FL vs neck sizing

[milemaker13]

I was under the impression that just neck sizing was the way to go if reloading for one particular bolt action rifle vs full length sizing.
In this case, I just picked up a savage axis II in 30-06. I grabbed a couple boxes of inexpensive ammo and was looking at die sets but all they (bass pro) had on the shelf was FL die sets.
Whats the good word here?

 

[Hanshi]

All my dies are FL dies yet I use them to partially resize which is very similar and just as good, IMHO, as a neck sizer. I set the die to just size part of the neck and then try it in the rifle. Usually it's a no-go at this point so I adjust the die and size it down a bit farther, trying it in the gun each time. I keep doing this until the case just does fit in the chamber with NO wiggle room. Sometimes the bolt will need a bit more force to chamber a round but this is okay. More care is taken with lever rifles. They don't have the ability to chamber a tight round so must be sized with that in mind. You have to go slow and carefully with these. Not sized enough and rounds won't chamber; sized too much and the case might separate. Just be patient and go slowly. Some of my rifles will group .3" (one third of an inch) with my reloads.

 

[Stubert]

I reload for a .375 H&H, after the first firing, I raise my sizer up the width of a nickle. I don't touch the shoulder unless they won't chamber. No issues yet, and am on my third firing. I make sure they chamber BEFORE I reload the cases.

 

[Walkalong]

FL size, adjust it to move the shoulder minimally.

You cannot neck size with a FL die. "Partial" FL sizing is what I just advised above, and and IMHO it isn't similar to neck sizing. Neck sizing sizes the neck only.

Neck sizing, or adjusting a FL sizer to only size par way down the neck leaves the shoulder alone and eventually it will cause issues. Neck sizing isn't more accurate, so FL size and keep the brass chambering freely.

Of course many will tell you they neck size and it's more accurate, but I disagree with them in general, even if occasionally it gives better results for folks.

 

[Random 8]

Where neck sizing will gain some accuracy advantage and possibly longer case life is with rimmed cartridges and/or oversized chambers. It can also be an useful to streamline your process as full case lubing is not needed, although lightly lubing the necks with graphite, mica, or a light amount of conventional lube is still recommended.

In your case, I would just get a FL die set and partially size as above for target practice ammo. I would, and do, set the FL die per factory recommendations for any hunting ammo to ensure reliable chambering.

 

[redbullitt]

I have had very good luck with the Lee 4 die sets. Seater, full length, collet neck sizer, and crimp. For the price, I don't think it can be beat. I have made fantastic ammunition with them in 223 and 308. Zero complaints.

If I'm shooting bolt action, I neck size until it needs the shoulder bumped back. Your brass will thank you. I do check to make sure the cartridges chamber though on hunting ammo.

I have rcbs, hornady, forster, redding as well. The bushing dies are great if youre neck turning or using the same style brass. They work on mixed, but not as well as the collet in that case.

 

[sparkyv]

I have had very good luck with the Lee 4 die sets. Seater, full length, collet neck sizer, and crimp. For the price, I don't think it can be beat. I have made fantastic ammunition with them in 223 and 308. Zero complaints.

If I'm shooting bolt action, I neck size until it needs the shoulder bumped back. Your brass will thank you. I do check to make sure the cartridges chamber though on hunting ammo.

I think redbullitt covered it well.

 

[Varminterror]

Neck sizing only was a fad several years ago now, but cooler heads prevailed and real-word performance has proven neck sizing only does not improve accuracy nor does it improve case life compared to proper FL sizing. Neck sizing only is an invitation to sticky bolt and crush-fit chambering (or refusal), so guys decided to FL size or shoulder bump after a certain number of neck only firings. However, neck sizing with occasional shoulder bumping/FL sizing also introduces inconsistency between one firing to the next, so mixing up batches or missing a FL sizing when it’s needed can induce these misfeeding issues

Why pursue a path with no benefit, and extra potential detriment?

 

[whughett]

Amazon sells the Lee Collet die for 24 bucks. Never used one myself, I just adjusted my 30/06 die out, but have numerous Lee products. Good value for the money.

 

[Walkalong]

And it works well, for awhile, I dropped mine decades ago.

 

[lightman]

Neck sizing vs full length sizing has been argued back and fourth a lot and both sides have their valid points. I've done both and have personally seen little to no improvement in accuracy or case life in factory rifles. Most of the case failures that I experience are from either neck splits of loose primer pockets and neck sizing does not stop either one of them.

I suggest that you try it just for the experience. A few of the die makers have a set of dies that offer the neck die as the 3rd die in a 3 die set and its a little cheaper than purchasing the neck die separately. The sets that I have are the Redding Deluxe Set, deluxe meaning that it has the 3rd die. For what its worth, my neck dies were used maybe once and after that just resides in the box next to the FL die.

I do neck size for my match rifle and a couple of custom varmint rifles. These have tight neck chambers that require neck turning and I size them with bushing dies. I use threaded dies on a couple of these and hand dies with an Arbor press on a couple of others.

If you neck size you will have to either full length size or use a body die to push the shoulder back after a number of firings. Sometime around 3 or more firings neck sized cases will become difficult to chamber.

 

[jmr40]

I full length size everything. It works for me. Of course I own 2-4 rifles in each of the cartridges I load for. It is easier to FL resize than try to keep brass separate.

 

[JFrank]

I like a good neck sizing thread

 

[Hooda Thunkit]

If you neck size you will have to either full length size or use a body die to push the shoulder back after a number of firings. Sometime around 3 or more firings neck sized cases will become difficult to chamber.

I just fired 70 rounds of 7.62x54r in a Finn M39. These rounds have been reloaded and fired 8 times previously in that same rifle.

Neck sized only, with a Lee Collet die. So, 9 times fired, annealed 3 times, never full length sized after the initial loading.

No problems chambering.

I plan to continue neck sizing only.

 

[lightman]

I think my original post mentioned that neck sizing vs full length sizing has been argued about a lot.

Your number of firings is unusual in my experience, but thats good. No doubt it has something to do with the pressure of the loads and probably some other factors.

I'm not trying to talk you out of neck sizing, or anyone else.

 

[Caplock]

I have multipule guns for each caliber. I FL resize everything to keep it simple. I want my reloads to function 100% in any of my firearms.

 

[WVRJ]

I've found it to be like a lot of things in reloading,which is no two guns are alike,and some respond better than others.In my custom guns,all of which are toward the tighter chamber specs,especially the headspace dimension.In rifles with tight headspace,I get better accuracy from neck sizing most of the time.I like the Lee collet neck dies.They are as true in runout as a bushing die.In all of my hunting guns,I full length resize,and I also adjust the die for the rifle's chamber.I disassemble the bolt and keep working the die in until the brass chambers smoothly.Then I will go maybe two thousandths so that there's less danger of getting a tight case and have it slow down the time it takes to get ready for a second shot if needed.Most of the time I don't have to bump the shoulder back in the rounds that I'm neck sizing.I think hotter loads will need the shoulder bumped more often than lighter stuff.I don't believe there is a cut and dried answer as to which method works best.

 

[quartermaster]

I also am a neck sizing guy, although I may take the stem and expander out of a FL die and set the shoulders back every 2-3 loadings. To me, the expander is my worst enemy for concentricity variations. If I am loading for a factory rifle and I need to bush a neck down more than .005, I will use 2 bushing to get there. Generally, I only bush the necks down 1 caliber and leave the rest in it’s fired condition. I believe this gives me the best alignment with the bore.

i would like to mention also that I turn all necks whether it is a tight chamber or not as I feel I can get consistent neck tension and also anneal every other loading.

Every little thing I do can help accuracy a bit, at least as far as my confidence level goes, but I will admit that before I started turning necks and getting bushing dies, I could make some very accurate ammo using a regular FL and seating die set, just not as often as I do now.

QM

 

[AJC1]

Measuring and maintaining safe and consistent headspace is the name of the game. Cant do that neck only sizing.

 

[jmorris]

FL but it doesn’t require one to set it to size to minimum, so in essence they can be neck only, if you so desire.

That said, a neck sizer can only be that.

If you want to see the difference yourself buy the FL and don’t crank it down enough to size the portion below the neck.

 

[JFrank]

When I used a neck sizing die I was very confident that this was the way forward, then as my knowledge evolved I learned the FL bushing type dies that closely match my chamber did a much better job of promoting brass life and controlling neck tension( among other things) so much so that I find absolutely no reason to anneal, now as I evolve further I may find a solid practical reason to return to annealing or neck turning.
In my thinking it’s all part of the journey.
Enjoy the ride and keep an open mind
J

 

[spitballer]

I get by with Wilson neck sizing equipment for my bolt rifle but with an undersize neck I have to buy premium, necked brass to avoid jamming. Bart B. has always said that most of the top shooters do a full-length size and I have no reason to doubt him but I've never really understood why this would be.

 

[JFrank]

I get by with Wilson neck sizing equipment for my bolt rifle but with an undersize neck I have to buy premium, necked brass to avoid jamming. Bart B. has always said that most of the top shooters do a full-length size and I have no reason to doubt him but I've never really understood why this would be.

A SAMMI chamber/ neck if you have a Sammi should not be undersized, you most likely just answered the question.
Wilson makes a FL bushing type die that is a pleasure to use, smooth as silk, minimum resizing. Purchased at Brunos for around $60 plus shipping

 

[jmorris]

full-length size and I have no reason to doubt him but I've never really understood why this would be.

I think it’s because the case is “fully supported” as guffy would say. You can adjust it where it is essentially the same as a neck die if you wish, so a FL die can neck size without touching the rest of the case (neck is parallel, shoulder/body are tapers), not to mention some dies I have were made based on brass fired several times to form in the chamber, so saying “full length” is not synonymous with “loose in the chamber”.

 

[spitballer]

A SAMMI chamber/ neck if you have a Sammi should not be undersized,..

Yeah that's what I understand. It also seems to me that full-length sizing might actually help to create a smoother, more consistent start pressure. Seating off the lands with fire-formed cases may help for the same reason.