Earliest use of the phrase "Wonder 9"?
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Riomouse911
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I’ll guess reading the archives of a gun mag like Guns & Ammo or Shooting Times in the mid-1980’s is a good place to start.
Stay safe.,
Stay safe.,
Ed Ames
Member
Wikipedia says it was coined by a “Robert Shimek” in the 1980s. Internet searches for the name seem In conjunction with the phrase seem to agree.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonder_Nine
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wonder_Nine
Sometime in the early to mid-1980's is my recollection as well. It kind of coincided with military's move to the Beretta 92 and the introduction of many other 9x19 pistols.
But, I did not cave to the 9x19 hype until 1990. I bought a new Browning Hi-Power.
But, I did not cave to the 9x19 hype until 1990. I bought a new Browning Hi-Power.
Don't mean to hijack the thread but according to the link wonder9 means the gun is wonderful??? I thought it was a derogatory term meaning you'll wonder if the 9 will work, maybe i'm wrong?
shoobe01
Member
Not "wonderful" per se, just a shorthand for all the features, over small capacity, smaller cartridges, other trigger systems, etc. A lot of these 9mm, double-column, selective double-action guns came out at the same time, specifically to address military and police markets open to replacing older pistols or revolvers.
Lived through this time person, and while there were plenty of derogatory terms ("crunchenticker" for the DA pull... which is somehow okay in a revolver?) I have never heard any such attribution to the term wonder nine.
Lived through this time person, and while there were plenty of derogatory terms ("crunchenticker" for the DA pull... which is somehow okay in a revolver?) I have never heard any such attribution to the term wonder nine.
Ed Ames
Member
Cynicism is a wonderful thing.
If it started out with gun magazines you can bet it was not meant sarcastically. Those magazines generally say everything is awesome.
benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
As I recall, Bob Shimek was a columnist for Guns & Ammo in the late ‘80s and ‘90s (I started reading around 1989 I think).
Monac
Member
I think the CZ-75 was considered the first of the high-cap double-action 9mm Parabellum pistols (although now that I think of it, was the S&W Model 59 first?). That would place a backstop of 1975 on the phrase. I did not really get into pistols until about 1980, so I can't place it before then. I think Jeff Cooper pioneered the term "crunchenticker" to express his opinion of wonder nines, but that came later, of course.
Shimek was a good writer who died too early. He, like me, was interested in old guns, how they worked, and what they were like to shoot. I have cut out and saved a bunch of his "Classic Test Reports" for Guns & Ammo.
Shimek was a good writer who died too early. He, like me, was interested in old guns, how they worked, and what they were like to shoot. I have cut out and saved a bunch of his "Classic Test Reports" for Guns & Ammo.
earlthegoat2
Member
I think it was a term coined out of bemusement. Wondernine was both derogatory and complimentary. Kind of like Plastic Fantastic that came a few years later.
I’ll let others decide what the deregulatory and complimentary characteristics actually were.
I’ll let others decide what the deregulatory and complimentary characteristics actually were.
Pat Riot
Contributing Member
The first time I read “wonder 9” in a magazine I am pretty sure it was a dismissive comment along the lines of “some people can have their Wonder Nines, I’ll take a 1911 .45 any day...” or something to that effect. That was in the late 80’s or early 90’s but I can’t remember where / when I read it.
I do remember at the time that I was a die hard 1911 guy shooting the only proper cartridge for that gun - the all-mighty 45!
My attitude changed in the mid-2000’s when I bought my first 9mm. I no longer own a .45 ACP firing pistol.
I do remember at the time that I was a die hard 1911 guy shooting the only proper cartridge for that gun - the all-mighty 45!
My attitude changed in the mid-2000’s when I bought my first 9mm. I no longer own a .45 ACP firing pistol.
edwardware
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Since 9mm Luger was standardized in 1902 at the German weapons manufacturer Deutsche Waffen- und Munitionsfabriken (DWM), I think it's probably a translation of the original "vundter nein".
FL-NC
Member
I would say from the popular gun magazines in the 80's, when guns like the Beretta 92, Sig 226, Glocks, and everything else took us by storm. This was the beginning of the war between the 1911 and everything else, which still rages to this day.
entropy
Member
Bob Shimek coined that one, and Jeff Cooper came up with 'Crunchentinker' about the same time for the 9mm's. Neither was impressed by them. Better bullet designs and powders have made them more viable, but it is still a truth that, while a 9mm 'may' expand, a .45 will never contract!
jdh
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Tallball
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"But, I did not cave to the 9x19 hype until 1990. I bought a new Browning Hi-Power."
I bought a Hi Power clone in 1988 and a Beretta 92 clone in 1990. (They both still function nicely.)
I always interpreted the term positively, but perhaps I was naive.
I bought a Hi Power clone in 1988 and a Beretta 92 clone in 1990. (They both still function nicely.)
I always interpreted the term positively, but perhaps I was naive.
earlthegoat2
Member
I’ve always personally thought the original Wonder Nine was the Browning Hi Power. It was higher capacity after all. For some reason it never rose to popularity level of the 1911.
I think it had less to do with the bore diameter and more to do with it being designed for the French......who then didn’t adopt it. Haha.
More seriously, the HP was thought of as being European even if JMB has a big hand in it and the 1911 was all American.
I think it had less to do with the bore diameter and more to do with it being designed for the French......who then didn’t adopt it. Haha.
More seriously, the HP was thought of as being European even if JMB has a big hand in it and the 1911 was all American.
Jim Watson
Member
Crunchenticker describes the double action first shot, single action thereafter design.
Nothing to do with caliber, I have a .45.
Nothing to do with caliber, I have a .45.
Gordon
Member
Yes Col. C was using that term in the late 70s . He new the First Gen S&Ws that were becoming popular were having practical user accuracy issues in his courses and knew why.
Suspiciously coincidental that the term "Wonder nine" and "Wonder Woman" (Lynda Carter) appeared about the same time.....
Not really suspicious; after all, Linda Carter was packing a pretty wonderful presentation at the time...
Ignition Override
Member
golden Jim:
As for the S&W 59, I read that on a primary Smith&Wesson board. Wikipedia-fwiw--also designates the Glock and a few others.
By the way, HK used a polymer frame (VP-70?) about twelve years before Glock did so.
*If somebody wants to see the Very Large, color-coded "family tree" chart with most S&W 1st - 3rd. Gen., all-metal handguns (9mm, 10mm, .45), simply request it......
....and I will post it Here.
As for the S&W 59, I read that on a primary Smith&Wesson board. Wikipedia-fwiw--also designates the Glock and a few others.
By the way, HK used a polymer frame (VP-70?) about twelve years before Glock did so.
*If somebody wants to see the Very Large, color-coded "family tree" chart with most S&W 1st - 3rd. Gen., all-metal handguns (9mm, 10mm, .45), simply request it......
....and I will post it Here.
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