I was thinking of getting a 21 inch Remington barrel for my 11-87 to use in 3 gun competition next year. I read that the shorter Remington "deer" barrels do not have a gas system like the longer barrels do. So would I need to shoot full power shells to make the gun cycle properly? With my 30 inch barrel, the gun cycles light target loads with no problem. Thank you.
Functon of 11-87 with shorter barrel?
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I suspect that the only difference in the "gas system" is the size of the gas ports in the barrel. If the "deer" barrel won't cycle the lighter loads, a gunsmith could easily enlarge the gas ports to make it operate with target loads.
earlthegoat2
Member
I believe the gas ports are enlarged on the slug barrel so further enlargening would be fruitless. The main reason the lighter loads wont cycle in the slugbarrel is because the shorter length does not give as much gas pressure to the gas ports before all pressure is lost after the projectile leaves the barrel.
This is also true in noncompensating systems such as the 1100.
This is also true in noncompensating systems such as the 1100.
The amount of gas that goes into the gas cylinder is a function (mainly) of the size of the gas ports and the length of barrel beyond the gas ports. There are other factors such as burning rate of the powder, total shot load, total powder load, velocity of shot column, etc.
Anyway, I wouldn't totally write off the idea of enlarging the gas ports as unworkable. The gun barrel designers try to anticipate the type of load that would typically be shot in that barrel and design the gas port size accordingly.
If you are going to be shooting a load that is milder than what the designers figure is a "typical" load for that barrel, then you might improve functioning by having the gas ports enlarged.
Of couse, in doing so, you would be subjecting the gun to greater than designed stresses if you have the gas ports enlarged and then shoot heavy loads in that barrel/gun.
Almost everything in gun design is a trade-off of one kind or another. Reliability of functioning versus durability of the gun is one of the top concerns with any autoloading shotgun.
Anyway, I wouldn't totally write off the idea of enlarging the gas ports as unworkable. The gun barrel designers try to anticipate the type of load that would typically be shot in that barrel and design the gas port size accordingly.
If you are going to be shooting a load that is milder than what the designers figure is a "typical" load for that barrel, then you might improve functioning by having the gas ports enlarged.
Of couse, in doing so, you would be subjecting the gun to greater than designed stresses if you have the gas ports enlarged and then shoot heavy loads in that barrel/gun.
Almost everything in gun design is a trade-off of one kind or another. Reliability of functioning versus durability of the gun is one of the top concerns with any autoloading shotgun.
Remington recomends 2 3/4" magnum or 3" magnums for all barrels shorter than 26" on the 11-87 for the reasons mentioned above. I suppose it could be modified to work with lighter loads, but then would probably be unreliable with heavy loads.
I do not know a lot about the combat shooting games, but have always seen the 1100's and 11-87" set up for these competitions using 26" barrels and long mag extensions. That is the route I believe I would take.
I do not know a lot about the combat shooting games, but have always seen the 1100's and 11-87" set up for these competitions using 26" barrels and long mag extensions. That is the route I believe I would take.
Virginian
Member
For years Remington made a Model 1100 Special Field model with a 23" barrel. It worked fine with all 2-3/4" loads, and the gas system parts were the same, and the holes in the barrel were exactly the same size as all the other 1100s. Unless someone has actually measured the gas ports on a 21" deer barrel I would be real leery of hearsay.
If you open up the ports to make a gun function with light loads, it is going to slam the action with heavier loads. Keep a close eye on the buffer.
If you open up the ports to make a gun function with light loads, it is going to slam the action with heavier loads. Keep a close eye on the buffer.
RM,
As I said above, the gun designers (Remington in this case) size the gas holes to accomodate the barrel length and the anticipated shell usage of that barrel. Below is a write-up and chart from http://www.wisnersinc.com regarding the size of the gas port openings in the 11-87 barrels.
You can see that the size of the opening is not the same for every barrel......... even though all the barrels are for the Remington 11-87 shotgun.
P.S. I hope that the chart formats properly on this site. If not, you can go to the Wisners site and find the chart yourself.
Model 1187: This model was introduced in 1987 as a improvement to the 1100 in 12ga only & toted by the factory as the Premier. The 1100 is still made in other chamberings. Rem-Choke screw in choke system was introduced in with this model in 1987.
The extractor was widened, apparently for improved extraction. The gas piston & seal was made in stainless steel .
The sizes listed below are for lead shot, for steel shot the hole size may have to be opened up a drill size or two.
Model 11-87 12ga 30” Premier/Field
.101” / # 38 2 ea. Barrel
“ “ 12ga 28” “ “ .101” / # 35
2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 26” “ “
.116” / # 32 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 30” Special Purpose .101” / # 38 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 26” “ “ .116” / # 32 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 30” Trap .116” / # 32 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 28” “ .120” / # 31 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 26” Skeet .125” / 1/8" 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 21” Spl Purpose Deer .083” / # 25 span> 2 “ “
Copyright © 2006 Wisner's Inc. All Rights Reserved
As I said above, the gun designers (Remington in this case) size the gas holes to accomodate the barrel length and the anticipated shell usage of that barrel. Below is a write-up and chart from http://www.wisnersinc.com regarding the size of the gas port openings in the 11-87 barrels.
You can see that the size of the opening is not the same for every barrel......... even though all the barrels are for the Remington 11-87 shotgun.
P.S. I hope that the chart formats properly on this site. If not, you can go to the Wisners site and find the chart yourself.
Model 1187: This model was introduced in 1987 as a improvement to the 1100 in 12ga only & toted by the factory as the Premier. The 1100 is still made in other chamberings. Rem-Choke screw in choke system was introduced in with this model in 1987.
The extractor was widened, apparently for improved extraction. The gas piston & seal was made in stainless steel .
The sizes listed below are for lead shot, for steel shot the hole size may have to be opened up a drill size or two.
Model 11-87 12ga 30” Premier/Field
.101” / # 38 2 ea. Barrel
“ “ 12ga 28” “ “ .101” / # 35
2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 26” “ “
.116” / # 32 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 30” Special Purpose .101” / # 38 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 26” “ “ .116” / # 32 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 30” Trap .116” / # 32 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 28” “ .120” / # 31 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 26” Skeet .125” / 1/8" 2 “ “
“ “ 12ga 21” Spl Purpose Deer .083” / # 25 span> 2 “ “
Copyright © 2006 Wisner's Inc. All Rights Reserved
Virginian,
The 1100 special field, was not designed to fire 3" shells. The 11-87 was designed to work with a wide range of loads, but needs the longer barrel for gas pressure to build up enough to cycle light loads.
The part about not using light loads in short barrels is not hearsay, it is in the owners manual.
The 1100 special field, was not designed to fire 3" shells. The 11-87 was designed to work with a wide range of loads, but needs the longer barrel for gas pressure to build up enough to cycle light loads.
The part about not using light loads in short barrels is not hearsay, it is in the owners manual.
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