CCL on line - from the comfort of your own home?

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buflow

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I received a E-Mail offering a CCL on line, the E-Mail states,

This is a great training course that you can take from the comfort of your own home.

It is led by a former CIA Officer. He is a contributing writer to Concealed Carry Magazine, Personal and Home Defense Magazine, and Combat Handguns Magazine… to name a few.

The Concealed Carry Classroom will help you qualify for one of the nation’s most valuable concealed firearms permits.


Has anyone heard of or tried this? Is it a way to get a CCL good in 28 states? Or is this a way to part me from my money?
Any one have any information on this, please share.
 
buflow wrote:
Is it a way to get a CCL good in 28 states?

At least in Texas, a license to carry (LTC), see: https://www.dps.texas.gov/RSD/CHL/faqs/ requires:

An original (first-time) LTC applicant must complete classroom training, pass a written examination and pass a proficiency demonstration (shooting). All classroom and proficiency must be conducted by an LTC instructor certified by DPS. The classroom instruction may be a four to six hour course and must cover the four (4) statutory required topics:
  • Laws that relate to weapons and the use of deadly force
  • Handgun use and safety, including use of restraint holsters and methods to ensure the secure carrying of openly carried handguns
  • Non-violent dispute resolution
  • Proper storage practices for handguns with an emphasis on storage practices that eliminate the possibility of accidental injury to a child
How an on-line class administers that proficiency demonstration is beyond me.
 
A way to part you from your money. Even Ohio, which is a shall issue state with low fees and a class that can be completed in a weekend, requires a live fire portion of the class.
 
I am guessing that it is for a Utah permit.

Back before NM had CCW I had a Florida non-resident. I didn't require any class, just a copy of my DD-214 to show firearms proficiency. It was good in some other states as well, but we were traveling to Florida just about annually in those days.
 
buflow wrote:
Is it a way to get a CCL good in 28 states? Or is this a way to part me from my money?

I think the IRS has some particularly sage wisdom on this point; "If it sounds too good to be true..." well, you know the rest.

Check with your state about what the requirements are and then use a provider that has been approved by the relevant state authority.

I really don't understand why people want to "short-cut" this. After all, you're talking about the use of deadly force and the attendant criminal and civil liabilities. I would think everyone would want as much instruction as they could get from someone whose throat they could get their hands around when they shot someone and ended up in jail, because, surprise, a "good shoot" isn't what you think it is, but is what the Prosecutor, Judge and Jury think it is.
 
When Maine passed Constitutional Carry, our group Gun Owners of Maine setup a free online CCW course. While the real deal is always the best bet, it is pretty thorough and easy to follow and a good option for those that don't have the money to pay for full courses and don't have a friend that can teach them. It goes over some of the laws as well.
 
I am guessing that it is for a Utah permit.

Back before NM had CCW I had a Florida non-resident. I didn't require any class, just a copy of my DD-214 to show firearms proficiency. It was good in some other states as well, but we were traveling to Florida just about annually in those days.

A DD214 is different from a non-military civilian with no training. So while the DD214 is a quick painless way to obtain your CCL, it does not work the same for civilians.
 
At least in Texas, a license to carry (LTC), see: https://www.dps.texas.gov/RSD/CHL/faqs/ requires:

An original (first-time) LTC applicant must complete classroom training, pass a written examination and pass a proficiency demonstration (shooting). All classroom and proficiency must be conducted by an LTC instructor certified by DPS. The classroom instruction may be a four to six hour course and must cover the four (4) statutory required topics:
  • Laws that relate to weapons and the use of deadly force
  • Handgun use and safety, including use of restraint holsters and methods to ensure the secure carrying of openly carried handguns
  • Non-violent dispute resolution
  • Proper storage practices for handguns with an emphasis on storage practices that eliminate the possibility of accidental injury to a child
How an on-line class administers that proficiency demonstration is beyond me.
You are correct, however, Sept 1 this law changes and allows much of the course to be taken on-line. Too early to determine effect on cost. LTC was reduced from $140 to $40 also effective 9/1
 
In Virginia, you can use an online training course to satisfy the training requirement. This is one reason why Virginia permits are easy to get.
 
Hdwhit said :
"I really don't understand why people want to "short-cut" this. After all, you're talking about the use of deadly force and the attendant criminal and civil liabilities. I would think everyone would want as much instruction as they could get from someone whose throat they could get their hands around when they shot someone and ended up in jail, because, surprise, a "good shoot" isn't what you think it is, but is what the Prosecutor, Judge and Jury think it is."
I could not agree more .
Let's not try to make it more "easier and convenient" where it should not be.
A friend of mine is a certified NRA instructor and he is occasionally helping CCW classes ( not an owner) held at major gun store/range in a suburb of Cleveland, OH (and the store is not holding these classes themselves, either- they are just renting their classroom and range to whomever gets these organized and pays the gun range).
After several months working there (every other Saturday, maybe), he has a moral dilemma of quitting this job b/c the owner of the class ( again, not the gun store/range itself), is just letting everyone pass - in a fear that if someone fails, they may give him a bad Google review, and that people will go to competition and it will hurt his business.
We have a stereotype of gun shop employees being rude - but according to my friend, dealing with some people that are taking these classes almost justifies that type of behavior.
He experiences being muzzle swept almost every time when they go to firing lane (by a "hot" weapon) - even they were all taught in classroom 10 minute earlier that it is a "deadly sin". And it is always some mature ( no offense to anyone, please, I am nearing my 50) , arrogant guy who gets angry when they warn him about that :
" I grew up with weapons and nothing ever happened !"
" I handled guns before you were born !"
" I was in the Army !" ( yeah like 55 years ago)

Alas, the owner would not kick them out even with 3 strikes , for the same reason mentioned above.
I drifted away from the topic a little bit, but I think these should not be too relaxed, just like passing a driver's exam, it is a serious stuff
 
Let's not try to make it more "easier and convenient" where it should not be.
There's a case to be made that carry permits should not be required at all ("constitutional carry"). If you accept that premise, but for one reason or another are forced to have a permit system anyway, then the less onerous the training requirement, the better. I agree that training is a good thing, but it should be left up to the individual.
 
It is one thing to use computer based or online training for the "academic" part of the training (generally you get consistent presentation of material that can be easily reviewed and improved for quality and accuracy), but computer based training by itself for a permit to carry would surprise me as being the only requirement for states that don't have constitutional carey. Still, I know some states don't have a practical skill demonstration requirement so there's no reason computer based training and certification of training for having the permit issued wouldn't be acceptable to those states.
 
There's two flags in the solicitation, one that it's been put together by a former CIA employee. Being CIA is no qualifier as an arms expert - at all - many are forensic computer analysts, researchers, or simply people who got the job because they are fluent in a language.

Two, he wrote a lot for popular gun rags. Nothing else about civilian or military self defense experience, what weapons training they have, or, practical experience. In my experience a writer is exactly that, someone who distills other peoples experience guided by their input. Someone can write about assembling a nuclear weapon, it doesn't mean they ever did it or know where to employ it. You can have knowledge without practical experience, or vice versa, the person you want to have teach you should have both. Any instructor who won't touch on the aftermath of use and refer to Massad Ayoob's works for his teaching points is horribly underinforming his/her students, an instructor who fails to read thru or have had no experience in actual gun fights, the same.

We get a lot of one or the other. And we also get a lot of feedback here or other forums about how they conduct their class, and it's sometimes controversial. Some instructors handle proficiency at a range where they control who can handle a firearm when, others ask you to arrive cocked and locked which you do at all times on the range. Which will you be doing when you carry on the street?

One might be better for the new student, the other for experienced gun shooters long down the road with weapons handling. In my case MO had no mechanism to recognize the DD214 or my tour of duty as an MP, plus, I got my local PD Chief as instructor - it was "basic" training with a high degree of control. When I go shoot at a public range I carry cocked and locked, leave the rifles on the bench, fire the handguns from the holster by a draw, point and shoot.

Concealed being concealed you get looks walking down to the 7 yard line appearing not to carry a gun. Once fired it stays out of the holster - because in a CCW shooting you DON'T holster, you leave it out to place on the ground when things appear safe. And an instructor should be training that.

Constantly reholstering is a competition or LEO activity, not a self defense tactic. Goes to the instructor who had that in his curriculum and discovered it endangers appendix carriers. He now disallows it for his class purposes, but that doesn't mean appendix carry is any more dangerous than 4:00 - as those who suffer Glock leg syndrome can testify.

Especially with "experienced" shooters, who are the most prone due to being overly familiar with their lapses of trigger finger discipline or trusting their holster too much. Finding those in class makes for too much error with too little time to train for correction, they need to unload, go home, and practice a draw one hundred times a day with trigger finger placement only when the weapons barrel is horizontal. I'd like to market an attachment that triggers a Taser attached to their belt as an educational tool, a few good buzzes in the maximus gluteus would work wonders for trigger finger discipline. We see it in videos all the time but we dont really commit to excellence in that.

It has to be adopted from the first day and frankly those who complain about boys and toy guns in youth have a point - we DID learn a lot of things wrong. Goes to correcting them before we commit a serious error.
 
Nah.

Depending on your state, there's a pretty good chance you will still have to take a class, pass a written test, and pass a live fire test.

Even if the online material is outstanding, it's somewhere between unnecessary and a scam.

Still, I know some states don't have a practical skill demonstration requirement so there's no reason computer based training and certification of training for having the permit issued wouldn't be acceptable to those states.

It might be useful to have the test proctored.
 
It might be useful to have the test proctored.

I'm not sure there's any need for any test anyway and certainly not if CBT is used. Just go to the place you apply with your certificate of completion and apply for the permit and pay your fee. A test could be completed then and there like your driver's license test and you pass/fail.
 
It is NOT for a Utah permit. Utah specifically forbids giving remote courses. A Utah non-resident permit is good in 37 states. (Last I counted.)

I have set up my course to be able to teach it in places where guns are not allowed. So I use dummy guns and video clips to help with the process.
 
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