LiveLife
Member
Could you also ask if Alliant could make Promo in smaller flake size?tightgroup tiger said:
Promo with same burn rate as Red Dot that meter well would be awesome!
I know, I know ... but one could dream ...
BE-86
- Thread starter tightgroup tiger
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Promo with same burn rate as Red Dot that meter well would be awesome!
I know, I know ... but one could dream ...
LiveLife
Member
I am guessing here but do any of you think BE-86 is Alliant's answer to CFE Pistol?
Or do you think Alliant just wanted Unique burn rate powder that metered well?
Or do you think Alliant just wanted Unique burn rate powder that metered well?
Jesse Heywood
Member
bds said:
I had the same thought about Autocomp.
LiveLife
Member
There was some discussion that AutoComp was WSF with flash suppressant - http://www.wwpowder.com/pistol.html
But this thread is about BE-86.
But this thread is about BE-86.
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tightgroup tiger
Member
BDS, It certainly won't hurt to ask about the Red Dot comment.
Artofgolf, I will try the 9mm loads with 5.2 gr of BE-86 which should be minimum. I'll hand load the 9mm and the .357mags so I'll know all loads will be the same. I dearly wish I had a Chronograph but living in a town between 3cities has it's major draw backs.
I'll be able to tell if their are any variations, to a certain degree, from felt recoil.
RussellC
Do you have a Chrono?
Artofgolf, I will try the 9mm loads with 5.2 gr of BE-86 which should be minimum. I'll hand load the 9mm and the .357mags so I'll know all loads will be the same. I dearly wish I had a Chronograph but living in a town between 3cities has it's major draw backs.
I'll be able to tell if their are any variations, to a certain degree, from felt recoil.
RussellC
Do you have a Chrono?
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tightgroup tiger
Member
I haven't seen CFE pistol yet around here.
Hodgdon brought out Universal to compete with Unique and now it seems that BE-86 could be competing with Universal and several others including Alliant's own Unique.
I tried Auto Comp and I didn't really care for it in my 9mms. I know it's made for compensated Race guns but it seemed pretty dirty to me even close to the max load. I only bought one pound of it and doubt I'll ever use the rest of what's left.
I just loaded a hundred 9mms with BE-86 while this post was going on, I can tell you after loading them that there will be no problem with powder forward with it.
At 5.3 gr I only had about a .100" of air space with an OAL of 1.125 and 124gr bullets and that's just above minimum load. With Alliant saying 5.9gr is maximum, the case will pretty well be filled up. I didn't try to settle the powder in one of them to see how much space I could gain. I doubt any 9mm bullet size would ever be compressed after it settles but the case fill should be about perfect.
The .357 mag is a different story. I will load them tomorrow and check them for consistency with powder forward later in the week if I can get away from work long enough to do it, if not, next Saturday.
Artofgolf
Member
Now I can relax .......
KansasSasquatch
Member
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KansasSasquatch
Member
I don't believe so. If I remember the timeline correctly, Alliant had already announced BE-86 a month or two before someone mentioned here on THR that Hodgdon had a new powder listed on their data site, but there was no further info about it on their main website. I think somehow Hodgdon just got their product to the market first.
Either way, I'd like to get my hands on both of them. And I'm with you on the Promo/Red Dot. Making Unique a tad smaller might not hurt either if it doesn't change the burn rate much. But I could say the same thing about a few Hodgdon powders too, like maybe have ADI try cutting Varget to about the size of Benchmark.
LiveLife
Member
The Alliant rep posted BE-86 had similar to Unique burn rate but the geometry of Power Pistol with flash suppressant - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=9597004#post9597004RussellC said:
Alliant Reloading said:
Power Pistol powder granules look like Bullseye with similar size and meters very well. So with BE-86 having the same powder granule characteristics and size of BE/PP, it should meter very well as well. FYI, I was able to meter Bullseye with modified Pro Auto Disk down to 1.5 gr with less than .1 gr variance so BE-86 should be a good metering powder for even small case volume cartridge 380Auto - www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=741988RussellC said:
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tightgroup tiger
Member
I put a pinch of power pistol and a pinch of BE-86 side by side and their appearance is identical.
It meters very well in all three of my measures. I have Hornady's on my LNL-AP, a stand alone RCBS Uni-Flo, and a Lee Pro Auto Disc on my Pro 1000.
It's some of the nicest metering powder you'll find anywhere.
The Hornady and Pro Auto Disc measures stayed within +1 -0 on accuracy, the Uni-Flo stay within +1 -1.
If you ever used Power Pistol you won't be able to tell the difference except for the heat range.
It meters very well in all three of my measures. I have Hornady's on my LNL-AP, a stand alone RCBS Uni-Flo, and a Lee Pro Auto Disc on my Pro 1000.
It's some of the nicest metering powder you'll find anywhere.
The Hornady and Pro Auto Disc measures stayed within +1 -0 on accuracy, the Uni-Flo stay within +1 -1.
If you ever used Power Pistol you won't be able to tell the difference except for the heat range.
Toprudder
Member
I loaded up some test rounds in 45 (200 and 230gr plated RN) as well as 38 and 357 (158gr plated SWC) and was able to chrono them today. I will reserve judgement on them, but I was impressed in the consistency (standard deviation).
I was shooting at steel so I can't say much about accuracy, and I was shooting other test loads of PB and WST, so I can't say much about how clean it is. I started 0.5gr less than the listed loads and worked my way up.
GP100 5" barrel. Population of 6 each.
38, 158 SWC plated, BE86 4.6gr, 750fps, 17sd.
357, 158 SWC plated, BE86 7.6gr, 1090fps, 17.5sd.
Witness 45, 4.5" barrel. Population of 5 each.
45 200gr HP plated, BE86 6.7gr, 801fps, 7.2sd.
45 230gr RN plated, BE86 6.5gr, 792fps, 10.9sd.
I am very pleased with these numbers. I will be loading up a larger quantity of each to shoot some more.
I was shooting at steel so I can't say much about accuracy, and I was shooting other test loads of PB and WST, so I can't say much about how clean it is. I started 0.5gr less than the listed loads and worked my way up.
GP100 5" barrel. Population of 6 each.
38, 158 SWC plated, BE86 4.6gr, 750fps, 17sd.
357, 158 SWC plated, BE86 7.6gr, 1090fps, 17.5sd.
Witness 45, 4.5" barrel. Population of 5 each.
45 200gr HP plated, BE86 6.7gr, 801fps, 7.2sd.
45 230gr RN plated, BE86 6.5gr, 792fps, 10.9sd.
I am very pleased with these numbers. I will be loading up a larger quantity of each to shoot some more.
Potatohead
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Oops. I see the Alliant rep answered this in his post at the very beginning. Sorry, it flew right by.What is it near on the burn rate chart, or what's it supposed to "take the place of", what's it similar to and whatnot? Or do we really know all of that yet?
BTW Good decision, deleting the posts Walkalong, I wish that would have been my natural reaction, instead of slander.
No TightgroupTiger, I do not. I am hoping to remedy this by the first of the year if not before.
Finishing AR builds, (300 Black Out) Just bought dies for newly acquired .45 so play money a little short. I did load some .45 today, hopefully can try them out over the next day or so.
As to how the BE-86 meters, it is a little better than Unique through my Pro Powder Disc. It looks similar to Unique, but the flakes are way smaller.
Russellc
I loaded 230 grain Win FMJ, a batch at 6.5 grains and a few hotter ones at a hair under 6.8. OAL 1.270. This is still way under the 230 grain FMJ +P loads, which went up to 7.4 at 1.265. "Regular" loads topped out at 7.1, OAL 1.265, so I am under this as well. They will be fired from Glock 30S.
Russellc
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tightgroup tiger
Member
That's music to my ears. The loads I already shot in .357mag were as consistent as anything I've shot to date. Thank you for posting.
I'm surprised to here you say that. It meter really well for me but I sprayed my measures down with static guard before I started. It is a really dry powder and is prone to static. The very first loads I did were in my Uni-flow and I had trouble with my charges being all over the place. I hadn't sprayed it because I didn't think about it.
I always always have trouble with that measure and have since I bought 25years ago. So I pay no attention to it.
In my Hornady and Pro Auto disc it metered as good as the best metering powder I have which is probably Universal and 231. But again, I sprayed those two measures with static guard before I started. They held true, I weighed 2 cases every 10 rounds for 150 rounds.
Potato Head!,
And I answered it later on by quoting what Alliant said. Do you read posts before you reply? You seem to be a really nice guy but COME ON MAN!
LiveLife
Member
The posts are sounding very promising.
Look forward to trying BE-86 as soon as I see it.
Look forward to trying BE-86 as soon as I see it.
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tightgroup tiger
Member
Yes they do,
I'll try Walkalongs powder forward test as soon as I can get to the range. I got my .357s loaded today between clearing brush and cutting down a tree, and rototilling my garden.
I load all my revolver rounds with my muzzle down and the first batch I shot were extremely consistent, but I will tip my muzzle down for each and every shot on this next batch.
I loaded them at minimum to get as much air space in the case as I could. We will see.
Toprudder
Member
Well, my gun isn't rated for +P so I don't want to push it.
Besides, I don't want max loads anyway, just want something consistent at slightly reduced recoil.As to the questions about how it meters, I think it meters very well, every bit as good as Power Pistol and, IMHO, better than Unique. So far I have only used it in my Uniflow, but see no reason it won't do well in my Dillon.
FWIW, I had trouble getting large flake powders, like 700x, to meter well in my Uniflow until I installed the optional baffle. I did wipe down the inside with a dryer sheet to help with the static cling.
Sorry, I didnt mean to disparage the metering, rereading, it does not sound as optomistic as intended. I dont have that much trouble with Unique once I'm set up with the Pro Powder Disc. Wioth the BE-86, it was much more consistent. I keep a Lee safety scale on a closet shelf (eye level) in my loading room and throw an occasional drop on it to check consistency as I go. I had an occasional drop a little high, nothing breath taking.
How does one do the static guard treatment you speak of? I was using the adjustable powder disc, BTW. I have no trouble with 231/HP-38, that's for sure! Maybe I should try the regular discs?
Russellc
I'm not at the +p level, not even top of the regular load protocol. Minus 10% of that is approx 6.4. I did 6.5. Then a few just a hair under 6.7. Glocks are fine with +P loads, but I want to see what lower measures are like, then go up a little more...meters better than Unique for sure, it was very consistent, a few drops a tenth or so high, but I havent done the "static guard" thing yet either. Also I used the adjustable disc, but I usually have no trouble with it.Well, my gun isn't rated for +P so I don't want to push it.
As to the questions about how it meters, I think it meters very well, every bit as good as Power Pistol and, IMHO, better than Unique. So far I have only used it in my Uniflow, but see no reason it won't do well in my Dillon.
FWIW, I had trouble getting large flake powders, like 700x, to meter well in my Uniflow until I installed the optional baffle. I did wipe down the inside with a dryer sheet to help with the static cling.
Russellc
Alliant Reloading
Member
I see you guys have found a typo in our data. Thanks for bringing that to light.
I have the root data that should have been entered, and the 6.1gr charge 9mm 115gr load is for the FMJ bullet. The 6.3gr load is for the 9mm 115gr JHP load. You should notice there really isn't much difference in how those two respond, as the higher charge for the JHP generates 19 additional fps and almost 700psi. Both of those are good loads, but reduce 10% and work up your system to that recommended max.
titegroup tiger, I will develop some 41RemMag loads as I can, depending on what bullets I have. Right now, the only bullets I have are the hunting bullets Federal loads their ammo with. Really, BE-86 isn't designed for the magnum applications, except for target shooting and maybe shorter barrel loads.
Thanks for your interest in our new powder, and thanks again for pointing out the typo. I hope the web guys can correct that son. They also missed some of the loads I had worked up for 357Sig, 32H&R Mag and 38 Super Auto +P, so hopefully they will get those up soon also.
Shoot well,
Paul
I have the root data that should have been entered, and the 6.1gr charge 9mm 115gr load is for the FMJ bullet. The 6.3gr load is for the 9mm 115gr JHP load. You should notice there really isn't much difference in how those two respond, as the higher charge for the JHP generates 19 additional fps and almost 700psi. Both of those are good loads, but reduce 10% and work up your system to that recommended max.
titegroup tiger, I will develop some 41RemMag loads as I can, depending on what bullets I have. Right now, the only bullets I have are the hunting bullets Federal loads their ammo with. Really, BE-86 isn't designed for the magnum applications, except for target shooting and maybe shorter barrel loads.
Thanks for your interest in our new powder, and thanks again for pointing out the typo. I hope the web guys can correct that son. They also missed some of the loads I had worked up for 357Sig, 32H&R Mag and 38 Super Auto +P, so hopefully they will get those up soon also.
Shoot well,
Paul
LiveLife
Member
Thanks for the reply Paul!
Look forward to testing BE-86 as soon as I find some.
Look forward to testing BE-86 as soon as I find some.
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