Arisaka rechamber of a rechamber

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338reddog

338reddog

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I had a Arisaka given to me. I wouldnt normally think about doing anthing with the gun, however someone had put alot of money and work into it. It has a high grade piece of walnut nicey finished with nice checkering a sliding safety. I havent done a chamber cast yet but a 30-06 fits the chamber, so I know its been rechambered. I dont know if its a original jap barrel or a military 06 barrel.
Assuming its a 7.7/06 are there any caliber recommendations that would be large enough to clean up the 7.7 oversized 06 chamber?
Or am I better off having a new barrel fit?
Jeff
 
there are not really any worth it that are bigger if it is a 7.7-06. u can get a e.r. shaw barrel that is short chambered for about 150 to 200 bucks. if u can post some photos of the rifle. have u taken it out of the wood?. any marking
 
338reddog said:
I had a Arisaka given to me. I wouldnt normally think about doing anthing with the gun, however someone had put alot of money and work into it. It has a high grade piece of walnut nicey finished with nice checkering a sliding safety. I havent done a chamber cast yet but a 30-06 fits the chamber, so I know its been rechambered. I dont know if its a original jap barrel or a military 06 barrel.
Assuming its a 7.7/06 are there any caliber recommendations that would be large enough to clean up the 7.7 oversized 06 chamber?
Or am I better off having a new barrel fit?
Jeff
Click to expand...

Some of these rechambers were actually done during the Korean War by the U.S. Army in Japan to outfit South Korean soldiers. These exhibited various problems in firing including poor accuracy and swelling the rear part of the .30-06 case as the Arisaka 7.7 chambers tended to be generous at the rear. If you do the bullet test at the bore end and it swallows the .30-06 bullet then rebarrel it or use a .311 bullet in your reloads for it. Be sure that you don't mix those up with regular .30-06 ammo for other guns though. The Japanese Arisaka used Metford rifling in these that causes issues when an undersized bullet is fired thus the poor accuracy. I know that THR poster Loonwulf has sporterized several of these and might provide some good solutions.

From castboolits forum complete thread http://castboolits.gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-174055.html
Madsenshooter,
"The South Koreans coincidentally used some type 99s that were rechambered to 30-06. Some of these conversions, I've read, were done by US armorers.

During the Korean War, approximately 126,500 short and 6650 long Type 99 Rifles were re-chambered under American supervision at the Tokyo arsenal to fire the then-standard .30-06 Springfield cartridge. "Apparently" intended for the South Korean gendarmerie, few rifles appear to have been issued at the end of the war in 1953. These rifles were fitted with a lengthened magazine well and had a small notch cut in the top of the receiver to accommodate the .30-06 round's 1/3 inch greater length.[3] Accuracy suffered, due to the difference in cartridges, rifling rate and characteristics, but they were nonetheless functional. Conversions to both .30-06 and 7.62 NATO have also been performed by civilians, often along with sporterising modifications.

http://www.forgottenweapons.com/wp-content/uploads/manuals/US Arisaka manual.pdf "
 
I have stuck a bullet in the end using a .308. It did not get swallowed up. However im not sure if the .003 would be noticiable? I also called shaw today, to make sure they would do a new barrel on a Arisaka. I have a friend with a couple of blanks for a Arisakas I may have to see if we can make a deal. I dont want to put more into it than its worth. It probably will happen though. My mum is still intact
Thank you for taking the time to respond
 
338reddog said:
I also called shaw today, to make sure they would do a new barrel on a Arisaka. I have a friend with a couple of blanks for a Arisakas I may have to see if we can make a deal. I dont want to put more into it than its worth. It probably will happen though.
Click to expand...
Not to try and dissuade you, but you WILL spend more than it's worth in a monetary sense.
I've got 2 Ari's I've built into sporters. One was basically done it just need a scope mount installed, the other I bought as project, but basically ended up replacing everything around the receiver.
Here's the thread that followed that one
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/new-arisaka-project.813038/
Let's see some pics of your rifle if you have them. It's possible your barrels already been changed to a aftermarket one.
 
no remember the cal size goes by grove size not bore. a 30 cal could have a .300 bore or less cant remember of the top of my head. if u have a caliper find a 00 buck shot and tap it in the bore some on need to slug the hole barrel just to check if its a 30 or a 303. a wax crayon will work to
 
338reddog said:
View attachment 804332 View attachment 804333 View attachment 804334 View attachment 804335 So Not as nice of wood as I remembered. But I like it. Just tired of it hiding in the back of the safe
Click to expand...

It is gorgeous compared to the Arisaka issue stock. Bolt nicely done on the conversion and I think that you may have the original barrel--is it chrome lined and the rifling looks worn? Then it is original. Metford rifling appears shallow and it is. The Brits started using it during the blackpowder years to reduce fouling effects in the barrel. They discarded it when the No. 1 rifle came out. Never heard why the Japanese used them except they had high admiration for the British.

The Japanese later in the war also used non-chromed bores. If they did not scrub the kanji script on the left side of the receiver, you can use the type 99 datasheet found at the link to decipher when and where it was made.
http://www.castle-thunder.com/datas.htm
 
that stock is actually very nice, as is the work done...whom ever did that rifle was no amature.
The trigger and saftey are of a type ive never seen before, id almost be inlined to say they are a retro fit from another rifle. Id actually like to see that gun out of its stock!

The barrel appears to be military issue, with the sight sleeve left in place, or a new one made to cover the holes.
Thus it SHOULD take a .31+dia bullet, making it a 31-06.
NOW heres the issue with that, the rear of almost EVERY .30-06 case ive found has measured .466-468 at the head, the 7.7 measures .473.Unless the barrel is set back, reaming a 7.7x58 to 06 leaves the case head room to expand.
Dosent mean you cant still shoot the rifle, just that cases wont last as long, and you cant push pressure up to equal a fully reamed 31-06.
I dont belive that barrel has been set back, just because the shoulder on them is quite short, and it would be very obvious if even one turn was taken off.

I have a spare 7.7x58 barrel thats in OK shape that you can have if you want it.

I would personally probably have ERshaw install a new tube in the rifle, and if you wanted to scope it have them D&T at the same time.
 
Oh, i forgot to mention i still very much recommend that you have a chamber cast done, and the bore slugged if you have any intention of shooting the gun as is. While its most likely an 31-06 if the 06 case fits, you dont KNOW that for sure unless you cast it. You also dont KNOW that the bore isnt a .308, as someone MIGHT have taken the effort to turn down a sporter barrel to match the military contour...actually a picture of the muzzle would help with identifying the barrel as well.
 
troy fairweather said:
u ever see that 6.5 the NRA had someone cambered it to 06 and killed a few deer with it. the bullets where like 2 inches long by time they came out the barrel lol. show how strong the japs are.
Click to expand...
I havent seen any actual pictures of that rifle, or the bullets, ive heard the story a few times tho.
I cant remember if it was Tark, or BoomBoom who pointed it out, but the t38s have unusually large lugs and dont have the split clean thru the left one.
Rechambering the 6.5x50 to .30-06 wouldnt leave the rear of the case unsuported either the rim of the x50 is the same size as the rim/case heads of the 06 cases ive seen.

My t99s, in 6-284, and 6.5-284, have had no issues handling the increased bolt thrust from the larger .501 dia case head. I actually had a high enough over pressure loading in my 6-284 to stretch pockets on the first firing so much primers fell out, made a quickloads error on that one.

If Herters sold just the saftey, that could be what it is, ive never actually seen one of those. The trigger could be a reprofiled military unit, i did something similar with my 6.5x284 Ari
 
LoonWulf said:
I havent seen any actual pictures of that rifle, or the bullets, ive heard the story a few times tho.
I cant remember if it was Tark, or BoomBoom who pointed it out, but the t38s have unusually large lugs and dont have the split clean thru the left one.
Rechambering the 6.5x50 to .30-06 wouldnt leave the rear of the case unsuported either the rim of the x50 is the same size as the rim/case heads of the 06 cases ive seen.

My t99s, in 6-284, and 6.5-284, have had no issues handling the increased bolt thrust from the larger .501 dia case head. I actually had a high enough over pressure loading in my 6-284 to stretch pockets on the first firing so much primers fell out, made a quickloads error on that one.

If Herters sold just the saftey, that could be what it is, ive never actually seen one of those. The trigger could be a reprofiled military unit, i did something similar with my 6.5x284 Ari
Click to expand...
they had a wright up on the gun with photos. they re-dosed the load and shot it in to water barrels until they got a good bullet. most of the lead came out the tip and formed to the bore. for me the hard thing to be leave is that someone new how to chamber it but did not no the bore size.
 
troy fairweather said:
they had a wright up on the gun with photos. they re-dosed the load and shot it in to water barrels until they got a good bullet. most of the lead came out the tip and formed to the bore. for me the hard thing to be leave is that someone new how to chamber it but did not no the bore size.
Click to expand...
In all likelihood the rechamber...er? Probably thought it was a t-99 and never even checked. The bolt face would probably have worked with no modification, and if they didn't modify the magazine (or possibly even if they did) they wouldn't have known there was any other issue.

Or possibly it was just a dummy with a reamer and a box of shells, that's is what I THINK Happened to my rifle in the thread I linked.

I doubt reddogs rifle will have an issue like that, considering the rest of the work done is much more in-depth than just running a reamer in.
The over sized rear of the chamber is likely tho.
 
The barrel is sans sights. I was told when he gave it to me it was a ? Nixon. A Magnum cut down case with Bullet was also given to me. It would not go into the chamber and of course a7.7 wouldn’t extract. A 30/06 did.
I’m going to need to order some cerrosafe. I also need to heat and bend the bolt upward just a bit. It slightly interferes with my trigger finger.
Jeff
 
338reddog said:
The barrel is sans sights. I was told when he gave it to me it was a ? Nixon. A Magnum cut down case with Bullet was also given to me. It would not go into the chamber and of course a7.7 wouldn’t extract. A 30/06 did.
I’m going to need to order some cerrosafe. I also need to heat and bend the bolt upward just a bit. It slightly interferes with my trigger finger.
Jeff
Click to expand...
Considering that info, I'm really not sure what your guns chambered for. It now sounds like it's very possible that the barrel was reprofiled to match the stock. That would likely make in a true 30-06.
Again a chamber case, and a bore slugging will tell you that for sure.


It's funny the turned down bolt on my more original Ari sporter hits my trigger finger too. I put a bunch of dings in it bending it back out a bit........need to clean that up.....
 
I need to see if a 7.7 case will fit in a commercial 06. If it won’t, I can bet it is a 7.7 barrel
 
338reddog said:
I need to see if a 7.7 case will fit in a commercial 06. If it won’t, I can bet it is a 7.7 barrel
Click to expand...
I'd never thought to try that....so I just did.

In my 30-06 b-14, the bolt will close on a brand new 7.7 case, but won't even come close on a fired case.
Here are some other pictures of measuments I just took.


Unfired 7.7 case nearly all the way into the 06 chamber.
IMG_20180922_123323186-2004x2672.jpg
7.7 Fired case
IMG_20180922_123844805-2004x2672.jpg
30-06 Fired case
IMG_20180922_123910175-2004x2672.jpg
The shiny line is where the fired 7.7 hung up in the 06 chamber
IMG_20180922_124412618-2004x2672.jpg
Bolt not closed on fired 7.7 case
IMG_20180922_124207699-2004x2672.jpg

.308 Speer bullet in 30-06 muzzle
IMG_20180922_124114601-2004x2672.jpg
.308 speer bullet in take of 7.7 muzzle
IMG_20180922_124133358-2004x2672.jpg
 
Difference in depth that the 06 and 7.7 cases will go into the 7.7 BACKWARDS.

The rim on the 7.7 measures .473, and the 06 .464, so using them like a pin gauge, you can see how far forward the larger dia of the chamber goes.

IMG_20180922_123951633-2004x2672.jpg IMG_20180922_123928276-2004x2672.jpg
 
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