers here in the U.S., don't have parts for some of their older guns. Then it's NUMRICH or die.

 

[AustinTX]

If you go with a P1/P38, make certain that you don't get a military surplus gun, which will have a "BW" suffix as part of the serial number. Get a lightly used civilian model. The aluminum alloy in use in these old Walthers is much weaker than today's.

 

[stchman]

I know that's what I'm asking. I am looking to buy a 9mm pistol. It will be used almost exclusively as a range gun. My choices are S&W sd9ve and Walther P1, 2 completely different types of pistol. Asking for pros and cons of each, or any other suggestions in the same price range. Thanks.

The Walther P1 is probably more of a collector's pistol and might command more of a price premium as I believe it is a WWII pistol.

What is your budget for a range plinking pistol?

 

[Walt Sherrill]

The Walther P1 is probably more of a collector's pistol and might command more of a price premium as I believe it is a WWII pistol.

The P1 is a post-WWII pistol, developed by Walther in 1954, originally with steel frames, and then converted to alloy. The German Army used them for a while. Early alloy models had problems, but as noted, later versions were reinforced. It's not likely to be much of a "collectible" gun as long as P-38s can be found -- and does nothing better the the P-38; it is a bit lighter. The P1 is a 75+-year old design -- it was better than the gun it replaced (the Luger, P-08), and that was it's chief virtue for the German Army. Individuals seemed to prefer the FN P-35 (Hi-Power), the factory was captured by Germany, when they had a choice -- that may have due, in part, to the FN's 13 round vs. the P-38's 8 round capacity.

Neither gun is ideal for "fun" plinking, but the S&W, with some gunsmithing, is both a serviceable weapon and likely to stand up to long-term use. It is a more modern design, originall based on the Glock design. (S&W was taken to court by Glock, lost, and had to change some internal features for patent infringements.)

If you can get the trigger worked on, you may find it a fine gun; if you can't (or don't) you can LEARN to shoot it well.

YOU CAME HERE FOR ADVICE, BUT YOU SEEM TO BE IGNORING AN IMPORTANT MESSAGE: YOU ARE NOT LIMITED TO THOSE TWO GUNS. THERE ARE BETTER CHOICES IN THE SAME PRICE RANGE.

But if you're determined to get one of those two, I'd get the S&W. Then, after a while, I'd have either S&W or a local gunsmith work on improving the trigger. Folks who have sent theirs back to S&W (shipping can be costly) are very pleased with the results.

 

[mgmorden]

I own a Walther P1 and a SD40VE (same gun you're looking at but in .40S&W).

To be honest, I'm pretty "meh" on both. The Walther is single stack, has the heeled mag release, and for me, shoots very, very low. There's not a lot of holster choice as far as modern kydex holsters go.

The S&W is a much more modern gun, however the rear sight is plastic. I can deal with polymer frames and guide rods, but I like steel sights. The gun also has a really long and heavy trigger pull. Not as bad as the original Sigma, but still pretty bad. In the .40 the mags also rattle when loaded to full capacity. Not sure if that's an issue with the 9mm though.

All in all, I think the SD is the better choice of the two. It has its shortcomings, but a set of Warren sights and an Apex trigger and it becomes a lot better. The Walther P1 is basically stuck being a clunky older design.

Truthfully though, if I were you I'd instead look towards the Ruger 9E. IMHO its a much better gun than the SD for about the same money.