KBintheSLC
Member
Citi is one of my least favorite financial organizations. This merely reinforces, and further justifies my sentiments. I also don't shop at stores that say "no guns allowed"... though it is rare to see those signs in UT.
Citi Credit Card Rejects Firearms Industry
- Thread starter Henry Bowman
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Robert Hairless
Member
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Seems to me that what you propose is what First Data wants.
Perhaps it would be more effective if word could be spread so that anyone in other industries would change their credit card processor immediately. Surely you have friends and business associates in other industries, and perhaps even in allied industries?
For example, members of this and other forums might be involved in a wide variety of businesses and professions, many of which involve credit card processing. If numbers of them could influence a shift away from First Data that might be helpful.
The goal of this kind of endeavor never is vengeance. It should be to effect positive change and, of course, a warning to others.
siglite
Member
While I understand the outrage, I feel it is Citi's right to do business with whom it chooses. Just as it is our right as consumers and business folks to do business with whom we choose.
I see the justification for outrage, but I think the notion of forcing a company to do business with folks against their wishes is a nod to government intrusion where it does not belong.
Outrage? Check. Get credit cards and loans elsewhere? Check. Process your credit cards through a Citi competitor? Check. Force Citi to do business with anyone because you disagree with their politics? No, not so much.
I see the justification for outrage, but I think the notion of forcing a company to do business with folks against their wishes is a nod to government intrusion where it does not belong.
Outrage? Check. Get credit cards and loans elsewhere? Check. Process your credit cards through a Citi competitor? Check. Force Citi to do business with anyone because you disagree with their politics? No, not so much.
But what happens if BoA, US Bank, Chase, Wells Fargo, Wachovia, HSBC, Suntrust, and Capital One follow suit?
For an analogy, imagine if Fedex and UPS decided not to ship firearms anymore.
Big problems and potentially threatening trend.
YZR
Member
I don't know what all of this means but, using my Citibank credit card, I just bought: 20 boxes of 9mm ammo from Natchez, ankle holster from Midway and a Smary carry holster.
Granted it's not a gun but it's certainly "gun related".
Granted it's not a gun but it's certainly "gun related".
siglite
Member
If that happens, I'd be crazy not to start a processing company that IS willing to process firearm related transactions, and a subsidiary that ships firearms.
$$$$
cha-ching!
hotpig
Member
strat81
I will have to see if I saved any paper work from the companies that you listed. More than one of them turned down my app for credit card processing.
They turned it down because I might illegally sell guns on my internet store.
1st Data pretty much has the market for us moto merchants. There are some other out there that charge a premium for moto accounts like mine and CDNN. Rates as of last August were double that and some cases triple of 1st Data.
Any one that thinks it is easy to get another company to do our processing is naive.
Do a internet search for merchant accounts or credit card processing. You will get hundreds of links. Contact the companies and tell them you are a FFL and want to sale guns on the web.
Most will turn you down right off the bat. I had a few that did work to try to get me set up. One rep even purchased a used Sig 226 and some Ranger ammo from me.
Ultimately when it went up to his bosses I was turned down. His Supervisor warned me to keep a low profile with my current processing company. I guess it was a forewarning.
I will have to see if I saved any paper work from the companies that you listed. More than one of them turned down my app for credit card processing.
They turned it down because I might illegally sell guns on my internet store.
1st Data pretty much has the market for us moto merchants. There are some other out there that charge a premium for moto accounts like mine and CDNN. Rates as of last August were double that and some cases triple of 1st Data.
Any one that thinks it is easy to get another company to do our processing is naive.
Do a internet search for merchant accounts or credit card processing. You will get hundreds of links. Contact the companies and tell them you are a FFL and want to sale guns on the web.
Most will turn you down right off the bat. I had a few that did work to try to get me set up. One rep even purchased a used Sig 226 and some Ranger ammo from me.
Ultimately when it went up to his bosses I was turned down. His Supervisor warned me to keep a low profile with my current processing company. I guess it was a forewarning.
Superlite27
Member
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2007
- Messages
- 712
Here's the actual letter:
Sounds like someone at citi has an anti-2A agenda, and it has reared its ugly head in company policy.
I'd let your friends know about citi. I'm gettng rid of my credit card.
Sounds like someone at citi has an anti-2A agenda, and it has reared its ugly head in company policy.
I'd let your friends know about citi. I'm gettng rid of my credit card.
Citi bank is taking a nice beating today. This is certainly not the time for them to start getting snarky. I'll shed no tears if they goto $5. 
http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=c&p=D&b=3&g=0&id=0
-T
http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=c&p=D&b=3&g=0&id=0
-T
siglite
Member
Hotpig,
Is it really that bad? How many of the big players turned you down based on the fact that you're an FFL? Was it a lot?
I don't mean to pry, but how hard WAS it? Did you wind up going with a small local bank? And if this is getting too personal or edging into areas you don't wish to discuss, I'll understand completely if you don't respond or tell me to go pound sand.
I don't like talking about financial stuff on the intarwebs either.
Though, at this point, I'm wondering if there's a market void that needs filled.
Is it really that bad? How many of the big players turned you down based on the fact that you're an FFL? Was it a lot?
I don't mean to pry, but how hard WAS it? Did you wind up going with a small local bank? And if this is getting too personal or edging into areas you don't wish to discuss, I'll understand completely if you don't respond or tell me to go pound sand.
I don't like talking about financial stuff on the intarwebs either.
Though, at this point, I'm wondering if there's a market void that needs filled.
Mark Whiteman
Member
Citi has been rated one of the worst for raising interest on your card, stubborn customer service, and so on for quite awhile.
Lets see if they can stay afloat on yuppie commie pinkos' business.
Besides, Cabelas, one of the top rated cards, sent me an offer today...
Lets see if they can stay afloat on yuppie commie pinkos' business.
Besides, Cabelas, one of the top rated cards, sent me an offer today...
Preacherman
Member
I've posted about this on my blog. Let's see how much of a response Citi gets from firearms owners across the nation.
silverlance
Member
i'm going to go active on this. this is crazy. since when is the buying or selling of guns immoral?
i thought things like embezzlement, lying to your stockholders, etc, were immoral...
i thought things like embezzlement, lying to your stockholders, etc, were immoral...
hotpig
Member
siglite
I will have to see what I saved. Most of the credit card processing companies that I dealt with use 1st Data. It is a dog eat dog business, I was looking for a company that would give me a better deal than I already have.
I tried four companies that did not exclude my business immediately, not all were first Data associates. It was a tedious task sending applications and doing follow up paper work.
I will have to see what I saved. Most of the credit card processing companies that I dealt with use 1st Data. It is a dog eat dog business, I was looking for a company that would give me a better deal than I already have.
I tried four companies that did not exclude my business immediately, not all were first Data associates. It was a tedious task sending applications and doing follow up paper work.
yongxingfreesty
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- Oct 3, 2005
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- 1,396
glad i cancelled with them 2 weeks back.
Citroen
Member
Funny, they did business with Yasser Arafat!
I guess CitiBank got all "moral" after it was discovered that they were handling money for the PLO! I sent them pieces of the credit card and a letter explaining that I did not do business with companies that did business with terrorists.
Got a call a while later from a nice lady who wanted to know why I had cancelled my credit card. She had never seen the letter so I explained to her that apparently she worked for a company that supported terrorists.
She seemed genuinely shocked. I hope she found another job!
Currently I have an NRA Visa from First National Bank of Omaha. With every purchase, a small fee goes to support gun rights.
John
Charlotte, NC
I guess CitiBank got all "moral" after it was discovered that they were handling money for the PLO! I sent them pieces of the credit card and a letter explaining that I did not do business with companies that did business with terrorists.
Got a call a while later from a nice lady who wanted to know why I had cancelled my credit card. She had never seen the letter so I explained to her that apparently she worked for a company that supported terrorists.
She seemed genuinely shocked. I hope she found another job!
Currently I have an NRA Visa from First National Bank of Omaha. With every purchase, a small fee goes to support gun rights.
John
Charlotte, NC
dmftoy1
Member
Well mine are gone now. I found it interesting in that the conversation caught the Citicard rep completely by surprise. I've tried to capture the dialog as best I could. The (missing) four letter words were actually there and shocked the heck out of me given that this is an employee of Citi.
Maria: Hello, this is Maria at Citibank, how may I help you?
Me: I would like to cancel my citibank card.
Maria: May I ask why?
me: I have recently been informed that First Data Merchant Services and Citibank are making "values" judgements as to what their vendors are selling.
Maria: Ok, I'll have to transfer you to an account representative, please hold.
Steve: Hello sir, I'm Steve your account representative and I'm here to help you with your request. In looking at your account you've been with us for a long time. Can I ask you why you're cancellingy our citibank card?
me: I've recently been made aware of an incident whereby Citibank/First Data have told a firearms vendor that they no longer want his business because they view it as unethical and illegal.
Steve: You're s----ing me! What is this? I haven't heard anything!
me: I've been reading on the web a letter from your representatives to a vendor named CDNN which states that they no longer want his business as of January 28th, 2008. I can't support a company such as yours which would pull this type of garbage.
Steve: Can you give me a url for this?
me: http://www.nssf.org There's a link on the first page to the story and another link to the actual letter coming from your company.
Steve: I can't believe we'd do something that stupid but I will take a look and forward your concerns. I really don't know what to say to you as most cancellations are due to high interest rates, late fee's, etc.
me: Well I'd appreciate it if you'd close my account. It's nothing personal against you but I don't choose to do business with a company who's trying to make ethical judgements on how I spend my money.
Steve: Thank you sir, I will get your account closed out.
Maria: Hello, this is Maria at Citibank, how may I help you?
Me: I would like to cancel my citibank card.
Maria: May I ask why?
me: I have recently been informed that First Data Merchant Services and Citibank are making "values" judgements as to what their vendors are selling.
Maria: Ok, I'll have to transfer you to an account representative, please hold.
Steve: Hello sir, I'm Steve your account representative and I'm here to help you with your request. In looking at your account you've been with us for a long time. Can I ask you why you're cancellingy our citibank card?
me: I've recently been made aware of an incident whereby Citibank/First Data have told a firearms vendor that they no longer want his business because they view it as unethical and illegal.
Steve: You're s----ing me! What is this? I haven't heard anything!
me: I've been reading on the web a letter from your representatives to a vendor named CDNN which states that they no longer want his business as of January 28th, 2008. I can't support a company such as yours which would pull this type of garbage.
Steve: Can you give me a url for this?
me: http://www.nssf.org There's a link on the first page to the story and another link to the actual letter coming from your company.
Steve: I can't believe we'd do something that stupid but I will take a look and forward your concerns. I really don't know what to say to you as most cancellations are due to high interest rates, late fee's, etc.
me: Well I'd appreciate it if you'd close my account. It's nothing personal against you but I don't choose to do business with a company who's trying to make ethical judgements on how I spend my money.
Steve: Thank you sir, I will get your account closed out.
Phil DeGraves
Member
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"First Data told him he was no better than someone running a brothel, and that if his actions selling guns was not illegal then it was certainly immoral and First Data would have nothing more to do with them."
"I really don't know what to say to you as most cancellations are due to high interest rates, late fee's, etc."
What was that about if not illegal, then, immoral?
"I really don't know what to say to you as most cancellations are due to high interest rates, late fee's, etc."
What was that about if not illegal, then, immoral?
This isn't a new thing . Last spring my gunsmith (also my FFL for transfers) got screwed with his merchant account . He had processed a couple of sales over the phone and sent out $600 worth of guns , then when he tried to get his money from his account he was told it was being returned to the buyer because they do not support non face to face sales .
Sounded pretty much the same as what CDNN was told , but this happened almost a year ago .
Sounded pretty much the same as what CDNN was told , but this happened almost a year ago .
arthurcw
Member
Yes, because an industry that markets its master/slave life ruining economics to kids with Barbie Dolls and Board Games is SOOOOO much better than a brothel.
When a Nevada Brothel sponsors Mattel’s Call Girl Barbie or Hasbro’s The New Game of Life with Porn Addiction Path, then I’ll change my ranking of these parasites. No... I won't. At least with a Brothel, you know up front what you are getting.
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