Home defence: 20 vs 12 gau. Opinions?
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Kevin Rohrer
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At the social distance you would be firing it, there is no practical difference. Having written that, I subscribe to the Bigger is Better school of thought.
The only consideration is the stature of the firer. Women might be more comfortable w/ a 20ga for repeat shots.
The only consideration is the stature of the firer. Women might be more comfortable w/ a 20ga for repeat shots.
dprice3844444
member
depends on the stature of the shooter
M2 Carbine
member
My preference in shotguns is a laser/light equipped 12 ga pump.
But just recently I cut the barrels down on a couple 20 ga shotguns for a couple ladies. I'm sure the 20 ga will do just fine.
I have both.
The 20ga is loaded with 3in magnum Federal Premium (copper plated, buffered) #2 shot (18 pellets).. it is devastating! would be effective against any threat.
The 12ga is loaded with 2 3/4in Fed Premium (plated,buffered) 9 shot 00Buck.
The (advertsed) muzzle vel. for the 20ga is 1175
The 12ga is 1325
Both would be sufficient for any, and all needs.
The 20ga is loaded with 3in magnum Federal Premium (copper plated, buffered) #2 shot (18 pellets).. it is devastating! would be effective against any threat.
The 12ga is loaded with 2 3/4in Fed Premium (plated,buffered) 9 shot 00Buck.
The (advertsed) muzzle vel. for the 20ga is 1175
The 12ga is 1325
Both would be sufficient for any, and all needs.
mgkdrgn
Member
Honestly, either one will get the job done, the target at the business end won't know the difference.
20g will probably be lighter, but that will lead to higher felt recoil.
I've seen reduced recoil loads for 12g, but never for 20.
Don't bother with magnums ... you don't need them indoors ... and unless you are defending your home from a flock of high flying geese you don't need them outdoors either.
20g will probably be lighter, but that will lead to higher felt recoil.
I've seen reduced recoil loads for 12g, but never for 20.
Don't bother with magnums ... you don't need them indoors ... and unless you are defending your home from a flock of high flying geese you don't need them outdoors either.
I have been known to advocate the 20ga for home defense. Primarily because they are lighter and handier to use. That can be a bigger factor for smaller frame folks, but I am far from smaller framed. I use an almost youth length 20 ga gun. LOP shorter than a field gun so that it comes up to the shoulder fast and clean. Shorter barrel for quick swing and manuevering.
I do not advocate the use of heavy 3 inch loads for the 20ga. (not for the 12ga either) . You will have folks say the 20ga kicks as much as the 12ga anyway, so go with the 12ga. What they are not recognizing is that if you stay with a moderate 20ga load, that is not the case.
The 20ga 2&3/4 inch number 3 buckshot puts out the equivilent muzzle energy of 2 loadings of 357 magnum. Is that adiquate to handle the task ? I believe so, and see no reason to use a heavy 12ga gun with 3 inch magnum loads.
I do not advocate the use of heavy 3 inch loads for the 20ga. (not for the 12ga either) . You will have folks say the 20ga kicks as much as the 12ga anyway, so go with the 12ga. What they are not recognizing is that if you stay with a moderate 20ga load, that is not the case.
The 20ga 2&3/4 inch number 3 buckshot puts out the equivilent muzzle energy of 2 loadings of 357 magnum. Is that adiquate to handle the task ? I believe so, and see no reason to use a heavy 12ga gun with 3 inch magnum loads.
oneounceload
member
Lighter guns firing the same payload will have more recoil - both actual and perceived; ammo choices are much greater for 12 gauge than 20
Choose ammo based on penetration ability. You do not need anything bigger than 2-3/4", nor faster than about 1250 fps.
If the gun properly fits the shooter, the perceived recoil will be lessened
Choose ammo based on penetration ability. You do not need anything bigger than 2-3/4", nor faster than about 1250 fps.
If the gun properly fits the shooter, the perceived recoil will be lessened
Naybor
Member
I like and use a 12 Ga. Double Barrel w/ 20" barrels, open cylinder. (Coach Shotgun.)
IMHO, any 12, 16, or 20 Ga. will make a Bad Guy lose interest in what he is attempting to do, along with everything else. Just use 00 shot down to maybe # 2 shot and you should be ok. If you are worried about wall penetration, #3, #4 and #5 shot will work wonders if you are VERY close. I don't recommend #6 thru #9 shot for anything but skeet.
IMHO, any 12, 16, or 20 Ga. will make a Bad Guy lose interest in what he is attempting to do, along with everything else. Just use 00 shot down to maybe # 2 shot and you should be ok. If you are worried about wall penetration, #3, #4 and #5 shot will work wonders if you are VERY close. I don't recommend #6 thru #9 shot for anything but skeet.
Both will be up to the task with the right shot size,and as long as the owner holds up their end.
Which is why I picked a Mossberg .410 pump,any shotgun loaded with the smaller #4 buck all the way through to '000' buck will be a mess of bad news for any threat at home defense range.
Which is why I picked a Mossberg .410 pump,any shotgun loaded with the smaller #4 buck all the way through to '000' buck will be a mess of bad news for any threat at home defense range.
For home defense the 12 is a no brainer, for carrying around a lot the 20 makes sense. Lots of folks mistakely believe the 20 will recoil less. In guns of equal weight that would be true, but almost all 20's weigh much less.
A typical 20 guage 870 weighs 6.5 lbs, a 12 weighs 7.5 lbs. Both shoot ammo to pretty much the same velocity, but the 12 will have roughly 15-25% more payload. If you do the math recoil is almost exactly the same with the 20 actually recoiling more in many cases because of the much lighter gun.
With reduced recoil loads avalable the 12 will offer much more versatility with no more recoil and possibly less.
The 20's main advantage is that it is lighter and easier to carry for miles of walking in rugged terrain while sacraficing a bit of performance. Not an issue in home defense unless your home requires a 10 mile hike up the driveway.
A typical 20 guage 870 weighs 6.5 lbs, a 12 weighs 7.5 lbs. Both shoot ammo to pretty much the same velocity, but the 12 will have roughly 15-25% more payload. If you do the math recoil is almost exactly the same with the 20 actually recoiling more in many cases because of the much lighter gun.
With reduced recoil loads avalable the 12 will offer much more versatility with no more recoil and possibly less.
The 20's main advantage is that it is lighter and easier to carry for miles of walking in rugged terrain while sacraficing a bit of performance. Not an issue in home defense unless your home requires a 10 mile hike up the driveway.
Deltaboy1984
Member
The 16, 20 and 410 will all get the job done with the right ammo and shot placement.
When you get shot with buckshot or #4 shot at 15 ft at 1100 feet per second I do not think you will notice that there were 4 to 6 pellets less because you used a 20 gauge. I use the 870 in 20 gauge for HD, I feel better knowing that my wife will use it to because it is not as large as the 12 gauge. Same devasting effect with less recoil.
I don't agree !
It's main advantage in a HD shotgun is that it handles more like a carbine, and has more than enough power (at reduced payload from the 12ga) to get the job done. It can also do this for smaller frame folks who find the extra weight, and larger size of the 12ga. ,to be hard to handle. Sometimes just the length of reach to the forearm of a pump gun can make a difference .
If bigger is always better, than perhaps a 10ga should be the champion of the HD shotguns.
The stock length and the and reach to the forearm are identical on both 12 and 20. If they are too long they can be cut back on either. With the best loads your 20 guage will recoil more than the 12 because it is a pound lighter. With reduced loads in the 12 it will have the exact payload as the 20 and the 12 will recoil significantly less than the 20 The only advantage the 20 offers is ease of carrying in rugged terrain.
If they find the weight of a 12 to be too much they will certainly find the significant increase of the 20's recoil to be too much. In that case it is time to rethink which gun they are using for HD. This is a major reason the AR carbine platform is now the preferred choice for a HD longarm among most experts.
snooperman
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The 20 ga will kick just as much as the 12 ga because they are lighter in weight. My wife and I use the 12 ga as there is far more ammo choices for it. That said , if you prefer the 20 ga for what ever reason, it will get the job done too.
Here's one thought on the 12 vs 20 debate. Yes, 12's generally weigh more, and depending on action type and shell used, a 20 "might" have more recoil (actual and or felt).
However, smaller folks , like my 5'1" wife have a hard time handling the extra weight and bulk of a 12. Her favorite happens to be a 20 ga recoil operated semi auto Franchi. She handles and shoots it much better than my Remmy 1100.
Truth be told, before one picks which gauge/action type, they need to experiment and find what works for "them". And consider this, felt/preceived recoil is just that. Knowing a shotgun is a smaller gauge may effect the preception a shooter has as to the amount of recoil produced. Think of it like the "placebo" effect.
However, smaller folks , like my 5'1" wife have a hard time handling the extra weight and bulk of a 12. Her favorite happens to be a 20 ga recoil operated semi auto Franchi. She handles and shoots it much better than my Remmy 1100.
Truth be told, before one picks which gauge/action type, they need to experiment and find what works for "them". And consider this, felt/preceived recoil is just that. Knowing a shotgun is a smaller gauge may effect the preception a shooter has as to the amount of recoil produced. Think of it like the "placebo" effect.
Fred Fuller
Moderator Emeritus
The shooter is far more important than the gun. Either 12 or 20 will do, if the shooter will do.
I use 12s, because I can. But I'd use a 20 with alacrity if necessary. The last real homestead defense event here (against a copperhead that the Brittany discovered in the back yard) was accomplished with the single shot youth model H&R in 20 ga. that lives behind the front door.
I use 12s, because I can. But I'd use a 20 with alacrity if necessary. The last real homestead defense event here (against a copperhead that the Brittany discovered in the back yard) was accomplished with the single shot youth model H&R in 20 ga. that lives behind the front door.
Old judge creek
Member
There's some excellent advice being shared here, IMO.
Personally, I prefer the 12ga.
Having said that, I promise you that I wouldn't be the least uncomfortable if the 410 was all I had to defend my home.
Which gauge shotgun is much less important than how well a shooter can wield it. And as a SASS shooter I can attest that some very tiny women can (and do) handle 12ga shotguns better then a LOT of big burly he-men.
The reason these women can do so is that they have been well coached in HOW to do it and they practice. If you want your wife to be able to defend the homestead, I recommend getting her some coaching and shooting experience.
Then choose whichever gun, in whatever gauge you believe might fill your particular needs.
Personally, I prefer the 12ga.
Having said that, I promise you that I wouldn't be the least uncomfortable if the 410 was all I had to defend my home.
Which gauge shotgun is much less important than how well a shooter can wield it. And as a SASS shooter I can attest that some very tiny women can (and do) handle 12ga shotguns better then a LOT of big burly he-men.
The reason these women can do so is that they have been well coached in HOW to do it and they practice. If you want your wife to be able to defend the homestead, I recommend getting her some coaching and shooting experience.
Then choose whichever gun, in whatever gauge you believe might fill your particular needs.
Didn't intend to make you turn your print red , but I still have to disagree with you regarding the advantage being only weight and carry capability.
I believe you missed my point regarding the "best loads" . Too many folks think that they have to deliver the same payload with the 20ga, at the same energy level, in order to make it effective. That is not the case. With loads that are very adequate for HD the 20ga does not have to kick more than a 12ga, or as much as a 12ga . Smaller payload equal less recoil which can more than make up for the reduced weight.
The main advantage IMO is still primarily in the handling. 12ga guns are not only heavier they are larger and harder to handle. 20ga - Try one - you'll like it, even if your a big guy !
One more thought regarding recoil : If you ever have to pull the trigger on another human being , you will NOT notice some extra recoil ! Practice mostly with light loads no matter your choice of ga.
The bottom line, in a sense, is still is in which will get the job done, and the answer is still "both" . Personal preference is alive and well in this case, I prefer the 20ga and I am by far not alone. The most popular choice is the 12ga. and that's fine with me, as long as the 20ga is not dismissed as somehow being a poor choice.
20 ga is an excellent choice for home defense especially when you are considering over penetration in crowded urban areas. Buck shot can penetrate walls, but is greatly reduced in power just going through a typical wall board especially if you get a bit of the 2x4 in the wall.
On the other hand, .357 rounds can go for ever and ever through several walls making penetration a real issue. In addition, the stopping power of a 20 ga is significantly higher than any pistol round out there.
Recoil can be an issue, but I don't feel under gunned at all with my 20 ga by my bed along with my .357. The 20 is my first go to round and for many good reasons.
On the other hand, .357 rounds can go for ever and ever through several walls making penetration a real issue. In addition, the stopping power of a 20 ga is significantly higher than any pistol round out there.
Recoil can be an issue, but I don't feel under gunned at all with my 20 ga by my bed along with my .357. The 20 is my first go to round and for many good reasons.
MCgunner
Member
I keep my 20 gauge around. I could buy a short barrel for one of my Mossbergs, but I like the coach gun's handiness, am quite used to it, and 20 pellets of 3 buck will do the job just fine.
I don't understand the theory that 20ga loads recoil as much as 12ga loads. What am I missing here? Sure, if you're firing the same load and the 20ga is lighter you will feel it more. But most 20ga loadings I know of are lighter. Just like a 28 is lighter yet and a .410 is lighter than that. Some posters have me confused.
The main concern is the fit of the shotgun. That, and the use of a good lighting system.
The main concern is the fit of the shotgun. That, and the use of a good lighting system.
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