Getting bad headaches....literally.

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Analogkid

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I'm getting bad headaches lately. Seems to coincide with reloading. I do my best to not touch any powder but I must be inhaling fumes from it off gassing. I am single staging everything so I may be touching it here and there.

I'll be fine and then spend a few hours at it and they come back with a vengeance. After reading up on this a bit this weekend it seems like I need to add some sort of exhaust fan in the reloading room. Anyone ever come across this before?. Seems the msds sheets from my powders warn of it.
 
Sounds like you may be reacting to the solvents out gassing from the powder. Some powder have a stronger odor that others. May try one of the air purifiers these do not expel the air, but run them through a charcoal filter.

May try moving to a more open area before going the exhaust way to see if it helps. I use to reload in garage where I had to deal with the elements. It got where I would only reload during the winter due to the heat. Now that I have moved, I have an enclosed room that's has a window ac/heat. The humidity runs high here so I had to add a dehumidifier to keep things from rusting.
 
I have never experienced such a reaction, but I am not too surprised that some do.

Sounds to me like a venting plan may be a good first step.

Air is always moving in my reloading area, not due to fear of fumes but as part of a constant flow that I maintain in the basement even when the HVAC system is not active. I have more concern for Dead Air Zones in my basement than for any propellant fumes to which I may be exposed.
 
Take a look around your reloading area for other factors that trigger headaches and eye fatigue.
 
I'm getting bad headaches lately. Seems to coincide with reloading. I do my best to not touch any powder but I must be inhaling fumes from it off gassing. I am single staging everything so I may be touching it here and there.

I'll be fine and then spend a few hours at it and they come back with a vengeance. After reading up on this a bit this weekend it seems like I need to add some sort of exhaust fan in the reloading room. Anyone ever come across this before?. Seems the msds sheets from my powders warn of it.
Click to expand...

This sort of thing is complicated to figure out. You could also be living near a gas pipe line that is leaking, or some other industrial chemicals.

What this NTSB report lacks is that the gas main was a cast iron pipe that was installed in 1887!

NTSB: Defective Joint, Lack of Supporting Soil Caused East Harlem Gas Main Leak That Killed Eight, Destroyed Two Buildings

http://www.ntsb.gov/news/press-releases/Pages/PR20150609.aspx

Most of the infrastructure in the US is decaying as our economy is totally mismanaged.

Wiki has a nice list for List of pipeline accidents in the United States in the 21st century https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pipeline_accidents_in_the_United_States_in_the_21st_century
 
Are you using a double base powder such as the Alliant powders? Any double base powder contains some nitroglycerin which can cause severe headaches. I would think that is the culprit rather than solvent off gassing.
 
Had your eyes checked lately? I was getting headaches when working on my guns and reloading and attributed it to sinuses. My ENT Dr. agreed and I had a surgery that removed a bunch of tissue and I could breathe easier. Still had headaches. Wife made me go the the eye Dr. and he did a thorough exam, and changed my Rx. No more headaches...

Not to say your symptoms are powder related, but in 30 years of reloading and many years looking into reloading forums, I have only heard of this once before, and it was just recently...
 
mdi said:
Had your eyes checked lately? I was getting headaches when working on my guns and reloading and attributed it to sinuses. My ENT Dr. agreed and I had a surgery that removed a bunch of tissue and I could breathe easier. Still had headaches. Wife made me go the the eye Dr. and he did a thorough exam, and changed my Rx. No more headaches...
Click to expand...

First thing I thought of, trying to focus in a low light scenario with aging eyes, then adding the anxiety and pressure of making safe handloads. Do you tumble in the same room as you reload in?
 
All good suggestions but I know what is happening. Nitroglycerin is a big part of most smokeless powders. Touching the powder and breathing in the fumes from the powder will put Nitro into your system. If you have ever had cardiac problems like I have and have used Nitro patches you know how serious the headaches can be. It is a common side effect of Nitro, rubber gloves and better ventilation will make it go away.
 
buck460XVR said:
First thing I thought of, trying to focus in a low light scenario with aging eyes, then adding the anxiety and pressure of making safe handloads. Do you tumble in the same room as you reload in?
Click to expand...
Yep, same shop (10'x18'). But dust does not bother me when I use my Lyman wobbler (slotted top). And most of my tumblong is done with a rotary tumbler with sealed drum. I've worked around various chemicals (machinist/mechanic) ad can tell the difference between a "chemical" headache and a run of the mill, stress, or eye headache. Never had a "chemical" headache from any reloading or gun components, supplies, lubes, or other chemicals...
 
Never happened to me from reloading before. I have gotten a few from shooting and being around guns being fired though.

Compensators help the shoulder at the cost of a lot more noise and blast.
 
mdi said:
Yep, same shop (10'x18'). But dust does not bother me when I use my Lyman wobbler (slotted top). And most of my tumblong is done with a rotary tumbler with sealed drum. I've worked around various chemicals (machinist/mechanic) ad can tell the difference between a "chemical" headache and a run of the mill, stress, or eye headache. Never had a "chemical" headache from any reloading or gun components, supplies, lubes, or other chemicals...
Click to expand...

Sorry MDI, but my question about tumbling was for the OP. I myself find dust from tumbling to be much more of an annoyance than reactions from powder. The biggest problem is, altho I run an exhaust fan while tumbling and emptying the tumbler, there's a little bit of dust that will get on my glasses, making it harder to see, and thus gives me a headache. I find the same thing happens when working with wood and making fine sawdust. Generally I don't even realize how dirty my glasses are until I get a headache or my wife asks, "how can you even see outta those things?"
 
Far more likely to be the way your sitting or standing than any gas. Unless you're unusually allergic.
You find yourself bending over a lot or having your shoulders hunched up? The eyes thing is worth looking into as well. And a 20" fan won't cost much.
 
There was another recent thread on something similar. Never heard back from the OP.

No one here can diagnose what you situation is. It could be anything, Literally. It is all guess work and speculation.

In a past life/job I dealt with all the MSDS for very toxic chemical/solvents. There are so many signs and symptoms, that with out proper Medical checks you will not know the exact cause or source.

Look at it logically, How much powder is open to the air at one time??. It is in a powder measure with a lid right? Then you load some cases with powder which is open to the air, depending on the caliber lets say 9mm. So what is there, 100 cases times say 5 grains? So just for discussion 500 grains of powder. You cap those with a bullet, now there is no air exposure.

You have the lid on the powder right? Even if you spill some your are not rolling around in it and should have minimal amount on your fingers or hands.

Not saying that you are not having a reaction to the NG in the powder, but if you are like most, your exposure is very limited, unless you are doing something very wrong!

The level of NG in the powder is not even known exactly it varies from 0-42%!

My guess and only a guess would be that your eyes would start watering (tears) or be irritated before any headache.

Bottom line you need to be checked by a Medical Professional.

The MSDS are primary for industry use as mandated by OSHA,

just an example

https://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/MSDS Fi...rs/All Hodgdon Spherical Powders_02-11-14.pdf
 
Wow good to know about hazards of double based powders, this never would have occurred to me; I would have guessed solvents too. Great site.
 
I'm very skeptical of the nitroglycerin theory. Yes, it can and does cause severe headaches when taken in tablet or patch form but the nitro concentration in those forms is much higher than you would ever receive from a very low and short exposure to smokeless powder. As far as I know all powder dispensers are covered or sealed in some way and the amount of nitro fumes from a few filled cases sitting open for a few minutes between the charging and bullet seating steps is pretty minuscule. I would think you'd have to stick your nose in a filled and open powder vessel and breathe in order to inhale any meaningful concentration of nitro fumes. Also, a tolerance to the headache develops pretty quickly with routine exposure.
 
As with anything, the Internet can sometimes cause more problems than the information it provides. It is seen all the time with things like Web MD, people read a little and then convince themselves Yep I have that!!

A little knowledge can sometimes be a bad thing.

In reloading it comes up all the time on "lead exposure" may folks do not even know the primary means of getting lead in their system. They think by touching it, it gets absorbed into their system,

Exposure to a harmful level of anything is based on the amount of substance/percentage and time involved.

Down here in Florida, Northerners can get severe sunburn in 20 minutes and not know it! It depends on time of day, time of year and how much previous exposure they have had.
 
I suppose it could be sensitivity to the solvents or nitroglycerin. Yes, I have experienced the headache of a nitro pill.
.
OR it could be your posture. Are you bending your head over your loading bench? Moving in unnatural ways? Slouching? Don't underestimate the importance of your body's position in relation to your workspace. You should be sitting or standing with the press at eye level so that you don't have to strain to see your work.
 
Never did get to that doctorates. Seriously, if you are getting severe and persistent headaches I would be seeing a real doctor, you know, someone who actually went to school to earn a doctorates in medicine. They may suggest some blood work. Your headaches could be brought on by any number of things many having nothing to do with smokeless powders or reloading. We just recently had a thread on this very same subject, at least I am pretty sure it was this forum. Anyway, my advice is simple, see a real doctor and get his.her take on the headaches.

Ron
 
Analogkid said:
I'm getting bad headaches lately. Seems to coincide with reloading. I do my best to not touch any powder but I must be inhaling fumes from it off gassing. I am single staging everything so I may be touching it here and there.

I'll be fine and then spend a few hours at it and they come back with a vengeance. After reading up on this a bit this weekend it seems like I need to add some sort of exhaust fan in the reloading room. Anyone ever come across this before?. Seems the msds sheets from my powders warn of it.
Click to expand...

I love the smell of the solvents in powder. Every loading session will start with a generous whiff of the contents. I'd do it even if I thought there was some danger, which there is not for the minuscule amount inhaled.

You need to know for sure the powder has not gone bad, right? :evil:

I think you need to look at environmental factors in your loading area, as some others have already mentioned.
 
I'm with armarsh, I always sniff the powder when I open the jug. It's an old habit and I like the smell, never had an adverse reaction to it.
 
<sigh>

Analogkid ...

While you are waiting for that appointment with the doctor, put on some Nitriles, temporarily configure some venting for the space and reload some ammo just as you have been ...

... and see if the headache returns.

If no headache, repeat without the gloves.

Isolate the issue, if possible.
 
I have two identical Lyon's work benches from the 70's.

One in the garage I used for years and one in the reloading room. The garage is of course much bigger and drafty. Problems never came up reloading in the garage or breaking down 10's of thousands of rounds over the winter as discussed in my "dead people's reloaded ammo" thread. I spent hours upon hours in the garage with powder flying everywhere during my kinetic hammer fun fest.

Nothing has changed except for the location and it being a smaller space with less air movement.. I am already looking to install ventilation in the room plus remove the powders from the room.

Thursday I get blood work done . My Family practitioner who is Gun friendly says he has seen the issue before dealing with patients that work in the explosives industry and that some people are more susceptible to it than others. My lead level is checked regularly and is in safe levels.


I have spent a few hours in the room trimming cases and never had a issue. Once that powder is in the hopper and I'm cranking them out.....

Crushing headache city..
 
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