Does the belt in "Belted Magnum" do anything?

[Macchina]

I had a .300 Magnum years ago and hated the belt. It seemed redundant to me having the case also headspace on the shoulder. It was also a weakness in the brass and can cause case head separation. I learned to reload on that cartridge and haven't had that hard a time sizing brass since.

I'm tempted by a 300 or 7mm Mag, but that belt still bothers me... Is there a reason for it or was it really all hype from that time period? If the 50 BMG doesn't have one, does a point-sized Magnum really need one?

 

[Skylerbone]

The original intent was for headspace with shoulder-less calibers and became something of a fad some time later.

 

[jmr40]

True with the original magnum rounds, but with rounds like the 300 WM and 7mm Rem mag it serves no function. Many of the original H&H magnums were made for double rifles. The belt also made extraction a little more reliable. In modern bolt rifles it is more decoration than anything else.

If you don't like the belt, buy one of the WSM's or other modern non-belted magnums. I'm more familiar with the 300 WSM. It does 99% of what a 300 WM does with 15% less powder, about 10-15% less recoil and better accuracy.

 

[Macchina]

I'm very tempted by the WSM rounds. Are they here to stay? Which one is the easiest to find brass for?

 

[Casefull]

Are these numbers from the cars computer or from mileage verses pumped gas. Car computers almost always error with better mileage then the actual mileage. Sometimes by a large amount.

I have both and the 300 wsm actually beats the wm in some categories...especially with the superformance powder.

 

[MCMXI]

The first belted cartridge was the .375 H&H and headspacing off the shoulder made it and others that follwed more reliable in a range of rifles, some of which were intented for Africa and dangerous game. There's nothing wrong with belted cases and if you reload you have the option to neck size only which results in long case life and superb accuracy. I have a WSM, a couple of Win Mags and a .375 H&H and the belt is fine with me.

 

[MistWolf]

The original British dangerous game rifles were doubles chambered for rimmed nitro cartridges. It was felt that a double rifle was best because if the first barrel didn't fire, the shooter just needed to shift to the second trigger. As double rifles became more and more expensive and bolt actions more popular, it was found that the rimmed cartridge often jammed up in the magazine. They needed a case that would both feed smoothly from a magazine yet could be retrofitted to the double rifle without having to completely re-design the ejectors. Adding the accomplished this. It kept the rim diameter of the rimmed case while smoothing feeding from a magazine and would still work with the double rifle extractor/ejector. The only change the gunmakers had to do was bore the cut for the rim deeper. It also kept the advantage of the rimmed case being able to headspace shoulderless cartridges.

Officially, most belted cartridges headspace off the belt. In the early years, reloaders would re-size the belted cases to push the shoulders back too far. As the case headspaces on the belt, the brass flows forward from the web to the neck with each shot, more so than cases headspaced on the shoulder datum. If a belted case is neck sized only after it's first firing, this flow is no worse than a rimless case

 

[Corn-Picker]

I'm very tempted by the WSM rounds. Are they here to stay? Which one is the easiest to find brass for?

Regarding the WSM's longevity, the 300 WSM is the most popular of the WSM line by far (38 ammo choices on Midway) and looks like it will stick around for a long time. The 270 seems to be tbe second most popular, which makes sense to me as it fills a real niche (a short action 270). The 7mm and 8mm (aka 325 WSM) appear to be less popular, but even the 325 WSM has a good number of ammo types available on Midway (11).

 

[barnbwt]

It's also a readily identifiable feature separating it from "non-magnum" cartridges. Sorta like the round shoulders of the Weatherby's that don't really do anything past identifying it as a Weatherby. Marketing is a very important function

TCB

 

[Float Pilot]

The first belt cartridge case was the .400/.375 Belted Nitro Express, introduced in 1905 by Holland & Holland. The rimless, belted case design was intended to provide a positive edge for head-spacing, like a rim, and yet still feed easily from the box magazines of repeating rifles.

It was followed up in 1912 by the famous 375 Holland and Holland MAGNUM.
the .532" rim diameter of the 375 H&H Magnum became the parent case to many other spin-off cartridges. The belt became associated with the word MAGNUM and soon folks thought you had to have a belt for strength.
It is not required and in some cases can cause feeding issues.


In the mid 1960s Remington introduced the first true Short Magnums based upon the 350 Remington Magnum Case which would work in 308 length action. Later when Winchester came out with the WSM line of brass, it turned out to be almost exactly the same as the old 350 rem mag brass except the belt had been removed.

 

[witchhunter]

The belt is useless on modern cartridges, a 7mm Remington Mag headspaces on the shoulder just like a 270. It is left over from the parent cartridge (.375 H&H)of 1905. The short magnums could hold fewer in the magazine because of the larger diameter.

 

[Bwana John]

YES!

It keeps you from being able to resize the case so it will work in all chambers of the same caliber!

I have had problems with 7mm Mag and 375 H&H with not being able to reload ammo that is totally interchangeable between rifles of the same caliber.

I NEVER had that problem with any other type cartridge.

A friend lent me a special die the other day that is supposed to resize all the way down to the belt, but have not tried it yet.

 

[Palehorseman]

I had a .300 Magnum years ago and hated the belt. It seemed redundant to me having the case also headspace on the shoulder. It was also a weakness in the brass and can cause case head separation. I learned to reload on that cartridge and haven't had that hard a time sizing brass since.

I'm tempted by a 300 or 7mm Mag, but that belt still bothers me... Is there a reason for it or was it really all hype from that time period? If the 50 BMG doesn't have one, does a point-sized Magnum really need one?

An unneeded rim.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

The idea was to produce a rimmed cartridge that would feed in a box magazine, and be compatible with a Mauser-style extractor. Since the problem with rimmed cartridges in magazines is that the rims can interlock, the .375 H&H had a very thick rim, with an extraction groove cut in it -- hence the belt.

The idea behind having it rimmed was to allow the chamber to be bored deeper, leaving a bit of space between the shoulder of the cartridge and the shoulder of the chamber -- so under filthy, tropical conditions, crud would have a place to go when you chambered a cruddy cartridge in a cruddy rifle.

That deep chamber is a common British practice -- if you have a Lee-Enfield rifle, you may notice it doesn't take many rounds before the cartridge stretches and begins to show signs of incipient failure. Lee-Enfield chambers were bored deeper to allow for more reliable functioning under filthy conditions.

I have a Model 1905 Canadian Ross. The Ross had bad chambering and extraction problems in WWI, and one attempted cure was to cut the chambers deeper. The ejected cases from my Ross look like .303 Epps!

 

[Apex Predator]

Yeah the darn belt does seem rather useless, but keep in mind that it does not hurt their accuracy either. The secret service counter snipers use 300 win mags and the US long rangesshooting team uses 7mm Rem Mags from what I have heard. So despite their many flaws they are still solid performers. That said I think the WSMs will eventually replace them. My 270 WSM will do everything my 7 Mag will (except launch 175gr pills) with slightly less recoil and in a short action.

 

[Jim K]

One other point often overlooked. While a case shoulder gives adequate support against the firing pin blow, if the shoulder is too small the round might not have enough support and erratic ignition, with inaccuracy or even misfires, can result. The belt provides proper case support for rounds like the .375 H&H Magnum, which has poor support without it.

In cases which have an adequate shoulder, the belt is decoration and can be a detriment in that the sharp edge of the shoulder is a stress riser which can lead to cracked cases and low case life for reloaders.

Jim