Because of an injury, I have limited movement of my shoulder. I usually carry at 3:30, right side in either a OWB or IWB, and sometimes it gets somewhat painful to reach "backwards" to draw my gun. I was wondering, and testing on my own, the possibility of carrying "cross draw". Do we have any "veterans" of carrying in that manner here? What are the pros and cons? Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Does anyone carry "cross draw"?
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Zaydok Allen
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I carry at 9:00 fairly often when a chunk of steel digging into 4:00 gets to be too much. I still carry IWB. It works fine for me as an alternate and I find that with the right jacket or coat I print less than I do at 4:00. It makes riding in a car more comfortable also.
In summer I pocket carry a 642. I don't like IWB when I'm wearing light clothing. I'm pretty lean though so IWB is never truely comfortable to me.
In summer I pocket carry a 642. I don't like IWB when I'm wearing light clothing. I'm pretty lean though so IWB is never truely comfortable to me.
The con is that you're drawing sideways instead of up. This means you have a 2 foot target to stop at instead of a 5-6 foot target.
However, if your injury makes it easier to draw cross draw, that would probably be the better option for you.
However, if your injury makes it easier to draw cross draw, that would probably be the better option for you.
wasr10634unme
Member
search aiwb :appendix in the waistband
holster recommendations :raven concealment, crossbreed quickclip, archangel
holster recommendations :raven concealment, crossbreed quickclip, archangel
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
As Skribs said, if this is the only way that you can carry, then it is the best way for you.
Some of the "cons" can otherwise be:
1) Cross-draw is measurably slower than a strong-side holster. I know a lot of people will say, "not for me!!!" but without the numbers recorded off a shot timer, that's not credible. You must reach farther and must turn the gun and present it in a motion that sweeps around to get on target, meaning you cannot use the "4-count" draw stroke and cannot fire until your draw is complete.
2) Further, the end of your draw is in stopping a horizontal sweep to land on your target, instead of punching the gun straight out at your target, making your first shot accuracy tend to suffer. (Think that isn't so? Set up the targets and the timer and prove it to yourself!)
3) The cross-draw draw stroke is easily blocked/fouled. If you are in a situation where you're truly fighting for/with the gun, an attacker who grapples with you can with some ease bind your strong-side arm, or get his body in the way so you can't snake your hand across to the opposite side to grasp your gun. There are some techniques to minimize that problem, but you'll have to practice keeping your body clear enough to get your firing hand over there. Conversely, the strong-side draw-stroke is very hard to foul or block.
3a) While someone who grapples with you can block you from grasping your gun, your gun is oriented in a way that makes it most easily grabbed by someone facing you.
4) Most ranges, and all competitions, prohibit the use of holsters that orient the muzzle up-range when holstering or drawing (so no cross-draw, shoulder rigs, or SOBs). That can make it difficult to get the critical practice time in with your carry equipment.
Some of the "cons" can otherwise be:
1) Cross-draw is measurably slower than a strong-side holster. I know a lot of people will say, "not for me!!!" but without the numbers recorded off a shot timer, that's not credible. You must reach farther and must turn the gun and present it in a motion that sweeps around to get on target, meaning you cannot use the "4-count" draw stroke and cannot fire until your draw is complete.
2) Further, the end of your draw is in stopping a horizontal sweep to land on your target, instead of punching the gun straight out at your target, making your first shot accuracy tend to suffer. (Think that isn't so? Set up the targets and the timer and prove it to yourself!)
3) The cross-draw draw stroke is easily blocked/fouled. If you are in a situation where you're truly fighting for/with the gun, an attacker who grapples with you can with some ease bind your strong-side arm, or get his body in the way so you can't snake your hand across to the opposite side to grasp your gun. There are some techniques to minimize that problem, but you'll have to practice keeping your body clear enough to get your firing hand over there. Conversely, the strong-side draw-stroke is very hard to foul or block.
3a) While someone who grapples with you can block you from grasping your gun, your gun is oriented in a way that makes it most easily grabbed by someone facing you.
4) Most ranges, and all competitions, prohibit the use of holsters that orient the muzzle up-range when holstering or drawing (so no cross-draw, shoulder rigs, or SOBs). That can make it difficult to get the critical practice time in with your carry equipment.
I sometimes use a cross-draw technique developed by Ed McGivern (See his book, Fast and Fancy Revolver Shooting, available in reprint from www.amazon.com) and it ain't slow with short barreled guns. The handgun is placed just to the left of the belt buckle at about 10:30 to 11:00.
The shooter shifts his feet so they are standing side ways to the target. At this point you twist at the hips counter-clockwise as the hand grips the butt, and that movement will almost pull the gun clear of the holster. Tip the muzzle up at waist level and shoot, or twist again at the hips going clockwise to face more toward the target while lifting the gun to sholder level and taking a two-handed grip.
If you can't do otherwise, practice the draw at home with an unloaded gun. The addition of an laser sight will offer a substantial advantage a training aid, as well for the intended purpose.
The shooter shifts his feet so they are standing side ways to the target. At this point you twist at the hips counter-clockwise as the hand grips the butt, and that movement will almost pull the gun clear of the holster. Tip the muzzle up at waist level and shoot, or twist again at the hips going clockwise to face more toward the target while lifting the gun to sholder level and taking a two-handed grip.
If you can't do otherwise, practice the draw at home with an unloaded gun. The addition of an laser sight will offer a substantial advantage a training aid, as well for the intended purpose.
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Lonestar49
Member
+1
...
Old Fuff has it right..
It's how I carry my 3" SA EMP 9mm 1911
Very comfy,
Ls
...
Old Fuff has it right..
It's how I carry my 3" SA EMP 9mm 1911
Very comfy,
Ls
I carry OWB cross draw most of the time and have for a couple of decades. I found that it's nice to have easy access to my handgun with either hand. My favorite rig is one that is a high ride cross. It conceals well, as it is designed to lay close to the body. It does require a very good belt.
On the plus side, it's easy to "protect" your handgun with your arm when in crowds, and no one seems to notice.
On the plus side, it's easy to "protect" your handgun with your arm when in crowds, and no one seems to notice.
I think Old Fluff responded well to Sam1911. But, I'll add that if done properly, you won't sweep anything but the ground and your target, just as with a strong side draw. And, again if done properly, it isn't any easier to foul a cross as opposed to a strong side draw.
One last point. It can be rather difficult to reach a handgun worn in a high riding strong side at anywhere between three and 5 o'clock with your off hand, especially if you are tangled up with someone. The cross can be easily protected during such times, yet it can be reached with either hand should the chance arise.
Oh, and as to the timer thing, I've done it. Now compared to some speedy folks, I'm slow as molasses, but for me, it's no slower (I won't say it's faster, just to appease you) than a strong side draw.
Now the nice thing here is this, I like cross, you like strong. And, we are both happy with our decisions. Ain't life great, all these choices and we get to make them for ourselves.
One last point. It can be rather difficult to reach a handgun worn in a high riding strong side at anywhere between three and 5 o'clock with your off hand, especially if you are tangled up with someone. The cross can be easily protected during such times, yet it can be reached with either hand should the chance arise.
Oh, and as to the timer thing, I've done it. Now compared to some speedy folks, I'm slow as molasses, but for me, it's no slower (I won't say it's faster, just to appease you) than a strong side draw.
Now the nice thing here is this, I like cross, you like strong. And, we are both happy with our decisions. Ain't life great, all these choices and we get to make them for ourselves.
T Bran
Member
I really dont have much of a choice with both of my single actions because of barrel legnth. It is either crossdraw or a Hans Solo rig that ties at the knee other wise you cant even clear leather.
The crossdraw ia fine in the woods and very comfortable when walking or sitting.
It really depends on the situation you are carrying in. For concealed carry with a shorter weapon if cross is your only option it is still far better than going unarmed and at least your gun wont get mangled by the seatbelt clasp.
The crossdraw ia fine in the woods and very comfortable when walking or sitting.
It really depends on the situation you are carrying in. For concealed carry with a shorter weapon if cross is your only option it is still far better than going unarmed and at least your gun wont get mangled by the seatbelt clasp.
smalls
Member
I've tried it IWB with a snubby, and found it extremely uncomfortable, and I couldn't sit down. I wouldn't mind trying it OWB, though, as I could probably get it a little further back, without my hip bone getting in the way.
I've carried cross-draw for about 30 years now. I find it convenient for me and easier to get to while strapped in a car. I prefer a high-ride (think semi-shoulder rig) height. If it works for the OP, then practice a straight draw with a drop of the off-side foot instead of stepping into your stance. For me this method eliminates the time lag of acquiring stance while bringing firearm to strong side for presentation.
checkmyswag
Member
It is very convenient while driving, but that's about it.
MCgunner
Member
I guess you could call my fanny pack a cross draw, wear it at about 11 oclock right hand draw. I find it about the only way I can belt carry a K frame sized revolver or full sized auto, concealed in plain sight, no worries about flashing the gun. Otherwise I pocket carry.
I really like the fanny pack if seated in the car, very easy to access. Crossdraw would have similar qualities if in a proper holster, not IWB, but OWB and canted.
I really like the fanny pack if seated in the car, very easy to access. Crossdraw would have similar qualities if in a proper holster, not IWB, but OWB and canted.
The difference in speed using a cross draw rig is actually very small. In the early days of USPSA/IPSC shooting cross draw rigs were very popular with a lot of the top competitors. It eventually lost favor because of range safety concerns more than because the strong side guys were faster. I have competed using both types and I don't think you'll give up enough speed to make much difference. I also carried cross draw for about 10 years when I had a job that required many hours behind the wheel. Cross draw allows you faster and easier access to your gun than strong side when sitting down in most modern vehicles and trucks. It also doesn't have the problem of seat belts and consoles getting in the way of your draw.
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JTQ
Member
This article may be of some help.
The Case for Crossdraw
http://www.gunweek.com/2005/feature0101.html
The Case for Crossdraw
http://www.gunweek.com/2005/feature0101.html
wlewisiii
Member
I carry my Blackhawk 4 5/8" cross draw. I find it much easier and fast to draw, cock & aim a single action that way. I also prefer a shoulder rig for smaller automatics.
EVIL
Member
While 99% of the time I carry defensively concealed strong side IWB, I do carry cross draw on several occaisions:
1. When I carry a Back up gun - cross draw is much better for me than a shoulder holster (which I find really slow).
2. When I carry 2 separate pistols for 2 separate tasks. A small game "hunting pistol" (most often a Ruger MK II target) is carried cross draw while my "defensive pistol" is carried strong side.
Though I don't hunt big game with a pistol (yet...
), this set up would also work for a hunter carrying a large bore SA revolver or scoped hunting pistol cross draw, while still having a defensive pistol strong
side.
When I am at an outdoor state land area where I shoot that has no tables and I want to shoot 2 pistols alternately without setting one down in the dusty ground. - 2 holsters come in handy here.
3. easier access to the pistol in a long car drive situation
4. With a pack belt on hiking or in a concealment fanny pack while cycling. The fanny pack is the slowest & most complex draw (for me) & requires 2 hands so their is no opportunity for a "stiff arm" defense while drawing.
1. When I carry a Back up gun - cross draw is much better for me than a shoulder holster (which I find really slow).
2. When I carry 2 separate pistols for 2 separate tasks. A small game "hunting pistol" (most often a Ruger MK II target) is carried cross draw while my "defensive pistol" is carried strong side.
Though I don't hunt big game with a pistol (yet...
), this set up would also work for a hunter carrying a large bore SA revolver or scoped hunting pistol cross draw, while still having a defensive pistol strongside.
When I am at an outdoor state land area where I shoot that has no tables and I want to shoot 2 pistols alternately without setting one down in the dusty ground. - 2 holsters come in handy here.
3. easier access to the pistol in a long car drive situation
4. With a pack belt on hiking or in a concealment fanny pack while cycling. The fanny pack is the slowest & most complex draw (for me) & requires 2 hands so their is no opportunity for a "stiff arm" defense while drawing.
Very good points, evil. I had a little bit different philosophy than you, for various reasons.
I actually carry my back up weak-side, because one of the reasons I may need my BUG is if my strong hand fails or is busy and I need to draw with my weak side hand. So main gun IWB/OWB strong side, BUG pocket weak side.
But if you carried both strong side, you could go akimbo style! Just kidding. In all seriousness, this makes a lot of sense.
I was actually thinking about this, and asked the question in another thread regarding how to carry for quicker access in the car. Personally, I'd prefer a car holster, and am specifically looking at a mount for under the steering wheel. Part of this has to do with my strong hand being my left hand, so that puts me in a bit different position. I'd rather not use my left hand for trying to defend against an attacker on the driver side, because the door would get in the way, but I don't want to swap between straight draw and cross draw holsters on my left side.
I actually carry my back up weak-side, because one of the reasons I may need my BUG is if my strong hand fails or is busy and I need to draw with my weak side hand. So main gun IWB/OWB strong side, BUG pocket weak side.
But if you carried both strong side, you could go akimbo style! Just kidding. In all seriousness, this makes a lot of sense.
I was actually thinking about this, and asked the question in another thread regarding how to carry for quicker access in the car. Personally, I'd prefer a car holster, and am specifically looking at a mount for under the steering wheel. Part of this has to do with my strong hand being my left hand, so that puts me in a bit different position. I'd rather not use my left hand for trying to defend against an attacker on the driver side, because the door would get in the way, but I don't want to swap between straight draw and cross draw holsters on my left side.
MtnSpur
Member
Took some NRA sanctioned/recommended pistol safety and marksmanship courses over the years and every instructor I had advocated strong side for everyday CC. I don't know if that was individual preference on their part.
I've always carried OWB about 4 o'clock as I've not much "girth" and the 2 choices I typically carry just fit that position. The downside, being strapped into the pickup, there just simply isn't an easy way to clear the weapon if it was so holstered. Naturally the options are moving the handgun to the console or between seat/console holster or adopting a cross draw for driving approach. I can see the advantage of the later if the threat was coming from the drivers side but the passenger side is a LONG swing in retrospect. No answer, just another thought to mull over
I've always carried OWB about 4 o'clock as I've not much "girth" and the 2 choices I typically carry just fit that position. The downside, being strapped into the pickup, there just simply isn't an easy way to clear the weapon if it was so holstered. Naturally the options are moving the handgun to the console or between seat/console holster or adopting a cross draw for driving approach. I can see the advantage of the later if the threat was coming from the drivers side but the passenger side is a LONG swing in retrospect. No answer, just another thought to mull over
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