Brady Campaign emotion vs. fact

[kubmiester]

I received this in my mail from the Brady Campaign:

"In the dead of night, the gun lobby snuck an amendment onto a bill in the U.S. Senate that allows people to carry loaded guns, including AK-47s, in national parks. We can't waste a minute to fight this amendment." Brady Compaign e-mail.

Does this bill allow conceiled carry permit holders to now also carry an AK-47? Without looking at the Bill, my speculation is that this is not an accurate statement.

Any body read the bill?

 

[TexasRifleman]

All the proposed bill does is cause National Park regulations to mirror state law.

Theoretically I guess that would mean in some cases you could carry a rifle, but many state laws restrict that in some form or another because of possible poaching.

It is true that the current language does not seem limited to just handguns.

So, technically I guess I could carry an AK47 to a National Park in Texas if this passes.

But so what. I could do that today if I was a criminal. Funny how they always leave that part out

What they leave out also is that it's legal already in National Forests where hunting is generally allowed. Been able to carry an AK47 in National Forests for years, subject to hunting regs etc.

If it's a problem, where are all the shooting deaths from it?

So as usual with Brady, they tell some truth, but leave more truth out than they put in.

 

[carebear]

Yep, the proposed law would allow carry per state law, with no distinction made between concealed or open, licensed or not.

Actually better than the DOI rule change.

 

[gc70]

Here is Coburn's amendment:

PROTECTING THE RIGHT OF INDIVIDUALS TO BEAR ARMS IN UNITS OF THE NATIONAL PARK SYSTEM AND THE NATIONAL WILDLIFE REFUGE SYSTEM.

The Secretary of the Interior shall not promulgate or enforce any regulation that prohibits an individual from possessing a firearm including an assembled or functional firearm in any unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System if—

(1) the individual is not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing the firearm; and

(2) the possession of the firearm is in compliance with the law of the State in which the unit of the National Park System or the National Wildlife Refuge System is located.

 

[kludge]

Kind of like they snuck in 922(o)?

 

[ConstitutionCowboy]

Based in emotion? Yes. But, it is misdirected emotion supported only by pretense. There are certain things that can be considered emotion based in logic. Gun control is not among them.

Woody

 

[gc70]

The Coburn amendment was not "snuck in." The majority party might sneak in an unanticipated amendment, but members of the minority party are unlikely to succeed in attaching unrelated amendments to a bill unless the majority party agrees.

Coburn made an agreement with Reid to allow the amendment to be attached to the credit card bill. Coburn clearly described in the Congressional Record the political shenanigans that have kept his legislation from being considered earlier by Congress:

Congressional leadership inappropriately blocked consideration of this measure repeatedly. Members of Congress have repeatedly attempted to bring up this measure for a clean, fair vote. Unfortunately, congressional leadership has gone to extreme lengths to avoid having a straight up-and-down vote on this measure. (more details for the next three pages)

 

[ants]

What's wrong with an AK-47 in a National Park, in accordance with all other applicable laws? Nothing.
The amendment was added to the bill using normal and ordinary procedures.
Members of both houses concur.

Thus, the entire Brady approach would seem to be emotionally fuelled.
But never underestimate the value of emotional fuel. They'll get the uproar they want.

 

[Yellowfin]

"AK 47" is basically their version of the N word.

 

[BBQLS1]

"AK 47" is basically their version of the N word.

Lulz.

 

[DonP]

All Brady e-mails are the same:

"There is a crisis because of the evil Gun Lobby who wants to _________ please send us money immediately to fight ____________ or your children won't be safe in their beds anymore, your cattle will sicken and your crops die in the fields!"

You can plug in AWB, Guns in Parks, Concealed Carry, Flouridated water whatever they think will scare the most soccer moms into writing a check.

The problem they have been having recently is that most of those Moms are signing up for gun safety courses.

I think the Brady e-mailing list must be about 10 to 1, Gunnies versus gun control people.

 

[dvcrsn]

THe Brady campaign has had difficulty in telling the truth for as long as I have been tracking them:banghead:

 

[Nicodemus38]

The thing is the brady bunch only rely on histeria, mis conception, and emotion, and highly skewed data to get their way.

If they were truly concerned about helping defenseless children, they would focus on the hundreds of children that have been killed and horribly maimed every year by bunkbeds. Heck, just this week a company recalled almost 500,000 bunkbeds because the govment said to many kids were killed or maimed in that particular series in the last year or so.

 

[USAFNoDAk]

"AK 47" is basically their version of the N word.

Exactly. When you read their pompous proclamations regarding gun control, they never fail to use the most "alarming" adjectives and nouns that they can think of to scare the public. It's like a word association game they are playing with the ignorant public.

OK, I know you don't know much about firearms. However, I'm going to state a word or phrase regarding firearms or gun control and you state the word that describes the emotions I'm going to stir up in your brain.

Ready? Here goes:
1. AK-47 ----> Machine gun (Good)
2. Large capacity magazines-----> spray bullets. (Excellent)
3. Barrel shroud----->that thing that goes up your shoulder. (well, never mind, but good guess anyway).
4. Sniper Rifle----> any gun which can shoot more than 100 yds, and penetrate body armor. (Wow, you're really good at this).
5. 50 Caliber sniper rifle-----> any firearm designed to shoot down a commercial airliner at up to a mile away. (Great answer!)
6. NRA----->Evil men who block every reasonable gun control law and have magical mind powers over almost all members of congress. (Wow, which public school did you attend?)
7. Assault weapons---->high powered killing machines designed for the military which are able to spray bullets everywhere, killing everyone in sight and which are the prefrerred guns for any criminal, drug dealer or gang member. (Excellent, we couldn't have explained it any better ourselves).

Well, that's it. Thanks for coming in today Congresswoman McCarthy.

Who's next? Senators Feinstein and then Schumer? Wonderful.

 

[Rellian]

USAFNoDAk noted:

2. Large capacity magazines-----> spray bullets. (Excellent)

4. Sniper Rifle----> any gun which can shoot more than 100 yds, and penetrate body armor. (Wow, you're really good at this).

7. Assault weapons---->high powered killing machines designed for the military which are able to spray bullets everywhere, killing everyone in sight and which are the preferred guns for any criminal, drug dealer or gang member.

that's what they cry out to the public, but then when they get into the actual drafting of the legislation they tend to answer a little more like this:

2. Large capacity magazines-----> any magazine

4. Sniper Rifle----> Any rifle

7. Assault weapons----> All fire-arms

I wish I could say this was tongue-in-cheek, but the longer we go on the more it becomes less of a joke.

:banghead:

 

[Megistopoda]

I received this in my mail from the Brady Campaign:

"In the dead of night, the gun lobby snuck an amendment onto a bill in the U.S. Senate that allows people to carry loaded guns, including AK-47s, in national parks. We can't waste a minute to fight this amendment."

I can tell you one thing ... the Brady Campaign lied to you. The vote on Coburn's amendment was clean and out-front for everyone, and was recorded at 5:45pm eastern time ... not exactly "dead of night" for most people, particularly those in mountain and pacific times zones.

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/vote.xpd?vote=s2009-188

But calling the Brady's on their lies is a futile effort.

 

[cjw3cma]

The Brady campaign has had difficulty in telling the truth for as long as I have been tracking them.

The truth is in the eye (and mind) of the beholder - just like statistics that can basically "say" whatever the author wants them to portray). The Brady camp wants their position on guns to be the only viable position. The NRA (and like organizations) want their position to be the only viable one. They all are just too black and white to be taken wholeheartedly.

Are guns by themselves dangerous? Only if you believe that rocks, glass, knives, metal tubes, ball point pens, etc. are dangerous all by themselves as guns are, according to the Brady perspective.

Both of these groups needs to put forth the dogma that above all else PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY is the factor that makes their position viable. Without responsibility almost anything can become dangerous.

The NRA sure makes more sense to follow than the Brady camp - as fact outweighs emotional reaction.