Difference between m38 and m44?

[chetrogers]

Now i am young and dumb so go easy on me .But im curiuos what is the difference between a m38 and a m44..Thanks for any info

 

[StuporDave]

M44 has an attached, folding bayonet. M38 doesn't. Other than that, not much.

Dave

 

[chetrogers]

Thank you dave.Is the time error about the same..Im thinking of getting a m38 .Is the Knife legal?

 

[StuporDave]

Both are WWII era rifles (carbines, actually). The model is the year adopted. Both did see service in the war.
The bayonet is more of a spike than a knife. I think the proper term is a cruciform bayonet. It is legal as these are C&R guns.
I've got a M44, and it's a fun gun. Can be a little hard on the shoulder after a long session, though. If you get a chance to fire it at night/dusk, do it. Puts out a quite impressive muzzle blast

Dave

 

[Cosmoline]

The M-44 is not as good a design in my opinion. The bayonet adds quite a bit of weight, and in the end it's a heavy carbine. It feels heavier than the full size 91/30 rifle.

The M-38 is quite light and handy, but it's much harder to find pristine condition M-38's around. I haven't been able to find one yet, anyway.

 

[chetrogers]

Im thinking of getting a m44 .I like the idea of seeing a bayonet On a gun that probably has a history.Not that a m38 wouldnt.I have been searching the net for a picture of one witht he bayonet out does anyone have a pic of one.Also is there a latch that you push to keep it out so it doesnt fold up.Thanks guys.

 

[pbhome71]

You can try Bob's Russian-Mosin-Nagant site.. http://www.russian-mosin-nagant.com/M44.htm

There are some picture of M44 with bayonet extended.

-Pat

 

[chetrogers]

Thanks for the link .I must have one

 

[GD]

A lot of M38s are counterbored and have M44 stocks. I finally got lucky and found a 1944 m38 in original stock and pristine bore. My Soviet M38 and M44s all shoot about the same, about 3-4" groups at 100 yards. My Polish M44 will shoot a little better at 2-3" groups. They are sure fun to shoot!

 

[Blackcloud6]

I'm not sure about this but I think M44 were made as carbines from the start but the M38's were made from rifles by cutting down the barrel.

 

[Greg L]

Blackcloud,

It's the 91/59s that are made of cut down 91/30s. They are both the same size (all three if you include the M44) but the 38's rear sight only goes to 1000 meters where the 59's show mill work where the #'s from 11-20 (1100-2000) were ground off when the barrel was cut down.

Greg

 

[Redlg155]

I didn't get as lucky GD...

My M38 has pristine rifling and it not counterbored, but it does have the M44 stock. Oh well....it's still a nice rifle that I most likely will never sell.



Good Shooting
Red

 

[chetrogers]

Being so old are these guns really safe to shoot..If buying from a gun store im sure they would enspect them for shooting..Right?

 

[Greg L]

Yes they are, no they don't (generally ).

There might be a headspace problem with any old milsurp. You can get a set of gauges or pay a gunsmith to check it out to be safe. Or you can do like I generally do & fire a couple of rounds from my hip first (checking the fired cases for any splits or strange bulges) before sticking my face up to the stock.

There can be a problem but in my experience it is fairly rare.

Greg

 

[Mildot]

I have a Polish M44 and love it. It is a fun gun to shoot and very accurate.

 

[Beetle Bailey]

Mildot That is a nice looking M-44. I read in a few places that the Polish M-44s are generally the prettiest and I guess it must be true.

 

[Blackcloud6]

t's the 91/59s that are made of cut down 91/30s.

Ah yes, Thanks for the correction Greg.

 

[BowStreetRunner]

Mildot that has to be the best looking M44 I have ever seen!
beautiful
BSR

 

[Mildot]

Thanks guys!

I only have 2 military bolt guns left, the Mosin and an Enfield No4 MK2. They are great old guns.

The Mosins are a lot of fun to shoot, they really put out a fireball.

Mike

 

[MatthewVanitas]

Hey Chet, If you're not already convinced:

go to www.ammoman.com and check out the prices on 7.62x54R ammo for a Moisin Nagant. Pretty hard to beat. Just remember, if it doesn't specifically say "non-corrosive", then it is corrosive, and you need to clean it promptly after shooting (nasty salts in the ammo residue). But even the modern non-corrosive ammo is cheaper than most other cartridges. I bought an Enfield as my first gun, not realizing that .303 ammo was a bit scarce...

 

[chetrogers]

Thanks for the link..Can they ship ammo to your house or do they have to ship to FFL..thanks

 

[Beetle Bailey]

chetrogers yes, you can get ammo shipped to your house, as long as you fill out the ammo statement saying you are old enough. BTW, IINM when the ammo is delivered, it should be adult signature required but I have had the delivery guy just leave it on my doorstep (which is fine with me since I wasn't home) but also kinda not right .

Mildot Hey, that's a nice Enfield. . .

 

[MatthewVanitas]

Not to live vicariously through others' purchases, but what the heck. If I'd bought a Moisin Nagant, I'd get the Mojo aperture sights for it. Most battle rifles of that era (except Enfields and Springfields and such) had sights like a modern pistol: notch in the rear, blade in the front. These Mojo sights are modern aperture sights, also called "peep" or "ghost ring" sights, which I find much easier to use. Most modern military firearms use this type of sight. You peep through a hole, your eye naturally centers the blade, accuracy improves. The neat thing about these is that they can be installed by any knucklehead, and don't permanently alter the rifle. I'm not a paid shill, I'm just really intrigued by the product. Type mojo into the search engine to read reviews by THRers who've used them.



Let us know what you end up getting, just make sure you research thoroughly before purchase. Good hunting.

 

[chetrogers]

Not knowing much on these guns What should i be looking when i go to the gun store.What quesitons should i ask and what should i be looking for.Thanks guys

 

[Beetle Bailey]

Do you have "Big 5" sporting goods up in Oregon? Down here in Southern California it's a good place to get milsurp rifles. Bring a bore light with you to check the barrel condition. The general rule of thumb with milsurp rifles is that the first priority should be barrel condition (shiny with no pitting). Second is metal condition (no or very little rust, as much blueing as possible, smooth bolt). Third is wood conditon (the worst thing is cracks, then gouges, then dings). Sometimes it is hard to judge a bore's shine because of the cosmoline, though. Always ask if they have more rifles in the back. I've heard that especially with the M38s you might not want one that's been counterbored. Also, if you chose the M44 (I think there are more M44s out there), be aware that the POI changes when you extend the bayonet (vs. keeping it folded). IINM the M44s were meant to be shoot with the bayonet extended but at some shooting ranges you are not allowed to extend the bayonet. If it was me, I'd just zero the sights with the bayonet folded and never stick it out (plus the bayonet just gets dirty if you extended it and that's just one more thing to clean ). First choice for me is a M38 with a excellent bore without counterboring (gotta get it before Cosmoline finds it first ) and second choice is M44 but then I'd try to track down a pretty Polish one. HTH.