Glue bullet in case

[jk308]

Does anyone have experience and know of products to glue bullets in reloads in place of a hard crimp?

This question arises from me looking for the best 357Mag load for my 1894 rifle. I was not happy when many attempts and combinations of components did not equal a mid priced factory load in accuracy.

To help identify the differences I pulled the bullet from factory loads.

The powder type, charge, case length, bullet diameter and weight all made sense. The crimp on the factory loads appeared very light especially for a powder that appeared a lot like WIN296 (appearance and velocity of rounds for the given charge weight made me think it was 296 or something very similar)

Pulling the bullets was very hard. Much harder than a Lee Factory crimp die with a very hard crimp can cause. After I got them out I realized why. They are glued in place.

That made some sense to me. The crimp is one of the most subjective and variable parts of the load. Gluing the bullet eliminates the variable if the glue is consistent in its hold.

JK308

 

[Varminthound]

In WW II the military "glued" their bullets in place with what I have seen referred to as asphalt. I know a black residue remains inside the case after firing them but I don't know what it really was. So it has been done. I think primarily to prevent moisture from getting in but that is a guess. Good luck on finding out.

 

[ReloaderFred]

It's not really a glue in the factory rounds. It's more like tar, and is there for waterproofing the rounds, similar to military ammunition. If you use a Q-Tip dipped in Simple Green, the black tar will disolve like oil when you touch it.

Factory brass isn't slick from being fired, since there's no powder and primer residue to lubricate it, so the brass to copper adhesion is greater.

It's also not wise to attempt to guess what powder the factory uses, since they use "bulk" powders, which are different than the "canister" powders available to handloaders. Even if it is Winchester 296, it's not blended like canister powder is. They work up each load in the ballistics lab for the lot of powder they're loading at the time. The lot may fill a semi-trailer or more, depending on how much was made for that batch. Rounds from different lots of ammunition, using what "looks" like the same powder, will often have a different amount of that powder, but produce the same velocity.

Whatever you put inside the cases you're loading is going to go down the barrel of your firearm. For this reason, be careful what you put in there.........

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[PO2Hammer]

Welcome to The High Road.

I've heard of laquer on the case mouths, but not glue.

With a Marlin I've only had luck with swaged bullets under 1,000 fps or jacketed bullets.

A profile crimp should be plenty for a revolver/levergun combo, or just a taper crimp for the levergun. There is no pull on the bullet during recoil in a lever, you just have to resist setback, which is minimal.

I don't think gluing/sealing the case mouth is going to make a significant difference. A box of Hornady XTP's will.

 

[rcmodel]

Bad idea!

Do your homework with a dial caliper and see if your expander stem is larger then it should be to allow good neck tension.

That is what holds the bullet tightly in place.
The crimp also helps, but it is not the deal breaker if neck tension on the bullet is correct.

BTW: Factory "glue" is not glue.
It is a water-proofing sealer.
It has nothing at all to do with holding the bullet in place.

you just have to resist setback, which is minimal.

Set-back in a lever-guns tube magazine is not minimal when the tube is full, spring tension is high, and recoil is pounding a stack of ammo into each other.

Lever-gun ammo should have a firm roll-crimp, same as Magnum revolver rounds.

rc

 

[jk308]

Thank you for the replys

Thank you all for the quick respones. The idea of what's on the bullet goes down the barrel did bother me. The substance on the factory ammo was a black tar like substance.

Neck tension does seem to be key. I'll check my expander die. I am awaiting some new Redding dies with a profile crimp die but the set I purchased does not come with an expander.

JK308