3 gun
Member
If you are not ready to carry a LOADED gun do not bother carrying one. If your gun is not safe loaded, carry a different one. If you do not know what is safe do not carry one.
Do you carry with a round chambered?
- Thread starter XDGirl
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guntotinguy
Member
Absolutely I do now,as once upon a time I didnt and after a little incident that corrected that way of thinking,I have ever since then.
theken206
Member
indeed
It's unfortunate that a number of people who carry guns and have their CHL don't keep a round in the chamber. It just seems to me that when you're in the wrong place at the wrong time, and you have an empty chamber, that BG can easily take the weapon from you then use it on you.
Granted the majority of confrontations seem to end up with the BG/BGs running the minute they see a gun pointed at them. I just don't want to be in that position if they don't.
I also think the primary purpose of going through all that CC crap is to protect yourself and your family.
enfield303
Member
Condition 1. ALWAYS.
Travis McGee
Member
Heck yeah.
Drgong
Member
I know I am one of the few who think condition 3 is acceptable, and i fully expect that condition 1s will insist tat condition three is completely useless.
Also mind you I am a user of the BHP.
However, It is well known that condition two GASP requires a extra action.
However, it has a number of very important advantages that folks never talk about.
The Majority of LEO are killed by there own gun. And while we think that it will not happen to us, as more citizens carry there are going to be increasing cases of the bad guy grabbing a gun from someone and killing them with there own gun. I know folks will say "That will not happen to me" but it happens all the time to LEO, so lets NOT pretend that this will not be a issue. The advantage is that if you have it in condition three if you are disarmed that the BG has to rack the slide, which he will NOT train for, which gives you time to protect yourself.
Secondly, if you think you are going to be disarmed, you can quickly drop the magazine and at least in the BHP the gun is useless without the magazine.
Secondly, if someone trains for condition three they can draw, rack, and aim far quicker then most people can draw in the first place.
Thirdly, in a self defense situation, adrenaline is pumping though your body, and the fact that you pump the slide five you body the focus it needs to pump three well AIMED shots, and not pull and spray the place.
Many times people STORE guns in condition three, and it is very important to train the same way. It ruins the training if you walk around condition 1 all day, then store in condition three and then expect to be able to use it when you wake up in the bump in the night. Condition 1 storage is very questionable in my mind if you have any type of children in the house. NOt that condition 3 is safe, but it is much less likely for a child to shoot a condition 3 gun then condition 1.
And most important, a holstered gun in condition 1 just needs one failure and you have a AD, most likely putting a bullet in your formodial artery and your gone.
I know that folks find condition 3 as "Stupid" but if you really think you need to have quick pull, then go to condition 0, after all, a good holster will make sure the trigger won't go off.
Also mind you I am a user of the BHP.
However, It is well known that condition two GASP requires a extra action.
However, it has a number of very important advantages that folks never talk about.
The Majority of LEO are killed by there own gun. And while we think that it will not happen to us, as more citizens carry there are going to be increasing cases of the bad guy grabbing a gun from someone and killing them with there own gun. I know folks will say "That will not happen to me" but it happens all the time to LEO, so lets NOT pretend that this will not be a issue. The advantage is that if you have it in condition three if you are disarmed that the BG has to rack the slide, which he will NOT train for, which gives you time to protect yourself.
Secondly, if you think you are going to be disarmed, you can quickly drop the magazine and at least in the BHP the gun is useless without the magazine.
Secondly, if someone trains for condition three they can draw, rack, and aim far quicker then most people can draw in the first place.
Thirdly, in a self defense situation, adrenaline is pumping though your body, and the fact that you pump the slide five you body the focus it needs to pump three well AIMED shots, and not pull and spray the place.
Many times people STORE guns in condition three, and it is very important to train the same way. It ruins the training if you walk around condition 1 all day, then store in condition three and then expect to be able to use it when you wake up in the bump in the night. Condition 1 storage is very questionable in my mind if you have any type of children in the house. NOt that condition 3 is safe, but it is much less likely for a child to shoot a condition 3 gun then condition 1.
And most important, a holstered gun in condition 1 just needs one failure and you have a AD, most likely putting a bullet in your formodial artery and your gone.
I know that folks find condition 3 as "Stupid" but if you really think you need to have quick pull, then go to condition 0, after all, a good holster will make sure the trigger won't go off.
Valkman
Member
C&L whether it's a 1911 or an XD. I don't "guess" whether it's going to be safe today and where I live doesn't have much crime. Doesn't matter - C&L all the way.
Drgong, everything you say is true BUT nothing you have said overcomes, IMHO, the overriding and enormous disadvantage of condition 3.
From condition 3, you must use two hands to quickly make your gun ready, and THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO REASON to believe that in an emergency you will have the use of both hands. Unless you can rack the slide quickly, you're holding a useless hunk of metal (and in some cases, metal and plastic). There is just no way you can count on being able to rack the slide in an emergency.
So to me, condition 3 has no worthwhile advantages.
(Yes I know that there are ways of racking the slide with one hand. But they are neither quick nor sure and are best practiced and reserved for exigent situations. And I also know that there are some folks who will claim to be able to rack the slide quickly with one hand -- and to those worthies, I can only say "congratulations.")
From condition 3, you must use two hands to quickly make your gun ready, and THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO REASON to believe that in an emergency you will have the use of both hands. Unless you can rack the slide quickly, you're holding a useless hunk of metal (and in some cases, metal and plastic). There is just no way you can count on being able to rack the slide in an emergency.
So to me, condition 3 has no worthwhile advantages.
(Yes I know that there are ways of racking the slide with one hand. But they are neither quick nor sure and are best practiced and reserved for exigent situations. And I also know that there are some folks who will claim to be able to rack the slide quickly with one hand -- and to those worthies, I can only say "congratulations.")
burningsquirrels
Member
if i CARRY there is always one in the chamber.
think of it like this: your gun in one hand, your wife, child, or other valuables in the other.
think of it like this: your gun in one hand, your wife, child, or other valuables in the other.
shadowalker
Member
I don't think condition 3 people are stupid at all and most condition 1 carriers I know started out in condition 3 and moved to 1 as they became more comfortable, I did.
Some counter points
Less actions are always faster, while it is possible to be fast at drawing racking and firing the same person will be able to draw and fire faster.
Bad guys are better trained than most people think, in a lot of cases they are now getting more range time than police officers. They have grown up watching guns on TV and video games, it will take very little to no time for them to rack the slide.
Kids know how to take a handgun from condition 3 to condition 1 and I don't see any increase in safety, the safety comes from training them how to be safe with firearms and keeping them from having access to them until they are, once they have access all bets are off.
In life and death scenarios the body enters survival mode and if you don't heavily train it is entirely likely a person will forget to rack the slide, it happens and people have been shot because of it.
The half second it takes to rack the slide probably wont have much of an impact on the adrenaline dump as far as accuracy, in fact you now have LESS time to aim and get hits on the BG because of having to rack the slide. Spray and pray is a training issue and probably increases as time to respond decreases.
Gunvault handgun safes make it easy to more safely store condition 1 handguns, I store my carry firearm that way when it isn't on my hip because it is also my bedside gun. A holster that covers the trigger and proper gun handling greatly reduces the chances of an AD.
I do not carry my Sig in condition 0 because it offers no benefit to me but I would not feel more prone to have an AD if I did.
Some counter points
Less actions are always faster, while it is possible to be fast at drawing racking and firing the same person will be able to draw and fire faster.
Bad guys are better trained than most people think, in a lot of cases they are now getting more range time than police officers. They have grown up watching guns on TV and video games, it will take very little to no time for them to rack the slide.
Kids know how to take a handgun from condition 3 to condition 1 and I don't see any increase in safety, the safety comes from training them how to be safe with firearms and keeping them from having access to them until they are, once they have access all bets are off.
In life and death scenarios the body enters survival mode and if you don't heavily train it is entirely likely a person will forget to rack the slide, it happens and people have been shot because of it.
The half second it takes to rack the slide probably wont have much of an impact on the adrenaline dump as far as accuracy, in fact you now have LESS time to aim and get hits on the BG because of having to rack the slide. Spray and pray is a training issue and probably increases as time to respond decreases.
Gunvault handgun safes make it easy to more safely store condition 1 handguns, I store my carry firearm that way when it isn't on my hip because it is also my bedside gun. A holster that covers the trigger and proper gun handling greatly reduces the chances of an AD.
I do not carry my Sig in condition 0 because it offers no benefit to me but I would not feel more prone to have an AD if I did.
Settle...settle...
Wasn't aware I was "dogging" you-if I was "dogging" anyone (was I?) it's folks who tend to deal in superlatives, which I don't think you did.
You know...the ones that don't realize everything's a tradeoff and tend to make definitive statements like:
Guns don’t need no stinking (magazine) safety
It’s the best-HANDS DOWN!
Brand X is the best-PERIOD!
Conditon 1 is the ONLY way to carry!
Well, you get the picture? When you run across someone like that, it’s best to just move along as there’s going to be nothing to see there.
I once stated one reason I like the USPC in Variant 1 is I feel it’s the safest way for a civilian to carry if you’re going to keep one in the pipe (de-cocked, safety on), and I feel one of the first things a newbie should consider before trying to figure out what gun he wants is in what condition does he/she want to carry-then maybe decide on the weapon. ‘Course, I realize one’s preferences may change over time.
As expected, I got flamed by the superlative crowd telling me why X was the best/only/safest etc way to carry.
If I were to take the attitude of some, I might say “if you don’t have enough situational awareness to not allow yourself to get into a position where you don’t have enough time to chamber a round, you shouldn’t be carrying!” (Sounds rather arrogant, no?)
I think to each his own…and knock off the attitudes!
Yeah…I know that’s gonna happen!
Wasn't aware I was "dogging" you-if I was "dogging" anyone (was I?
) it's folks who tend to deal in superlatives, which I don't think you did.You know...the ones that don't realize everything's a tradeoff and tend to make definitive statements like:
Guns don’t need no stinking (magazine) safety
It’s the best-HANDS DOWN!
Brand X is the best-PERIOD!
Conditon 1 is the ONLY way to carry!
Well, you get the picture? When you run across someone like that, it’s best to just move along as there’s going to be nothing to see there.
I once stated one reason I like the USPC in Variant 1 is I feel it’s the safest way for a civilian to carry if you’re going to keep one in the pipe (de-cocked, safety on), and I feel one of the first things a newbie should consider before trying to figure out what gun he wants is in what condition does he/she want to carry-then maybe decide on the weapon. ‘Course, I realize one’s preferences may change over time.
As expected, I got flamed by the superlative crowd telling me why X was the best/only/safest etc way to carry.
If I were to take the attitude of some, I might say “if you don’t have enough situational awareness to not allow yourself to get into a position where you don’t have enough time to chamber a round, you shouldn’t be carrying!” (Sounds rather arrogant, no?)
I think to each his own…and knock off the attitudes!
Yeah…I know that’s gonna happen!
Piney Woods
Member
Yes, always.
10-Ring
Member
Of course -- it would be like taking an empty gun to a knife fight 
PaulBk
Member
Only on days ending with "y".
-Paul
-Paul
Quick Karl
member
HK USP Compact - cocked & locked - at all times.
romma
Member
Abso-positive-lutely... Iworry about having enough time as it is just to draw if I need to without catching a bullet in the head in the meantime. I figure if Iam going to carry with the chance I might need it, then might as well be as ready as possible.
gidaeon
Member
Yes (...though I too was hesitant at first). My DAO without decocker makes me a little more cautious than those with ext. safety, but they're all built and designed to be carried that way. If I can't trust a holstered, chambered weapon then it shouldn't be used.
Its a recipe for disaster trying to maintain a mindset of "loaded" versus "unloaded" & chambered versus un-chambered. All guns are loaded and chambered period. So if I'm treating it that way, it might as well really be chambered & ready. I sometimes have a hard enough time remembering what exactly I was still supposed to get at the store, keeping track of what status I'm at is an unwelcome factor. That said I understand as a relative newbie myself that someone just getting used to the whole matter may take a temporary progressive step in getting comfortable.
Its a recipe for disaster trying to maintain a mindset of "loaded" versus "unloaded" & chambered versus un-chambered. All guns are loaded and chambered period. So if I'm treating it that way, it might as well really be chambered & ready. I sometimes have a hard enough time remembering what exactly I was still supposed to get at the store, keeping track of what status I'm at is an unwelcome factor. That said I understand as a relative newbie myself that someone just getting used to the whole matter may take a temporary progressive step in getting comfortable.
My bedside gun is at condition 1 just like my carry.
Police officers have a very different situation than civilians who conceal carry. They advertise that they have guns. We don't.
If I draw my concealed carry it is because I need to use it and it WILL be chambered.
Are you saying a BG will grab your concealed carry weapon from concealment...or that you will draw your weapon but not rack it? Are you saying that he will know how to spot and steal your concealed weapon but not how to rack the slide?
I don't see any advantage for carrying condition 3...none.
Police officers have a very different situation than civilians who conceal carry. They advertise that they have guns. We don't.
If I draw my concealed carry it is because I need to use it and it WILL be chambered.
Are you saying a BG will grab your concealed carry weapon from concealment...or that you will draw your weapon but not rack it? Are you saying that he will know how to spot and steal your concealed weapon but not how to rack the slide?
I don't see any advantage for carrying condition 3...none.
Kayback
Member
I want my gun to go BANG with the minimum of messing around. With my Glock all I have to do is pull the trigger. With my 1911 I have to grip it properly (Thumb on saftey, grip saftey depressed) and pull my trigger.
If your weapon is in a decent holster, I see no drawbacks at all to carrying a loaded weapon. If you exercise caution in holstering it, it isn't a danger.
KBK
If your weapon is in a decent holster, I see no drawbacks at all to carrying a loaded weapon. If you exercise caution in holstering it, it isn't a danger.
KBK
michiganfan
Member
Is there another way?
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