Dipping Toe Into Hunting

[Soupy44]

I've been on the fence about taking up a little hunting and I think Christmas dinner has tipped me towards doing it. A friend gave me some backstraps and loins and they were a hit with the family.

I only see myself taking maybe one hog and one deer a year. Is that relatively normal? I want to make sure the investment in time and money will continue to pay off.

I'm a life long target shooter (smallbore, high-power, bullseye). I do not own a suitable hunting rifle. Closest is a 40X in 308 I use for long range matches.

Before investing in another rifle (leaning 308 since I already reload for that), would it be worth taking the 40X out on a cushy hunt to a set up blind or stand in good weather where it won't get hurt? My only other option is my service rifle, but I don't think I can hunt with 223 in NC. Both mean hauling a 15lb rifle around.

Or should I borrow something from someone?

Thanks!

 

[crestoncowboy]

I've been on the fence about taking up a little hunting and I think Christmas dinner has tipped me towards doing it. A friend gave me some backstraps and loins and they were a hit with the family.

I only see myself taking maybe one hog and one deer a year. Is that relatively normal? I want to make sure the investment in time and money will continue to pay off.

I'm a life long target shooter (smallbore, high-power, bullseye). I do not own a suitable hunting rifle. Closest is a 40X in 308 I use for long range matches.

Before investing in another rifle (leaning 308 since I already reload for that), would it be worth taking the 40X out on a cushy hunt to a set up blind or stand in good weather where it won't get hurt? My only other option is my service rifle, but I don't think I can hunt with 223 in NC. Both mean hauling a 15lb rifle around.

Or should I borrow something from someone?

Thanks!

No law against 223 in NC.

Unless your on the eastern part where its shotgun only

 

[tominboise]

I wouldn't take your target rifles. I don't know where you live but it sounds like in the southeast US somewhere. One can buy a new bolt action rifle such as a Ruger American for not much money. Probably used rifles everywhere too. I probably wouldn't borrow one (neither a borrower nor lender be....) but that's just how I roll.

I would consider taking a hunter safety class in your area if there are any. It's worth it.

Hunting is a lot of fun interspersed with boredom and times of hard work. I really wouldn't trade it for anything.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

I am the exception to most spot and stalkers and my rifle is nearly 15 lbs as well. A nice, heavy rifle helps make getting back on target after shooting a little easier. It also helps you appreciate Tylenol and muscle relaxers.

.308 is fine for deer hunting as well as most larger game in North America.

With that said, you may use .223 to hunt deer in NC according to their hunting manual. So if you are going to use .223 for deer, most folks suggest shooting heavier bullets (>60gr. and ideally in the 70s).
https://www.ncwildlife.org/licensing/regulations

 

[Milt1]

Hunter don't hunt to see if the investment in time and money will pay off. Once you start hunting I hope you'll develop that understanding!

 

[crestoncowboy]

would consider taking a hunter safety class in your area if there are any

Required to get a hunting license in NC

I am the exception to most spot and stalkers and my rifle is nearly 15 lbs as well. A nice, heavy rifle helps make getting back on target after shooting a little easier. It also helps you appreciate Tylenol and muscle relaxers.

.308 is fine for deer hunting as well as most larger game in North America.

With that said, you may use .223 to hunt deer in NC according to their hunting manual. So if you are going to use .223 for deer, most folks suggest shooting heavier bullets (>60gr. and ideally in the 70s).
https://www.ncwildlife.org/licensing/regulations

I used a 223 for years. Never lost a deer using 55 gr vmax. Buddy used a 222 and has one of the top 10 deer recorded in NC with a rifle. Was a bang flop.

I don't know where you hog hunt in NC. We don't have any in the north west.

 

[Telum Pisces]

I hunt to provide meat for my family of five. We do not buy beef. All of our red meat is deer. The rifle setup for hunting is such a small part of the whole hunting experience. But a few questions?

1. How do you intend to hunt? Spot and stalk? Climbing tree stand?
2. Private or public land?
3. Shooting house over green fields?
4. Distance walking?
5. Shooting rest available or not?

All of these lends itself to what kind of rifle makes sense for the hunter.

Too heavy and a long walk can make a hunt less desirable.

Stick with .30 caliber bullets or more for deer sized animals. Less can get the job done. But killing an animal and recovering it lends itself to hunting rounds with enough energy to pass through the animal and leave a blood trail to track the animal. Any caliber will kill. Killing the animal and recovering it is done easier with .30 caliber hunting rounds. .308 is a fine choice and plenty of ammo and loads out there.

Finding land to hunt where there are good deer populations can be a challenge depending on where you are and resources at your disposal. Bumming off of a buddy for to occasional hunt is ok. But once you want to get into hunting fully as a hobby or to put food on the table, you are going to be expected to put in your own effort in finding land to hunt on. And finding the land and deer is the fun part to me at least. I get more enjoyment in setting up our land to attract and hold deer. It is part of the enjoyment of being a hunter.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

I used a 223 for years. Never lost a deer using 55 gr vmax. Buddy used a 222 and has one of the top 10 deer recorded in NC with a rifle. Was a bang flop.

There are many tools for a given job, but using the right tool will be much more forgiving than using a less well matched tool. Would you rather take a rowboat from the mainland to Hawaii or a cruise ship? Both will get you there, but one has obvious advantages over the other.

General rule of thumb, the smaller and less powerful the cartridge, the more precise the shooting needs to be. A polar bear was killed with a .22 long, dropped in place with the first shot, then the head was shot several more times with quality assurance shots so that the hunter was sure the bear was dead, but apparently none of the other shots were needed. https://www.ammoland.com/2017/06/be...-world-record-grizzly-and-more/#axzz7ogubJzMT

That a buddy used a .222 to get a record dear really isn't very amazing from a caliber perspective given that the polar bear was so much larger and the .22 long cartridge so much weaker, right?

The OP isn't an experience hunter, just an experienced shooter. .223 will certainly work, but then again if legal, so would a .22 lr.

This guy hunts deer at over 400 yards with a subsonic .458 socom. Kills them dead, some DRT. I would not suggest most hunters, especially not a new hunter, use a subsonic at over 400 yards for deer, either. It can be done, no doubt about it, but it isn't the best best and likely isn't even a better choice. Of course, he isn't inexperienced about hunting, either.



Better for a new hunter to not be hobbled by a less suitable caliber when he has a better caliber available. He currently has 2 rifles, similar weights, different calibers. Carrying the .223 isn't going to save him any work, but the .308 certainly may.

 

[Soupy44]

Thank you everyone for the feedback! It's all in how you phrase things isn't it!

I teach tennis for a living and I can quickly identify who take up the sport but their goals and commitment don't align. They don't last. That's the main purpose of my post, to see if your experience on my comments raises any red flags.

Some of my motivation comes from looking to expand what I cook for holiday meals. I'm getting a little tired of roasted turkey, prime rib, and I did a pork crown roast once. The idea of some bone in back straps or bone in pork roast I harvested myself would add to the variety. I have a 12ga shotgun I could use for turkey, but turkey hunting isn't peaking my interest the same way deer or hog hunting is. Having a freezer full of meat to use the rest of the year is also a nice thought. I have the tools necessary to butcher and grind. Space to do it is a bit of a mystery...

RE Telum Pisces:
1 - No idea
2 - No idea. I have some friends with private land. I considered a guided hunt for my first hunt.
3 - That sounds ideal. I've seen some youtube videos of what look like mini raised cabins. That's a lot more cushy setup than I was figuring I'd end up in.
4 - Probably won't be too limiting of a factor. I'm not in the shape I used to be, but I do teach tennis full time. I'm sure carrying a kill back adds to the level of difficulty. I'm an eagle scout who did a lot of backpacking hiking (37 now, writing this makes me feel old and wonder how I'd do on a 50mi backpacking trip today).
5 - This is probably the part I have thought the most about. I haven't thought much about shooting off a rest, but it sounds nice. Back when I shot a lot of smallbore, I was a better shooter slung up in prone than off a bench. I average mid to high 90s offhand in high power, meaning I hit a 7in circle most of the time from 200y in what I'm sure is a very ideal set of circumstances compared to hunting.

I am mainly leaning 308 since I'm already shooting that elsewhere. I don't see a need to add more reloading equipment if I don't need to. A lever action 45-70 has struck my fancy during my research, not really sure why.

 

[crestoncowboy]

That a buddy used a .222 to get a record dear really isn't very amazing from a caliber perspective given that the polar bear was so much larger and the cartridge so much weaker, right?

The polar bear and elephant with a 22 is lucky BS. And if it don't fall over then IMO it don't count.

We both used 223 and 222 (and 220 swift and 223 wssm) on deer and they fell just as dead as when I use my 338-378 or 7mm rum. He liked neck shots and I use vitals. He was also a state Trooper from early 80s until recently.....in NC they often serve as wardens when no warden is available. Id always been told you have to use 24 caliber or bigger until I started hunting with him in the 90s. He is the one who told me otherwise. Our book used to say 24 or larger BOTTLENECKED HANDGUN and supposedly that's where the confusion came in. Id always heard a minimum of 6 inch barrel but he said that wasn't the case either.

The only places I've seen in NC flat enough to need a big gun are eastern or middle NC where its shotgun only anyway. I own land have deer/ bear/ squirrel/ bird hunted in all four hunting regions of NC for 40 years.

Never saw or heard of a hog though, but I'm mostly on the coast or north west. Buddies from fl talk about them.

 

[gspn]

Your first question was about the normality of taking one hog and one deer per year. On average, that's probably normal. I know many people who only hunt one or two days a year, and they don't kill anything when they go. Then there are people like me (and others on this site), who when I had time to do so, hunted every available day from the opening of bow season in October until the end of primitive weapon season on Jan 31, and hunted in multiple states. My freezer was always full. There's a range of outcomes, but certainly a deer per year is a fairly normal one.

Second question was whether you should use a 40x in 308, a 223, or borrow a rifle. If the 223 is legal and you use the right bullet and proper shot placement you'll have no problem with it. I know nothing about the 40x rifle, but you mention it's 15 lbs. For people who ride a 4 wheeler to a blind, then sit in a box all day, the weight of the rifle should be largely irrelevant. If you plan on stalking with the rifle, then the 15 lbs would become a drag after a while.

You say you could borrow a rifle, which is costless, and if it makes you feel better about the whole thing, there's not much downside to it. Perhaps the only additional "cost" to you would be taking the time to go shoot it on the range before you take it to the field.

If it were me, I'd go with something I already owned just to see what I thought of it. You may decide that you really don't like sitting alone in the woods for long periods of time, often in uncomfortable weather. Alternatively, you may love it so much that you wonder why you've not been doing it your whole life. You could get hooked on it, spend the entire fall season away from home every weekend, and gear up for a whole new chapter of your life.

You won't know til you go, and you've already got equipment that will get the job done. I'd go with that, and let your experience dictate your next moves.

 

[.308 Norma]

I only see myself taking maybe one hog and one deer a year. Is that relatively normal?

That really depends on where you hunt. As I've stated before on THR, only about 1 in 3 deer hunters in Idaho even get a deer.
That generally works out okay for my wife and me because we're both avid hunters and we've been at it a long time. So, the "odds" are in our favor - one or the other of us is probably going to get kill a deer every year. This year it was me.
I don't think there are any wild hogs in Idaho. And going by some of the things I read here on THR, not having wild hogs around might be good thing.

I want to make sure the investment in time and money will continue to pay off.

Hunter don't hunt to see if the investment in time and money will pay off.

What Milt1 said.

 

[courtgreene]

Thank you everyone for the feedback! It's all in how you phrase things isn't it!

I teach tennis for a living and I can quickly identify who take up the sport but their goals and commitment don't align. They don't last. That's the main purpose of my post, to see if your experience on my comments raises any red flags.

Some of my motivation comes from looking to expand what I cook for holiday meals. I'm getting a little tired of roasted turkey, prime rib, and I did a pork crown roast once. The idea of some bone in back straps or bone in pork roast I harvested myself would add to the variety. I have a 12ga shotgun I could use for turkey, but turkey hunting isn't peaking my interest the same way deer or hog hunting is. Having a freezer full of meat to use the rest of the year is also a nice thought. I have the tools necessary to butcher and grind. Space to do it is a bit of a mystery...

RE Telum Pisces:
1 - No idea
2 - No idea. I have some friends with private land. I considered a guided hunt for my first hunt.
3 - That sounds ideal. I've seen some youtube videos of what look like mini raised cabins. That's a lot more cushy setup than I was figuring I'd end up in.
4 - Probably won't be too limiting of a factor. I'm not in the shape I used to be, but I do teach tennis full time. I'm sure carrying a kill back adds to the level of difficulty. I'm an eagle scout who did a lot of backpacking hiking (37 now, writing this makes me feel old and wonder how I'd do on a 50mi backpacking trip today).
5 - This is probably the part I have thought the most about. I haven't thought much about shooting off a rest, but it sounds nice. Back when I shot a lot of smallbore, I was a better shooter slung up in prone than off a bench. I average mid to high 90s offhand in high power, meaning I hit a 7in circle most of the time from 200y in what I'm sure is a very ideal set of circumstances compared to hunting.

I am mainly leaning 308 since I'm already shooting that elsewhere. I don't see a need to add more reloading equipment if I don't need to. A lever action 45-70 has struck my fancy during my research, not really sure why.

Where in nc are you? I’m asking for a specific reason. I’ll reveal that reason in two connected responses to other things mentioned here:

1. yes hunters safety should be taken, and yes it is required here for a license, with one exception. One can get an apprentice license (hunting heritage program) and hunt within sight of a licensed hunter to test the waters without a license or hunters safety. This is to encourage people to give it a try.
2. If you’re close to someone willing to show you the ropes, and with access to land that holds deer (most in nc does), then finding someone to show you their hunting method and let you give it a try is the best way to test the waters. They’ll probably also let you use a rifle to spare you that expense since you have to be with them anyway.

Also, i have killed deer with .223 and my 9 year old uses one so no problem with that but I generally grab a .308

 

[Soupy44]

Hi Courtgreene,

I'm in Raleigh.

To those asking about hogs in NC, I've found some guided hunts just SE of me is the Smithfield area (no irony with that at all...)

 

[Stevel]

*Yes you should take up hunting.
*Yes, your 308 target rifle will be fine. Just use a hunting bullet about the same weight as you already shoot.
*No, it won't pay off in time or money, but will make up for it in enjoyment.
*Walmart has inecpensive hunting clothes.

 

[JeeperCreeper]

This is a great excuse to buy a new rifle.

I'm for it!

And a new rifle will be better for the job. Go light, tough, cheap. I also prefer a 3 POS safety or similar. I think 308 is perfect all-arounder since you already have the round

 

[earlthegoat2]

If I wanted to dip my toes into hunting and I knew I would be sitting in a blind then I would absolutely use what you have already and it would be the 40X for me.

 

[courtgreene]

Hi Courtgreene,

I'm in Raleigh.

To those asking about hogs in NC, I've found some guided hunts just SE of me is the Smithfield area (no irony with that at all...)

I’m nowhere near Raleigh. Someone may be along shortly who is and can advise. I’m in WNC. Going pretty much any direction from Raleigh you’ll find public land, and plenty of deer. You'll find lots of people already hunting on it as well. Best bet is to find someone willing to show you, take you, and invite you onto private land.
You’re probably looking at hunting from an elevated blind too.

 

[Wolfshead]

I have a Tikka T3x in .308 Win and love it!
.308 is a great round for deer (especially NC sized deer) and hogs.
Since you already handload for it I would stay with that.
Please REMEMBER they call it “Hunting” and not killing for a reason.
Just because you go hunting doesn’t mean you’re going to get something. It’s a little more difficult than just going into the woods.
I’ve hunted NC for deer in the past and I live in the Northeast where I do most of my hunting.
I’m not sure where you live in NC but if you’re interested I can give you the name of the outfitter I used. They’re great guys and I’m pretty sure you’ll have a great experience and get a chance to harvest, just message me.

 

[FL-NC]

You can get an adequate rifle/scope (sometimes together) from places like wally world or academy without breaking the bank. I would advise going for a lighter sporter type rifle, since deer tend to come from whatever direction they decide to, and your planned method to support your rifle may not line up with where that deer actually is, so plan on needing to take a shot offhand (without support).

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The polar bear and elephant with a 22 is lucky BS.

Luck has nothing to do with it. She knew what she was doing and shot from a very short distance. She picked the absolute best target for what she had. She was an experienced huntress, unlike the OP.

 

[crestoncowboy]

if your going to have to hunt in a blind then use whatever rifle you want. I almost never use a blind. I walk so small and light is better

We have 6 deer a year, minimum (in some years we had unlimited doe) . Then we have depredation permits for crops as well. So our deer experience is plenty. Any shot in the vitals is a clean kill with any of our whitetail from 222/223 on up. I have rifles up to 338 lapua. I don't carry them hunting whitetail. That's a thin skinned, light bone animal that weighs the same as a human... and not even one of those super fat people you see on TV. I have land in Ashe, Watauga, and Wilkes. Our deer are big as any in NC. Down toward the coast they favor the grinches dog when he had his horn on. A Cannon isn't needed

 

[jmr40]

I'd use the rifle you have until you get more experience. Then you'll have a better idea of what direction you want to go. I hunt public land in mountainous areas and a lighter rifle is important to me. I may walk as much as 5-10 miles some days and none is level. But for people hunting private land from a stand weight isn't important.

 

[shooter1niner]

Lots of good suggestions here. My suggestion would be to leave the match rifles to their intended purpose. I wouldn't borrow a rifle. There are plenty of good, relatively inexpensive rifles available for hunting. I like some of the Savage options for a hunting rifle. I purchased a used Savage 110 in .308 for my son awhile ago and he will not part with it. While not a big fan of Ruger, they do produce a good product. Winchester Model 70's and Remington model 700's are very good but are bound to be a bit more expensive. The .308 is a great caliber choice and can be loaded up or down as necessary, with lots of components to choose from.

I will also say to get decent optics. I will say to get the best that you can "afford". I liked the Nikon ProStaff scopes. Not top of the line but good. Unfortunately Nikon is out of the scope business...

Finally, don't scrimp on boots. This is another item to get the best you can afford. If you're going to be spending a lot of time sitting in a blind, I like LaCrosse Ice King (big, bulky and warm). Going to be still hunting, you need a somewhat lightly insulated walking boot. I've been hunting for 54 years and still LOVE going out in the woods for deer season. I hope it works out for you, good luck.

 

[buck460XVR]

I want to make sure the investment in time and money will continue to pay off.

.....Thinking hunting is going to save you money in some form is ridiculous. You have to invest in more than just a gun. What is your time worth? Odds are in order to hunt you are going to have to give up something else. Hunting is a very time consuming sport. Unless you can walk out your backdoor and hunt, if you have to drive, you better figure at least $10 a trip. Add that to the other costs of hunting and it adds up to expensive meat. Do you have the appropriate clothes and other equipment? One can start with very basic equipment to see if hunting is for them. You have rifles that are meant for target shooting, they should work just as well for hunting. I carried a M1917 Eddystone for most of my rifle hunting career. This was for stand hunting as well as Still/stalk type hunting. While it was like carrying a tree trunk, it's accuracy more than made up for it.

As for amount of game taken......it's very dependent on you. Your skill levels and the abundance of game where you hunt is the determining factor. Around here the average is 1 out of 4 hunters are successful for deer. If the hunt is just to eat, 3 out of 4 are going hungry. If you are looking for good game to eat, I think your reluctance to hunt Turkey is hindering you. I never thought I'd like Turkey hunting till I went for the first time. Now....if I could only hunt one species, it would be Wild Turkey. It is also, next to grouse and pheasant, one of the better eating game animals. Turkey hunting is much like deer hunting as it takes patience and observation skills. Hours of sitting still, for a few brief moments of excitement. Feral Hog would be a animal I would hunt for sport only, and be very particular if I was to eat any of it.

Your investment will only pay off if you enjoy hunting as a sport. If you are looking for cost per pound as a return on your investment, you be better of buying a half of beef and/or a half of hog from the local butcher.