Does a little printing really matter?

[MCgunner]

Interested in opinions on this. Texas law states that the gun carried concealed should not be obvious to the general public, or some such wording, not verbatim. What's your opinion on a gun in a pocket showing a little outline or a bulge above the belt through a T shirt? Do you think that could be construed in court as "obvious", or by a law enforcement officer? I've always been a bit worried about such things, but I don't know that the general public would ever notice such things, frankly. I'd have to be really observing with the intent to find someone printing to be able to notice it myself. I mean, there's something poking out on a T shirt, heck, nearly everyone carries a cell phone. And, unless you can obviously see the outline of a 642 in someone's pocket, how are you going to know what it is?

 

[dtalley]

I think you answered your question yourself. In my experience, be it limited, people really don't notice whether there is a gun printing or not. Most people don't look for something like that. The only people looking are those of us carrying.

 

[Flame Red]

I pocket carry all the time and since I always dress casual and have large pockets. The shape is very plain for those peices that I do not use a holster. Never have had anyone scream yet. Most people think it is a wallet or cell phone I guess. Even when I am in line with law enforcement they have never said anything to me, and I would think they would be the ones that are trained to be aware. Maybe I do not look that menacing.

 

[bigmike45]

MCGunner

I dont worry too much about it. I carry my PT-145 in my right front pocket everywhere I go and have yet to be "made" by anyone. I think, like you, I am more critical of myself and my gun printing than I should be. I have even gone to friends houses with that gun in the pocket, and they have never made any printing comments. I have a couple of cops that work part time for me and they have never "made" me. Recently the Chief of Police of my little community was amazed when a "friend" pointed out that I conceal a gun that he considers to be too big for pocket carry. The Chief had been around me at least a dozen times when I was carrying and never noticed anything out of the ordinary, and I was concerned he might notice and really give me hell about it.

tex

 

[Geronimo45]

If you're wearing clothes so tight that people can read the serial number off your gun, that could be a problem.
Bulges can be from sloppy ironing, wrinkles, cell phones, wallets, keys, money, etc. Unless you want to get in trouble for making false reports, you don't want to be calling the police about a bulge in the pocket, shirt, coat.

"He's gotta gun" calls usually/always come from the weapon being visible - poorly concealed so that it is seen by passers-by. If you happened to be visible, a cop might ask to see your license and tell you to conceal your gun better - TX police have been a first-rate group in my experience.

 

[crebralfix]

99.9% of the people don't even notice OPEN carry.

 

[tubeshooter]

^ I dispute that....

Back in my younger days I worked a convenience store at one point. One day I got a rash of particularly rude customers in a row, so I put my .38 on my hip open cary style (as is legal in my state) for a couple of hours.


Trust me.... people noticed.

 

[crazyhorse]

MCgunner,
most of the public today is afraid to make much eye contact, and therefore, never pay enough attention to know. That said, my take is "Don't show, and Never tell".
Conceal your weapon as best you can, don't tell your closest friends, and, believe me, the local cops may not say anything, but, they Know.

 

[S&Wfan]

Wordnet has this definition of "Concealed:"

Verb

* S: (v) hide, conceal (prevent from being seen or discovered) "Muslim women hide their faces"; "hide the money"
* S: (v) conceal, hold back, hold in (hold back; keep from being perceived by others) "She conceals her anger well"

Adjective

* S: (adj) concealed, hidden, out of sight (not accessible to view) "concealed (or hidden) damage"; "in stormy weather the stars are out of sight"
* S: (adj) concealed (hidden on any grounds for any motive) "a concealed weapon"; "a concealed compartment in his briefcase"

Thus, "PREVENT from being SEEN or DISCOVERED by others," and "hidden out of sight" would mean that you would NOT be "made" by anyone, civilian or cop.

Concealed means exactly what it says. Here's my opinions on the matter, and what I go by when I carry:


1. A "Concealed" license does not necessarily mean that you are immune from arrest if your handgun is discovered, and this discovery causes a cop to approach you.

2. Many people are freaked by guns, and walking around "printing" a handgun makes people uneasy . . . and this is NOT good for the preservation of our rights to carry. Just because someone is suddenly scared of you because they notice your gun does not mean they are going to TELL you they noticed. Quite the opposite. Same with cops noticing. They may just decide there's no reason to hassle you . . . but they are surely going to keep an eye on you!

3. If anyone can "make" you, and you are "made" by a gang of thieves, you may walk into a sudden attack so that they can steal your gun. I can think of no good outcome to this scenario, whether you get the snot kicked out of you and JUST lose your gun, end up being shot at the onset of the sudden attack . . . or if you shoot your way out of the bad situation.

4. If a bad guy comes in a place seeking to commit an armed robbery, and cases the joint and sees the print of your gun, he'll shoot you first . . . before he proceeds with his robbery. You might as well be wearing a shirt saying "Shoot Me First," or carry your gun in a "Shoot Me First" vest or fag bag (fanny pack).

WE MUST KEEP IT CONCEALED . . . or else . . . IT ISN'T . . . and the outcome could get nasty!

Food for thought!

T.

 

[Standing Wolf]

99.9% of the people don't even notice OPEN carry.

People don't notice in my small part of Colorado, anyway.

 

[420Stainless]

I agree. More often than not, the bulge under my overhanging t-shirt is my cell phone in its holster. My handgun is usually in a pocket holster. Unless the outline of the bulge is clearly "gun" shaped, or unless you can see enough of the actual piece to determine that it is indeed a firearm, I can't see how it could be described in any definative legal way "as obvious". Even when I'm not carrying, it is not unusual for me to have a bunch of assorted bumps and bulges (tape measure or other tools, cigar case, digital camera, etc.). Why buy garments with pockets in 'em if you don't use 'em?

Of course, if the officer checks out your bulge and uncovers a concealed weapon then it was "obvious". If not, then you get let go and you don't bother to report that your rights were violated by being subjected to an unreasonable search. Probably pointless to report it anyway since a Judge that doesn't respect the 2nd amendment probably doesn't worry too much about the 4th either.

 

[LightningJoe]

I've carried a PT-745 and a Model 85 in my front pocket in Texas and people do in fact notice occasionally, especially the 745 when I'm wearing jeans, but nobody says anything. Some people are really observant. Most aren't.

 

[V-fib]

Usually if I’m worried about printing I’ll just look in the mirror at my front or side or ask my wife if she sees anything. It’s pretty easy to conceal a gun.

 

[tank mechanic]

I agree that 99% of people would never even notice a definitive outline of a firearm, but I always make sure it is completely invisible for that other one percent.

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

Usually if I’m worried about printing I’ll just look in the mirror at my front or side or ask my wife if she sees anything.

Honey does this gun make me look fat?

People don't notice even large bulges. The only thing I worry about is bending over then having the shirt hang up on the grip when carrying IWB but that's easy to casually correct (and it's better to bend at the knees anyway).

 

[JohnKSa]

I don't think it matters much from the perspective of prosecution.

But, as pointed out, there are other reasons that you might want to keep the fact that you're carrying a secret.