Dies for .45 ACP?

[9mmepiphany]

They do exactly what Lee says they will do.

I think the swaging of lead bullets was an unintended consequence.

The issue with swaging lead bullets is that the lead doesn't spring back as much as the brass and you end up losing neck tension. I don't have a problem with using a FCD on my jacketed bullet reloads, just not my lead/coated ones

 

[CQB45ACP]

The carbide insert is what swages the bullet, not the amount of crimp set. They are actually good crimp dies, sans the carbide ring. That said, there are tolerances and the carbide rings aren't all as tight as some others......they vary. My .40 was good to go, the .45 ACP not so much, they sit idle in a drawer.

Thanks

Well I’ve been fortunate then to not having the “problem” with standard size (.451/.452) 45acp & 9mm (whatever they are).

One possible exception that I’ll confirm or not tomorrow are Acme coated 230gr RN w/Federal cases.

 

[CQB45ACP]

Maybe that you can't adjust a FCD to not swage a lead bullet. What swages the bullet is the ring just inside the mouth of the die. If the loaded round enters the die, the bullet is swaged...if you haven't removed the ring.


I'm curious to hear how you thought the FCD's swaging function could be adjusted

Look I’m not picking a fight but this just isn’t always correct. I can show you 1000s of rounds slipping softly past the ring.

So the ring is tapering or “pre-tapering” then? When I crimp with my Redding die and then put it in the FCD should/would I feel anything?

 

[Walkalong]

but this just isn’t always correct

He asked why you thought the swage part of the FCD was adjustable, and how, that's all, it had nothing to do with being correct or wrong about it swaging bullets, which sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't, it depends on a couple of things.

 

[irishlad]

I think the swaging of lead bullets was an unintended consequence.

The issue with swaging lead bullets is that the lead doesn't spring back as much as the brass and you end up losing neck tension. I don't have a problem with using a FCD on my jacketed bullet reloads, just not my lead/coated ones

The ones I have for 38 special, 380 auto, 9mm, 45 acp and 45 colt (lead/ coated acme ) do exactly what Lee says they will do. I have had no issues with the 45 colt lead/coated bullets. Doesn't swage them . No issues with neck tension. They shoot great. I have no doubt that the LFCD could and probably does swage some lead bullets. I just find it amusing when folks(not saying you are) belittle LFCDs and folks who like them.Like you stated, if you don't think they work well on lead(or anything), don' use them. I appreciate your viewpoint.

Here is what Lee says the dies will do. They do exactly that for me.

A carbide sizer inside the Carbide Factory Crimp die post-sizes the cartridge while it is crimped so every round will positively chamber freely with factory like dependability. The adjusting screw quickly and easily sets the desired amount of crimp. It is impossible to buckle the case as with a conventional bullet seating die. Trim length is not critical so this extra operation takes less time than it would if cases were trimmed and chamfered.

Revolver dies roll crimp with no limit as to the amount. A perfect taper crimp is applied to auto-loader rounds. The crimper cannot be misadjusted to make a case mouth too small to properly head-space. A firm crimp is essential for dependable and accurate ammunition. It eliminates the problems of poor ignition of slow burning magnum powders.

 

[OLDE RETIRED COASTIE]

Have to be honest, I get good results from my dies, Lyman, RCBS, Hornady, Lee, whatever. My 30-06 is an older set of BEAR Dies that still load good ammo. other than that I have Lyman, RCBS, and Lee. As long as I do my part, they make good ammo. I am not a commercial ammo maker, just make target and self defense loads now, At 72, I do not hunt by myself anymore, and good hunting buddies are hard to find. Not many folks I trust to have a loaded gun in my vicinity,

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Maybe that you can't adjust a FCD to not swage a lead bullet. What swages the bullet is the ring just inside the mouth of the die. If the loaded round enters the die, the bullet is swaged...if you haven't removed the ring.


I'm curious to hear how you thought the FCD's swaging function could be adjusted

I like to run cast in my .44Magnum at .432” so I used an expanding reamer to open up the carbide ring in my .44 FCD to .460”. I bought a new one on sale at Midway to replace it. Carbide is a sintered metal that doesn’t cut well or I would have just used a boring bar but it grinds like ceramic: smoother than glass.
Anyway, that’s how a former aerospace machinist with a jewelry lathe adjusts an FCD.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Anyway, that’s how a former aerospace machinist with a jewelry lathe adjusts an FCD.

Love it...envious of your skills

I'm too cheap to even consider owning a lathe

 

[LiveLife]

I used an expanding reamer to open up the carbide ring in my .44 FCD to .460”.

Anyway, that’s how a former aerospace machinist with a jewelry lathe adjusts an FCD.

For those of us without lathe/experience, we could have Lee Precision do the work for us.

Custom Factory Crimp Dies - For sizes not listed, if you wish to order online, contact us so we can advise if the size you are looking for can be made, we will then give you the appropriate ordering link. Please allow 8 weeks for production - https://leeprecision.com/custom-services/custom-factory-crimp-dies/​

 

[cfullgraf]

I load plinking 38 Special wadcutters with mixed, range pick up cases. I do not worry about case length when taper crimping the ammunition. Occasionally, I'd get a case that would not chamber in my guns.

It is the only use I have for a Lee FCD die as I pass the cartridges that will not chamber through the FCD and shoot them at the next range session.

For full power revolver loads, I trim the cases to the same length then the crimp is uniform case to case. Trimming is usually not required frequently once they are trimmed to the same length.

Note, this is not the case with bottle neck rifle rounds. They require trimming, or at least checking case length, more frequently vs handgun cases.

 

[CQB45ACP]

He asked why you thought the swage part of the FCD was adjustable, and how, that's all, it had nothing to do with being correct or wrong about it swaging bullets, which sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't, it depends on a couple of things.

That would be…I made a mistake.

I should address it to @9mmepiphany but I misread and conflated his comments about learning to “set up a die correctly” so one didn’t need the FCD as meaning learning to adjust the FCD.

And didn’t recognize this might be a problem only with “coated” or “lead” bullets and not perhaps plated or FMJ.

But really it’s not the bullet type it’s the bullet diameter. That’s it. The FCD ring will NOT swage a bullet of any type unless the bullet+case diameter is greater than the ring diameter. So, as I said (and BTW, you said), it’s not correct all the time.

But it still makes no sense to me anything about setting up some other die better, because if it’s the FCD ring that is the culprit and it cannot be adjusted and it reacts solely to the size of the bullet+case combined diameter, then how would setting up some other die have any impact at all?

It’s not some skillful die adjustment, it’s either chance or it’s based on bullet diameter selection plus sometimes thickness of case wall.

Overall I was reading a series of comments and responding before understanding while walking through Wegmans grocery store cause I hate walking through Wegmans grocery store and Walmart cause I hate walking through Walmart.

 

[lordpaxman]

It’s not some skillful die adjustment, it’s either chance or it’s based on bullet diameter selection plus sometimes thickness of case wall.

It could be a non-concentric bullet bulged one side, a case had a dent the bullet pushed out, and probably others. I can also believe that a FMJ would be swaged if bullet+case is larger than the ring diameter - metal is going to move, or carbide will break - one or the other. I’m just so happy @Walkalong called the FCD an “advanced” reloading tool! I don’t feel bad about using one now and then, and can skip the therapy session this week.

Overall I was reading a series of comments and responding before understanding while walking through Wegmans grocery store cause I hate walking through Wegmans grocery store

Wow - we made it all the way down your way? Now… don’t get Danny upset…

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

For those of us without lathe/experience, we could have Lee Precision do the work for us.

Custom Factory Crimp Dies - For sizes not listed, if you wish to order online, contact us so we can advise if the size you are looking for can be made, we will then give you the appropriate ordering link. Please allow 8 weeks for production - https://leeprecision.com/custom-services/custom-factory-crimp-dies/​

And let them have all the fun?

Well, you did say, “…without lathe,” so that would make it a good deal.

One thing to be aware of, you will also need to adjust/purchase an oversized sizing die or you will end up with slightly bulged looking straight wall cases. Also make sure the larger cases (0.001-0.002”) will chamber before changing your sizing and crimping dies. Just because the groove is slightly over does not mean the chamber is also. Measure twice, cut to fit.

 

[CQB45ACP]

It could be a non-concentric bullet bulged one side, a case had a dent the bullet pushed out, and probably others. I can also believe that a FMJ would be swaged if bullet+case is larger than the ring diameter - metal is going to move, or carbide will break - one or the other. I’m just so happy @Walkalong called the FCD an “advanced” reloading tool! I don’t feel bad about using one now and then, and can skip the therapy session this week.


Wow - we made it all the way down your way? Now… don’t get Danny upset…

Well I use just two bullets, Berry’s & Extreme, in 9mm & 45ACP, and back when I used the FCD I didn’t have the problem with them. (I now use primarily a Redding.)

But a while back, I used some Acme coated .452 230gr RN when I was still using the FCD and realize now I did have the problem intermittently I think maybe with Federal cases.

At the time though I didn’t know the specific cause so I contacted Acme and they said it’d be fine to resize them down to .451. That fixed it, but of course you can’t really know how many may have an issue unless they are loaded and have the issue.

But anyway, they were resized or made concentric and were just as accurate as any other so I really don’t know what the fuss is all about. Isn’t the offending ring just resizing also? Trick question. Yes, is the answer.

I also ran some Acmes through a .452 sizer at someone’s suggestion to correct if they were bulged or non-concentric.

As for Wegmans—They’re all over now and I have to be fair, Wegmans is the best by far esp since Bezos bought Whole Foods. But, I’m not a fan of any of them.

 

[9mmepiphany]

That would be…I made a mistake.
...I misread and conflated his comments about learning to “set up a die correctly” so one didn’t need the FCD as meaning learning to adjust the FCD.
...And didn’t recognize this might be a problem only with “coated” or “lead” bullets and not perhaps plated or FMJ.

That's sort of what I thought

[QUOTE}]But it still makes no sense to me anything about setting up some other die better, because if it’s the FCD ring that is the culprit and it cannot be adjusted and it reacts solely to the size of the bullet+case combined diameter, then how would setting up some other die have any impact at all?[/QUOTE]
Because if you size and expand your cases correctly and learn to start the bullet straight in the case, you won't have the issues that the FCD was designed to correct

Isn’t the offending ring just resizing also? Trick question. Yes, is the answer.

Actually sizing in a Lee Sizing Die and a Lee FCD is a bit different.

The Sizing die sizes to SAAMI minimum, the FCD sizes to SAAMI maximum

 

[CQB45ACP]

That's sort of what I thought

[QUOTE}]But it still makes no sense to me anything about setting up some other die better, because if it’s the FCD ring that is the culprit and it cannot be adjusted and it reacts solely to the size of the bullet+case combined diameter, then how would setting up some other die have any impact at all?

Because if you size and expand your cases correctly and learn to start the bullet straight in the case, you won't have the issues that the FCD was designed to correct


Actually sizing in a Lee Sizing Die and a Lee FCD is a bit different.

The Sizing die sizes to SAAMI minimum, the FCD sizes to SAAMI maximum[/QUOTE]
Okay thanks for that explanation

I’ll happily continue using my Redding taper crimp die but wish the sleeve or whatever it’s called was carbide—I love the slick feel.

Cheers

 

[Gone Hiking]

I tend to Dillon all the things and have not been disappointed.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I tend to Dillon all the things and have not been disappointed.

Which other dies have you used, that you are comparing your Dillon dies to, to form that opinion?

 

[Gone Hiking]

Which other dies have you used, that you are comparing your Dillon dies to, to form that opinion?

I didn't compare them to anything. I simply stated, "I tend to Dillon all the things and have not been disappointed", as in, they work well and have never given me issues. I made High Master in NRA High Power using their dies and a 550 press. I'm a satisfied customer, that's all.

But since you asked, I have RCBS and Redding dies as well. I did have issues with RCBS dies once, and the de-priming pin that always falls out of the Redding die drives me nuts. Again, I've never had an issue with Dillon dies, though a micrometer $eating $tem would be a convenient addition when changing bullet types.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I didn't compare them to anything. I simply stated, "I tend to Dillon all the things and have not been disappointed", as in, they work well and have never given me issues. I made High Master in NRA High Power using their dies and a 550 press. I'm a satisfied customer, that's all.

Sorry, I read your post incorrectly.

FWIW: The Dillon 550 is an excellent press for loading accurate rifle rounds...likely better than any other of their offerings

 

[hdbiker]

After getting my 1911, I ponyed up for RCBS carbide dies, they work great, I upgraded my old C&H.38.357 dies to LEE carbide they work great too

 

[OLDE RETIRED COASTIE]

all my dies work well when I do my part. I have Lee, Lyman, RCBS, and have no problem. All my pistol dies have carbide sizing dies, and my rifle dies, well they work just fine. I have RCBS in 45-70, a three die set, and my 30-06 are also RCBS. Like I said if I do my part they all work well. I just have to remember to lube my rifle cases.

 

[OLDE RETIRED COASTIE]

I was told by CH, that for carbide, you only need the carbide sizing die, the other dies are steel. I am not sure if that is correct for everyone but seems to be ok to me

 

[lordpaxman]

The carbide sizing die isn’t solid carbide, it’s steel with a carbide ring at the die opening that sizes the case. The other dies in the set are typically just steel, with perhaps a coating here or there. There may be other variations where the carbide insert is tapered or multiple (two ring) versions.

 

[OLDE RETIRED COASTIE]

that is basicly what CH told me about their dies. I would assume that is true of all dies made today.