ASM Walker quality

[denster]

You are welcome Junkman. There is a corresponding article on the 3rd Gen also if I can find the link I'll post that also.

 

[Little Red]

Mykeal,
Quote:
"Originally Posted by Little Red
it was Uberti who supplied the parts for Colt's continuation series

As to Uberti, they made rough casting parts which Colt's Manufacturing Company finished and assembled, with other Colt manufactured parts, into the Second Generation Colt bp revolvers. "



This is a little picky, eh? I mean common, it was a matter of final finish and the man hours it took, not that they got some rough cast items. The barrel, the cylinder, they were not cast. The overall parts just were not that much different. Colt may have finished the item with 1000 grit when Uberit used 400. Thats what I do and the finish looks like glass in person, my photos do not do the finish justice.

 

[junkman_01]

Didn't you guys bother to read this article? http://www.gunsandammo.com/content/cap--ball-resurrection

Colt INSPECTED and DISTRIBUTED these guns Lou Imperato assembled and finished them. I though denster cleared this up already?

 

[denster]

Actually Colt didn't manufacture or finish any of the F series 2nd Gen. That was done by Lou Imperato's firm the Old Iver Johnson Co. They were delivered to Colt for final inspection. The 3rd Gens were also done by Imperato, with permission from Colt, but did not pass through the Colt factory. All of this was probably a good thing as the 2nd Gens were being made at a time when Colt was really turning out some nasty examples of the SAA.

 

[denster]

Looks like we posted at the same time Junkman.

 

[mykeal]

Actually, Adler is the one who 'cleared this all up' several years ago with his book, referenced at the end of the article. It was published originally in January of 2002. See also Colt Blackpowder Reproductions & Replicas: A Collector's & Shooter's Guide, 1998.

I did read those articles, back then. Perhaps my memory is a bit foggy on the details of Adler's language from 8 years ago.

I would suggest that whether or not the guns were assembled on Colt's property by Colt's Manufacturing Company direct salary or hourly employees, it's pretty much standard practice to consider items made under license to be considered products of the license supplier; certainly Colt's Manufacturing Company takes that view when they provide letters of origin for both the C and F Series Second Generation black powder guns.

Thanks to denster for the link to the Guns & Ammo article.

 

[denster]

No problem Mykeal. All of the F series were made under Colt liscence and inspected by Colt. The frames, arbor , and all internals were US made and the finished product inspected and approved by Colt prior to shipment, which is why of course Colt will authenticate these as Colt products. Even the case colors were using the Colt methodology. They are Colts. Just better than Colt would likely have made them in house at that time.

 

[Little Red]

Now see, if Colt built them from the ground up I would say they were at least worth aurguing as being authentic, but just looking over the process and giving the final Okay, well that was done for one purpose only, the mighty $. That 2nd or 3rd generation is no more authentic than a Peitta or Uberti that has been gone over and given a better finish. Even the Colt Co as it was is not the same. And Iver Johnson was not the king of quality either.

I mean if you want to, go ahead, call it authentic. Me, my 1858 Pocket police built in 1862 is authentic. If remington decided to make a copy via any other company with their Okay or oversight, I would just have to pass. But that is just me and I ain't nobody in particular, just someone who spends his $ wisely.

 

[denster]

Everybody is entitled to their opinion. As to Iver Johnson. Imperato acquired IJ, which was defunct, just prior to doing the work for Colt. The quality is not in the name, although some may believe that, it's in the attention to detail of the people preforming the work. You only need to examine a 2nd Gen F series to get the idea. In this same time frame I owned three SAA and a couple of 1911s that were let's say less than stellar.

 

[denster]

Finally found it. This is a link to a pdf file from Adler's book. It details the complete history of the C & F series as well as the 3rd Gen Signature series. A long read but all the info you could want.
http://store.bluebookinc.com/Info/PDF/POWDER/MBPHistoryOfColtBlack.pdf

 

[junkman_01]

denster,

You are the man. This last link is great. You have made my day! Thank you.

 

[denster]

You are most welcome sir.

 

[Little Red]

Boy, did this take a long side path from how is the quality of a ASM walker. Oh well. Denster, what part of Ohio are you in and where do you shoot?

 

[Pulp]

While not a Walker, I've had an 1860 Army made by ASM since '98. It's been to every CAS match I've been to since 2000, when I joined SASS. I've put a lot of balls through this gun, with maximum loads, and it's never failed me. Maybe I just got lucky and got a good one, I don't know. But I wouldn't hesitate to buy another one.

 

[denster]

LittleRed: Kenton, Oh, Ft. McArthur Longrifles

 

[Foto Joe]

I own a 2nd Dragoon and a Walker, both of ASM origin.

I bought the Dragoon first and I must say, it's beautifully done. Varnished maple grip, and the fit and finish are above par. Without looking I think it's a 1977 or there abouts.

The Walker on the other hand is a different story (1992 I think without looking). I didn't hesitate on buying the Walker sight unseen on GB, but I would the next time.

The grip finish is good but that's about it. If it weren't for other problems I'd have the grip replaced for $125 with a custom one made here in Cody. The hand spring likes to leave home without notice probably caused by too much end play on the cylinder at the breech. Overall it's left a bad taste in my mouth regarding ASM Walkers.

I think it's all in when they were made.

 

[bprevolver]

Definitive Book on 2nd & 3rd Generation Colt Percussion Revolvers

Adler's book is nice for great pictures of different revolvers but is not accurate in many place. There is only one book that I am aware of that is the "encylopedia" of the 2nd and 3rd Generation Colt Percussion revolvers. It even covers all the accessories that were produced as well a the history of the revolvers and all their variations. That book is, "Percussion Colt Revolvers, The Second Generation, Collector's Handbook & Price Guide", by Dennis Russell.

 

[mykeal]

bprevolver: I agree that Russell's book is definitive. However, Adler's Guns & Ammo article is accurate, I believe, and was taken from the Blue Book referenced in the article.

 

[Tuckerp229]

As stated, that is false.

ASM did manufacture some Colt revolvers using Second Generation parts as a proposal to Colt to manufacture them under license. They were marked as authentic Colt guns and were sold to the public. Colt denied ASM's license application and sued ASM to stop making the guns, which they did.

You have either misunderstood what the gunsmith told you, or he is mistaken and making false statements

I have no skin in this assertion. I also had no reason to doubt the source so I didn't hit snopes or do any research.

If your are certain, I am good with that.

 

[Gaucho Gringo]

My ASM Walker was made in 1974. A monster of a revolver. Mechanically it is pretty good but the grips fit leaves something to be desired. The gun was imported by JANO of Denver, Colorado. I have never heard of them and haven't been able to find out anything about them.