EX COP Gets 5 Years for Legally owned Guns in NJ

[wideym]

One police officer I talked with put things in perspective. He said that cops have to use their best judgement about local, state, and federal laws. The academy and random department policy statements aren't enough to know the entirety of the laws, even lawyers have go to school for several years and still have law liberaries to refer to.

The moment the motorist lied to the officer that he didn't have any guns in the car (which gun cases could be seen from the side window), what could have been a "just don't park next to the bank or have fun in Texas" was turned into a possible bank robber waiting for the bank to open.

I agree the sentence seemed pretty harsh and the officer could have let him go on his way, but when you call backup you are going to have to explain why later.

 

[coloradokevin]

Goodness, this thread has already started to devolve. Yes, there have been some bad veterans and some bad cops out there. I'm a cop, and I could tell you about a few myself (in both categories). But, the point that I (and others) made was merely that this guy was *likely* a "good guy". Most veterans who are former cops fall into the category of fairly responsible people. Obviously that isn't always the case. I never intended to imply that it was. I was only making an inference based on the limited facts we have available (and in internet-discussed cases like these we nearly always have to make inferences on the basis of limited facts).

Nevertheless, for those of you who are preaching the "he broke the law, he goes to jail" side of this argument, I'll tell you that I'm one law enforcement officer who isn't happy with quietly accepting that outcome (at least on the basis of the VERY limited facts we've heard of the case in this thread). The action of carrying a cased firearm -- or 14 firearms -- in your vehicle as you drive from a former state of residence to a new state of residence SHOULD NOT warrant any criminal conviction, let alone a felony conviction worth 5 years in prison.

NJ is still part of the United States, and we are supposed to have certain rights in this country (including the ability to possess arms). I can't in good conscience accept that the act of carrying a cased gun in your car as you pass through any given state is an act that warrants a criminal conviction, the stripping of your rights, and a lengthy stay in prison. Heck, I personally know murderers and rapists (who I've convicted) who have done less time in the clink for their offenses!

At some point we need to collectively realize that there is no justice in some of these laws, and we must push to see them overturned. I don't live in NJ, I don't regularly visit NJ, and I don't have any direct personal need to adjust their laws... EXCEPT, that I'm an American, and I'd kinda sort of like to see our constitution accepted across the nation.


ONE FINAL THOUGHT:

For a moment, allow me to redirect this thread from the debate about whether or not a former cop was a good person, and instead give you an example from my personal life of someone who could have ended up in such a position... shortly after I finished college I moved across the country to CO from OH, along with my ex-wife (a substantially good person -- and you guys know that's a true statement if I'm saying it about my ex). We were pretty broke back then, and gas was much cheaper, so driving home to see family was the usual course of action. Sometimes we drove together, and sometimes she drove alone. When she would drive alone she would always bring her Glock with her (for which she had a CCW permit), and would usually nap in highway rest areas along the road home (again, we were broke back then). She always carried her Glock in a lockbox that was secured to the vehicle.

On one occasion my ex came fairly close to needing her Glock in a rest area somewhere along the rural stretches of Interstate 70, and I always supported her choice to carry in her vehicle on those road trips. In retrospect (looking back now years later, with a career in LE since then, and plenty of time on these forums) I imagine that she could have found herself in a heap of trouble as she passed through a state like IL. That's just not the way things ought to be... a law-abiding good guy carrying a lawfully purchased/owned firearm shouldn't have to worry about being arrested as they pass through a state (from a state where the gun was legal while en route to another state where the gun is legal).


Honestly, I gain nothing personally from arguing this point. As a law enforcement officer I've been empowered by federal law to carry concealed in all 50 states, and I've carried in some of the most restrictive states in the country (if you want a fun read go back through my posts and read about my NYC experience from a couple of years ago). So, whether or not NJ arrested this guy or let him go has no bearing on how I'd carry my gun. However, I believe that the right to carry as I do ought to be extended to all of you, and every other law-abiding adult who chooses to exercise such a right. I'm glad that I can carry my defensive weapon as I choose, but I see no reason why the rest of you shouldn't be able to do as I do.

 

[Davek1977]

Yeah, I found the part where he lied to the cops almost amusing, based on pastg interactions with LEO's. Almost every time I've been questioned by LEO for any reason, theyve for whatever reason felt the need to add "and don't you lie to me"....yet they'll lie themselves it seems if it may possibly save THEIR butts. Just another example of how cops are humans too...and should be treated like everyone else, because they often behave like anyone else would.

As for ColaradoKevin's not accepting the outcome....It doens't take a genius or rocket scientist to think about researching firearms laws when traveling through one of the strictest states on our nation. Furthermore, the case was complicated by his glock being loaded, and the fact he was less than honest with the cops (good guys lie to LEO?). While I agree that the law is stupid, the fact is, he broke it. The majority of Americans at this point seemingly feel marijuana should be legal according to various recent surveys....does the fact that people think marijuana prohibition is stupid exempt them from the law? NO! We are expected to follow the law, whether we agree with said laws or not. We sholdl work to overturn them, yes...but that ABSOLUTELY DOES NOT exempt anyone from prosecution while the laws are still valid and on the books. Disagreeing with a law is NOT n excuse for noncompliance or some expectation you won't be punished for breaking it. AS a LEO, you should realize that, I'd think.

 

[Bovice]

Law abiding does not include skipping court, regardless of charge. Being in the military shouldn't excuse a thing, and especially not being a police officer. Seeing as how he skipped court, he probably thinks he's above all the common man stuff. I wonder how many times he unflinchingly arrested people for "crimes" under increasingly overbearing laws.

Let him burn. How's it feel to be on the other side of the glass, big boy?

 

[Davek1977]

http://behindthebluewall.blogspot.com/2009/03/me-ex-officer-reininger-is-in-news-for.html

I don't think this link got the attention it deserved when posted earlier. This guy is quite possibly no saint, allegedly pulling a gun on his wife during the course of an altercation. Coupled with other tidbits like not bothering to show up in court, repeatedly lying to cops, etc.....the idea this guy is *likely* a "good guy" is losing credibility. Too a website devoted to his defense repeatedly states "no laws were broken" and firearms were " transported in accordance to the law" and that the ammo and magazines found "were legal everywhere" (then later, stating the were indeed banned in NJ?) even making the claim HP bullets were legal in NJ. The outright lies do nothing to lend credit to this guy being wholly on the up and up.

http://dustinshanereininger.com/

 

[leprechaun50]

Goodness, this thread has already started to devolve. Yes, there have been some bad veterans and some bad cops out there. I'm a cop, and I could tell you about a few myself (in both categories). But, the point that I (and others) made was merely that this guy was *likely* a "good guy". Most veterans who are former cops fall into the category of fairly responsible people. Obviously that isn't always the case. I never intended to imply that it was. I was only making an inference based on the limited facts we have available (and in internet-discussed cases like these we nearly always have to make inferences on the basis of limited facts).

Nevertheless, for those of you who are preaching the "he broke the law, he goes to jail" side of this argument, I'll tell you that I'm one law enforcement officer who isn't happy with quietly accepting that outcome (at least on the basis of the VERY limited facts we've heard of the case in this thread). The action of carrying a cased firearm -- or 14 firearms -- in your vehicle as you drive from a former state of residence to a new state of residence SHOULD NOT warrant any criminal conviction, let alone a felony conviction worth 5 years in prison.

NJ is still part of the United States, and we are supposed to have certain rights in this country (including the ability to possess arms). I can't in good conscience accept that the act of carrying a cased gun in your car as you pass through any given state is an act that warrants a criminal conviction, the stripping of your rights, and a lengthy stay in prison. Heck, I personally know murderers and rapists (who I've convicted) who have done less time in the clink for their offenses!

At some point we need to collectively realize that there is no justice in some of these laws, and we must push to see them overturned. I don't live in NJ, I don't regularly visit NJ, and I don't have any direct personal need to adjust their laws... EXCEPT, that I'm an American, and I'd kinda sort of like to see our constitution accepted across the nation.

Coloradokevin, If you were an leo in N.J. and stopped this person, who like it or not, was breaking the law in the state that you had sworn to uphold the law in, what would you have done?

I do not intend to be bashing you or other leo's, but I am curious how you would have handled it.

 

[Deltaboy1984]

Worst case in Tennessee it would have been misdemeanor "going armed" for defense with out a carry permit; given background of "suspect" it could easily have been advise to unload the gun and pack it in the trunk in a case before being allowed to continue.

NJ, NY, MA, CT laws are the anti-gunners fondest dream, our worst nightmare, and we must resist efforts to impose the Sullivan Act at the federal level.



(The New Republic is a bastion of American liberalism based in D.C..)

I agree the LEO should have told him to unload it and get on the road. NJ asine gun laws are one reason I will never vote for Christy for US President.

 

[ilbob]

Why does it bother you so much?

It bothers me that apparently some people think it matters. It doesn't, and shouldn't.

 

[itsa pain]

most people that preach fire and brimstone saying hang em high he broke the law all of a sudden when their kids get arrested turn into an ACLU lawyer talking about illegal search rights violated etc. you can almost guarantee it

 

[caribou]

As a former cop, he should have KNOWN BETTER, but maybe he was that stupid, hence EX cop and 5 years as a Criminal now.

I hate it when people think they have "more" Rights than I, do to some former profession or office they held, as the law is supposed to be applied equally, and in this case is.

Be it you or I doing the same, we at least would expect such.....we need to Free the Eastern states now, from themselves......

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Nevertheless, for those of you who are preaching the "he broke the law, he goes to jail" side of this argument, I'll tell you that I'm one law enforcement officer who isn't happy with quietly accepting that outcome (at least on the basis of the VERY limited facts we've heard of the case in this thread). The action of carrying a cased firearm -- or 14 firearms -- in your vehicle as you drive from a former state of residence to a new state of residence SHOULD NOT warrant any criminal conviction, let alone a felony conviction worth 5 years in prison.

As a LEO, I would think that you would not be so quick to misclassify his transgressions so much. He could travel as you say, but he didn't do it in accord with the law. He also had prohibited ammunition.

As a LEO, you don't let out-of-staters walk on transgressions specific to your state, do you? Do Colorado laws only apply to Colorado residents?

 

[kwguy]

NJ asine gun laws are one reason I will never vote for Christy for US President.

He could travel as you say, but he didn't do it in accord with the law. He also had prohibited ammunition.

was breaking the law in the state that you had sworn to uphold the law in

All very true, but MAN those are some idiotic laws. I mean, in that state, paintball guns were classified as firearms until 1988 Really?

I'm not saying the police should not uphold the laws they are sworn to uphold, but I really wish we did not have to put up with such stupid laws to begin with...

 

[PRM]

As a LEO, you don't let out-of-staters walk on transgressions specific to your state

As an LEO and most other LEOs I have worked with, use more common sense than often credited on some forums. Killing snakes and spitting on the sidewalk are also illegal and I have never seen anyone brought to court for doing either.

Would someone be arrested for possessing a firearm while moving, who was not involved in any other criminal activity. Most would not!!! Can't speak for every person wearing a badge, but the majority of LEOs I have been around are pretty pro-2nd Amendment. I will say that the lower court judges where I have worked would have no problem dismissing a charge like that. Nor would the prosecutors be inclined to take it to trial.

 

[kwguy]

Would someone be arrested for possessing a firearm while moving, who was not involved in any other criminal activity. Most would not!!!

Most, maybe, but new jersey is the stupid exception to that rule!

 

[itsa pain]

I always wonder why there are so many police on every gun forum I have been on. are they trying to see how gun owners think?

 

[Sam1911]

Would someone be arrested for possessing a firearm while moving, who was not involved in any other criminal activity. Most would not!!!

Possessing a LOADED firearm in public? If you state's laws specifically made that a felony? And further prohibited the types of firearm he had and the ammunition he had?

So you'd let someone walk on multiple felonies because they weren't from around here?

I get it -- it's guns and we're pro-gun people and we're supposed to say screw the law on such issues -- but I'm surprised to hear a law officer say they'd turn a blind eye to very serious charges in their state.

In NJ, carrying a loaded firearm, etc., is not quite the same thing as spitting on the sidewalk...

 

[Midwest]

All very true, but MAN those are some idiotic laws. I mean, in that state, paintball guns were classified as firearms until 1988 Really?

Unfortunately it goes downhill from there...For instance their Firearms ID Card Requirement has been in place since 1966. Two years before the 1968 Gun Control Act. The FID Card (more correctly known as the Firearms Purchasers ID card) is required to buy long guns and that includes black powder and a pellet air rifles. The card is also needed to buy handgun ammunition. (Yes pellet guns and Black Powder guns are considered firearms in NJ).

The requirements to get the card are onerous, intrusive, invasive, expensive and in this day and age unnecessary as well as over redundant. Up to three references (with some towns requiring) including one from YOUR employer, mental health check, FINGERPRINTS, fee for the card, and additional fee for the background check and yet another fee for the fingerprinting. And a wait of 3 to 6 months in order to get the card to buy a long gun. Oh and if you move, you go through the process again!

Want a handgun? You need a pistol purchase permit, for each pistol and yes there is a fee for that too. And then they usually add on another $18 fee on top of that. Then there is the one handgun a month law. And Black powder pistols and pellet gun pistols are considered handguns in New Jersey. Their permit to purchase handguns have been in place since 1954.


Now don't forget about that ongoing 2 to 3 week wait for the state NICS to process transfers and the $15 State NICS fee on top of that. State NICS is closed Sundays and state government holidays.

 

[PRM]

Where there from has nothing to do with it.

People owning or having firearms is not considered a big problem in the rural South and is generally treated accordingly.

Sam1911, you and I have had several interactions on THR and I am under no illusion that we have much if anything in common. Nor, do I feel that I could say anything that you don't take issue with. I'm sure you fit well into the culture of the North East. I live in the South for a reason. I'm through with this thread.

 

[Sam1911]

Where there from has nothing to do with it.

People owning or having firearms is not considered a big problem in the rural South and is generally treated accordingly.

Assuredly. Hence, those things might (MIGHT) not be felonies you were charged with enforcing. The question was why you indicated you'd let the guy go, knowing that they ARE felonies where he was located, or if you'd uphold the law you're charged with enforcing.

Sam1911, you and I have had several interactions on THR and I am under no illusion that we have much if anything in common. Nor, do I feel that I could say anything that you don't take issue with.

Oh good grief.

I'm sure you fit well into the culture of the NE. I live in the South for a reason. I'm through with this thread.

Seems to me like you really just don't want to answer the questions. Your choice...

 

[itsa pain]

They wouldn't find an empty case in my car if I were rolling through NJ.

Some seem to have a personal bias toward LEO's here. Whether you think being a veteran or ex-leo means anything about character, it has nothing to do with the real issue here. We know little about this guy, so perhaps we should let it go.

Also, some are commenting about this guy not making it to a hearing or mounting a proper defense. Again, we know little about this guy and even less about his financial position or health. Perhaps he has a very good reason for his actions. We just don't know enough to be passing judgment or going on tangents.

sorry rooter it is police who have bias toward civilians. it started with the roadblocks and when you got your first tank machine guns APC's grenades explosives etc. and to top it all off police and firemens pensions along with disability claims have bankrupted every local state and fed govt. to the tune of a 3 trillion dollar deficit. I still do not understand why there are so many police on civilian (your term) gun forums. prisoners never like their jailers rooter

 

[rooter]

Quote:
Originally Posted by rooter View Post
Why does it bother you so much?

It bothers me that apparently some people think it matters. It doesn't, and shouldn't.

Ok, it doesn't matter to you. It matters to some. You seem extremely biased. I don't know why, nor do I care, but your opinion on the matter doesn't represent the masses.

 

[Davek1977]

Rooter, what did ilbob say that indicates he is "extremely biased"? I read his posts in this thread, and I certainly don't see it that way at all.

 

[alsaqr]

This one boils down to the fact that a "veteran" and "former cop" stopped to nap in New Jersey with a car full of guns, one of which was loaded. He chose a really bad place to nap, too: Behind the Wachovia Bank. When asked if he had guns in the car, Mr. Reininger said no. Lying to a cop is not a good thing.

After spending a few days in a NJ jail Mr. Reininger bailed out and went to Texas. He refused to return to NJ for his criminal trial. Mr. Reininger stiffed his bail bondsman. Mr. Reininger had the best Second Amendment lawyer in NJ, Evan Nappen. Had he bothered to attend his trial he may have gotten off.

Then we discover that Mr. Reininger, while a cop, had an arrest for assault with a gun on his wife.

Now serving law enforcement officers are saying they would refuse to arrest folks who violate gun laws. "Army veteran" Tim McVeigh was caught because he had no license plate in his car. If that OK cop had let "Army veteran" McVeigh go he may have never have been caught.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

I get it -- it's guns and we're pro-gun people and we're supposed to say screw the law on such issues

Sam, I think that is a big part of the argument, that and the notion that if a law is thought to be wrong or stupid, it should be ignored and people violating it given a free pass. It all sort of goes with the notion of being law abiding gun owners, for the laws you want to abide. The others don't count.

alsaqr, I really liked your synopsis. Very good.

 

[Davek1977]

alsaqr, I really liked your synopsis. Very good.

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