Attempted Carjacking In Atlanta?

[Fred Fuller]

Note the actions of the intended victim upon arrival of LE.
===============================

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgLV6PkSnCg

Man holds would be carjacker at gunpoint until police arrive - "did you wake up Stupid?"

Published on May 22, 2015

TLANTA — An East Point man held a would-be carjacker at gunpoint until police arrived and arrested the suspect, according to Atlanta police.

Hashim Fannin, the car owner, says the attempted carjacking occurred just after he had pulled into a parking spot at the Family Dollar on Marietta Boulevard in northwest Atlanta earlier this month.

Fannin says the man slipped into the passenger’s seat when his doors automatically unlocked.

“He told me, ‘You know what this is,’” Fannin said. That is when Fannin says he pulled his gun out.

“I asked him to get out the car, probably not in those exact words,” Fannin said.

“I told him no, there’s no leaving, leaving was before you hopped into my car ... at this point there is not leaving,” Fannin said.

The car owner kept the suspect, Edgar Horn, 61, at gunpoint face down in the parking lot for several minutes until police arrived.

“You were not trying to rob me,” Fannin said to the man on cellphone video of the incident. “Do you just get into random people's cars ... you thought I was your friend … you thought I was your friend ... so you woke up stupid this morning?”

When police arrived, you can see Fannin wave them over, and put his gun down. The police officer shakes his hand, before putting the suspect in handcuffs.

“Honestly, I look at it like this. That is one less guy I got to worry about bothering my mom when she’s out grocery shopping,” Fannin said.

According to a police report, the suspect was arrested for attempted robbery and entering an automobile.

 

[BLB68]

Two other good things I noticed: Good trigger discipline, and he proned out the subject. Whether holding someone is a good idea or not may be debatable, at least he did a fair job of it.

One negative: He was entirely too chatty with the guy, which is a distraction.

 

[HexHead]

I'm half surprised he didn't get charged with brandishing.

 

[RustyShackelford]

chit chat ....

To "prone out" a thug or robber isn't a bad idea. It let's you monitor the subject(s) hands & feet. Depending on the conditions & location, I'd talk the subject down into facing away from me with hands & legs spread out, fingers spread palms up. I'd order the subject to either turn away from me or put their face down.
This is safe for you or any by-standers/witnesses. The LE officers or maybe security staff who come on scene will have a clearer idea of who did what or who's the bad guy/gal. I wouldn't move near or around the subject. I'd also keep scan for more threats or "seeded" back up.
You can not predict people's behavior or conduct in high stress events either.
Once, doing security work in a hotel, I had a confrontation with a amped up EDP(emotional disturb person). It was quickly going from bad to worse, when a tourist, oblivious to what was going on directly in front of them came up & asked me for directions . Some people are so vapid or ignorant they can make a situation like that even worse.
I agree that the armed citizen shouldn't of spoke to the robber. It's not a sin but to be mature, calm & focused looks better in court.

 

[BLB68]

I agree that the armed citizen shouldn't of spoke to the robber. It's not a sin but to be mature, calm & focused looks better in court.

IMO, the issue is more one of awareness. If the guy had a partner, the talk could serve as a good distraction.

 

[RustyShackelford]

I disagree ....

I disagree.
Here's why;
When you are in a critical incident you(or anyone else) will have significant physical & physiology changes. Your adrenaline will be pumped up, you may have tunnel vision or feel-think things like time/space are way off.
Talking to or engaging a detained subject would not be prudent. You might start screaming at him or her, then use profanity or insults. Passers-by or crowds that gather will later tell the media or investigators: that mean man kept threatening the unarmed man, he had his hands up yo, dat ain't right.
They(the crowds or by standers) may not see or hear all the event. CCTVs or security cameras might document the shooting scene but talking to or conversing with a subject may cause more problems for you later on.
If the subject yells or pleas, just ignore it & wait for the PD.
Doing security work I've caught or detained many crooks-criminals. Some plea for passers by to help, some yell threats, some fake injuries or ask for EMTs, some even cry or beg for mercy. You never know what a street thug will or won't do. Do not assume or get compliant. A docile or co-operative crook could snap & attack you too.

 

[bikerdoc]

He acted ok. More angry than chatty. If the perp had decided to up and run not much he could do about it. By intimidating him with trash talk he maintained control of the situation.

 

[old lady new shooter]

"the man slipped into the passenger’s seat when his doors automatically unlocked"

Dumb car design. On my Volvo, only the driver's door opens when you turn the key. If you want to open all the doors (and the trunk) you have to turn it twice. Great safety feature IMO.

 

[RustyShackelford]

GM Impalas ...

I was in a newer model GM Impala, a rental, a few years back(late 2000s). I noticed the sedan only had a keyhole on the driver's side, .
It also seemed the doors-locks-windows could only be accessed from the driver's side.
This seemed like a safety feature, anti theft system and/or some brilliant idea by a GM civil liability lawyer.
I guess GM tested or had 100s of customer requests for these security features.

The important point is to be aware of your vehicle's door locks, windows, latches, etc. Many car owners are unaware you can now open a vehicle trunk from inside now. This was added by many car companies after a increase in car jackings/kidnap events.

A common but important security tip too is to glance around the vehicle or look in the rear-back before you enter it to make sure no thug or felon is hiding.

It may sound far-fetched but doing apt complex security work at night, I once caught a strange guy ducking down behind cars in a parking lot.

 

[BLB68]

I disagree.
Here's why;
When you are in a critical incident you(or anyone else) will have significant physical & physiology changes. Your adrenaline will be pumped up, you may have tunnel vision or feel-think things like time/space are way off.

Which supports my point about maintaining situational awareness and not being distracted from a possible second subject.

Talking to or engaging a detained subject would not be prudent.

On this, we agree.

You might start screaming at him or her, then use profanity or insults. Passers-by or crowds that gather will later tell the media or investigators: that mean man kept threatening the unarmed man, he had his hands up yo, dat ain't right.
They(the crowds or by standers) may not see or hear all the event. CCTVs or security cameras might document the shooting scene but talking to or conversing with a subject may cause more problems for you later on.

These problems aren't nearly as bad as getting injured or killed because you're focusing on the subject and not maintaining situational awareness.

If the subject yells or pleas, just ignore it & wait for the PD.

Sure.

Doing security work I've caught or detained many crooks-criminals. Some plea for passers by to help, some yell threats, some fake injuries or ask for EMTs, some even cry or beg for mercy. You never know what a street thug will or won't do. Do not assume or get compliant. A docile or co-operative crook could snap & attack you too.

Sure. Which is why it's not a good idea to detain people if you haven't got any training in doing it. If you've not got them proned out properly and you aren't maintaining awareness of your surroundings, you can end up in trouble fast. The guy in the video did OK on the proning out (but not perfect), but didn't maintain situational awareness. The person on the phone may count as a second set of eyes, which is good, but they were focused on recording, which detracts from their value a bit.

Overall, the guy did OK, though.

 

[BLB68]

He acted ok. More angry than chatty. If the perp had decided to up and run not much he could do about it. By intimidating him with trash talk he maintained control of the situation.

A simple "Shut the f* up," would serve the same purpose and take less time.

 

[Slamfire]

Hashim Fannin did good, he captured the bad guy and did not get shot by the Cops.

Based on my thousands of hours studying past cultures through vast film archives, prior to the 60's it was easy to tell the good guys from the bad guys: good guys wore white hats and bad guys wore black hats. People today no longer follow the traditions of the past, so Policemen have greater difficultly telling just who exactly is the good guy. So, Mr Fannin did good, he survived an incident with a crook, and the cops.

 

[RustyShackelford]

detained subjects, 911 call takers/DV ...

I'm not quite sure of the intent or tone of some of the recent responses.
I agree that detaining or holding subjects at gunpoint or in a critical incident can be tricky.
This underscores the importance of CCW holders taking courses or reviewing educational materials(books, videos, webinars, etc) re: tactics/threat mgmt.
I'm fortunate to have a DV simulator with a 270 degree screen/training system near my metro area. It permits armed citizens or CCW holders the chance to practice how & what to do.

I'd add to this topic too that calling 911 or speaking to a dispatcher-call taker is not the same as your contact with responding officers or deputies.
You might be upset or say: I explained all of this to 911. The patrol LE officer may say: we didn't get that information or "we just got on scene".
I've seen crime scenes & crimes in progress doing security work where there's a lot of stress, chaos, misidentifying people-vehicles, K9s, helicopters, etc.
Don't assume or expect every first responder to be well versed in every detail or for every officer to "shake your hand" or be friendly.

 

[BLB68]

I'm not quite sure of the intent or tone of some of the recent responses.

All the recent responses seem pretty clear to me. Anything specific you're confused about?

 

[RustyShackelford]

Sure....

Saying sure isn't really clear.
Sure(I don't agree with you but I'll use sarcasm.) Or "sure" you are right about that point(s), I'll now expand on the post or topic along the same lines.

It's not disputed that untrained gun owners or CCW license holders without the proper skills start to do felony traffic stops or field interviews.
I'd add that if I were the guy/driver & the subject took off(rabbit on me ) I would not chase after him.
As a security officer I've seen crooks-thugs comply & be docile while others(not often) try out for the varsity track team.

Having a trained partner or working in groups help spot or reduce the risk of a bad guy who may flee-run off.

 

[BLB68]

"Sure" means I agree with you on that point. I was just too lazy to type out "I agree with you on this," due to a sinus headache. Sorry for not being clear there, I can see how it may come across negatively due to lack of infliction on the internet.