Informal SHTF Rifle Shooting Poll

[444]

How many of you can honestly say that you have fired your "SHTF" rifle at a measured 600 (or more) yards from a field positon, against a target such as paper or steel but not rocks or some junk ?

I am not talking about firing a target rifle with a high magnification scope. I am not talking about a heavy barreled F-Class or varmint type rifle with a bipod/sandbags/big scope etc. I am not talking about shooting from a bench. I am talking about taking something like an M1, M1A, FAL, G3/HK91, AK, Galil, AR, SKS.......... military type rifle, getting into a good shooting position and shooting at a target of approx. human size or smaller.
I would prefer we be talking about a rifle you personally owned. Not some fantasy rifle and not a rifle you had issued to you in the military but no longer have because you got out twenty years ago. Improvised rests are OK, and bipods are OK providing you honestly would carry the bipod if the SHTF. Tricked out rifles are OK as long as you would honestly grab that rifle in that configuration if the SHTF.
What I am basically getting at is, if the SHTF right this minute and you grabbed your personal gear including a rifle and ammo. How many of you feel that you could make 1 out of 5 shots (five shots only, no sighters) on an IDPA silhouete target at a known six hundred yards right now with the rifle/ammo/your skills just the way it sits right now. This obvious also means that you know the sight dope to use for that first shot hit.
I would really appreaciate your honest response and whether or not you have actually done it.

On another board, one of the members of this board posted a quick and dirty little skills test that included making one out of one shots at 500 yards. Not many people actually went out and tried it, but those that did found it difficult.
A lot of people don't have access to a 600 yard rifle range to even know if they can pull it off.

 

[clange]

600 yards eh? Why not make it 1000?

I'd probably be hard pressed to make a 600 yard shot with my 700, let alone an AK, but then again i have no delusions about doing so.

I'm not sure i understand the point of this thread. What are you getting at with the 600 yard thing? That people should have something that reaches that far? People dont understand what their rifles are capable of?

And unfortunately, if you want me to go try it the only ranges around here max out at 100 yards.

 

[beerslurpy]

What sort of SHTF situation would involve picking fights with people half a mile away? I'm more concerned with clowns that get within 50 yards of me looking to take my stuff.

 

[Zak Smith]

I've made hits on a steel IPSC-style silhouette at 600 yards with a 17" AR15 shooting XM193 with an ACOG, from improvised prone (== mag monopod on dirt). Have made first-round hits on the same target at 500 yards. Shoot it to 400 regularly on 10" plates with the carbines. Done the same with the 18" 6.8SPC with another TA11.

No reason to discount fieldworthy precision rifles, either...
-z

 

[444]

People on internet gun boards seem to place a great deal of value in long range rifle shooting in SHTF senarios.
They endlessly discuss how this rifle or this cartridge is more effective at long range (often cited as 600 yards or more). Probably the most common is that the AR is OK at close range, but out at 600 yards (or whatever) it isn't worth a crap.................... I want to reach out and touch someone..........Blah blah Blah. I am sure you have read thousands of posts that are similar over the years. Based on these posts, I have to assume that a lot of people think this is a realistic senario and they feel that their rifle/ammo/skills are up to the task seeing as how they spend so much time discussing it and placing so much emphisis on it.
Maybe the biggest topic discussed in this regard is the fragmentation of military ball ammo in 5.56mm NATO. Obviously these guys feel that they can outshoot that range and thus the ammo is a liability.

Ok, how many people here think they can hit a human sized cardboard target with their SHTF rifle right now, as is from a cold barrel, first five shots (1 hit in five shots and only five shots)?
If ammo performance and rifle performance at these ranges is vital to your survival, then have you ever actually fired your rifle at such ranges and if so, what were the results ?

This is an honest question. I have done it. I thought it was fun.
If nothing else it is something to try and get better at. Gun ownership isn't just about talking on the internet: shooting is fun too.

 

[Lone_Gunman]

I think that if you are a civilian shooting at someone 600 yards away, you are probably going to be charged with murder, even if the S has hit the F.

 

[444]

Ok, thanks for the bump.
One out of four answered the question so far and I already know Zak has done it and can do it on demand. Who else has done it, or thinks they can do it ?

 

[Justin]

176 out of 200 possible points scored on a 600 yard High Power target shot with an iron-sighted Armalite AR15 with 69 grain Sierra Match Kings.

I don't say this to brag, that score is really pretty mediocre, and I got fairly lucky in that there was little wind when I was shooting.

 

[Nightcrawler]

Hey, all I did was cite some ballistics figures. I never mentioned one's ability to actually hit someone at that range.

 

[jefnvk]

What pretty much everyone else has said.

If you are in a situtation where you can identify and legally shoot someone 600 yards away, you are in a war.

Me? I can reasonably hit metal plates 200-300 yards away. Not worrying about training to hit much further. Actually, not worrying about training for a SHTF scenario anyways.

I think much more practical drills would be trying to hit something 25-50 yards away, while running, ducking, from ackward positions, around corners, down cluttered lanes, etc that hitting at 600 yards.

 

[thereisnospoon]

While I DO have access to 600 yards, I have only recently put my Savage .308 to the test, although I am somewhat of a CHEATER...the scope riding on top is an old Swarovski Tactical with a cam calibrated for .308. I just set the little thingy to 600 and plink away at my IDPA targets. I can even hit 1 Gallon milk jugs at that distance (this is from a very solid bench rest mind you...). I have a Bipod for the thing but haven't gotten dirty yet

The fact is, I practice more with my M14S at close range out to 50 meters for SHTF type stuff than I do long range. I am NOT going to pick a long range fight with someone in a SHTF situation...I'll merely skulk away and live to fight another day.

But it is really fun to shoot at long distance, even when you don't do so well (like when I try my M14Sout past 300 yards).

 

[444]

By the way, this little skills test I referred to was on AR15.com.
The 500 yard one shot hit was just one part of the overall test. I guess I should have mentioned how I did. I first tried it with a 14.5" AR15/TA31F ACOG optic/Wolf 55 grain ammo. I was unable to score a single hit on three seperate days, all of which had at least a slight breeze. Each time I also fired one of my CMP M1s using Korean mil-surp ammo/issue iron sights/sling/prone. I could hit the silhouette every time: somewhere I knew the sight dope from actual firing on steel plates out to 800 yards for the M1.
Using good quality handloads and heavy bullets, I was able to start hitting the 500 yard silhouette with the AR, but Wolf was a no go. I could hit the target every time in the upper chest with Wolf at 300 however.

FORGET about discussing what you would do in situation X. This thread is about taking your SHTF rifle and hitting a cardboard target at 600 yards. Can you do it or not ? Have you actually done it or not ? Whether this is a realistic situation or whether you think it is ethical or whatever is something for another thread. This is about rifle shooting skill only.

 

[Dr.Rob]

Well I know I can and have hit a moving target through the vitals in a pretty good wind at 425 yards with my hunting rifle... no bipod, no lasers, just a decent scope and a Savage 116 and a GI sling.

That's not the rifle I'd carry in a SHTF scenario... but my eyes aren't as good as some of yours.

Hunting is about the best practice there is.

I've shot a high-power match with Justin... and while my old Springfield wasn't up to the task I assure you with a 30-30 and buckhorns I could have made a fine showing.

I know I can pretty much pick up any rifle with buck horn sights shoot it... I never did like the post and hole style set up.

I think the frathest I've shot my AK is 200 yards... there just aren't many 600 yard ranges available, even here.

 

[Zak Smith]

Yeah, those 55gr 223 bullets get moved by the wind A LOT. I've had better luck with the 75's in my guns for long range stuff. You can also hear them better hitting the steel (and 6.8 is even better in this regard).

 

[mpthole]

I'll bet I could get really close anyway, with my 16" AR-10 in .308 with the iron sights. I have access to a 600 yard range - maybe I'll give it a try sometime. The other day I was making consistent 300 yard hits on an IDPA target with that gun no problem.

Still, I think 600 yards is quite a stretch for a SHTF situation. If things are that bad, I'll put on a ghillie suit and grab my bolt-action.

 

[dasmi]

I can't do it, and I don't see why I'd need to do it, in a SHTF scenario.

 

[444]

Again, just to clarify: this isn't about a SHTF situation, it is about shooting your SHTF rifle. Just a question about how you feel you would do or how you know you have done on this one event skills test: take your honest, actual SHTF rifle and make one shot out of five on a target at 600 yards.

 

[mummac]

I'll stop lurking just to answer the question. No.

 

[itgoesboom]

Never done it. Wish I could though.

My main SHTF rifle is a CETME, and while accurate (1-1.5" groups are common at 75 yards, the range I have access to) , the sights are set up for 100, 200, 300 and 400 meters. I have tried to scope it, but had problems with the mounting, so I just recently removed the scope.

I also don't have access to a 600 yard range. Honestly, I pretty much end up shooting at 75-85 yards since I don't belong to a private range. I do the best I can with what I have.

I also don't think I am the greatest shot, and while I can get good groups with my CETME, it is while prone supported either with a bipod or a backpack, or a fallen log to help me out.

I.G.B.

 

[KaceCoyote]

600 yards, no. 300 yards yes, I can do about 50% accuracy at 300 yards with my Saiga and admittedly that was on a good day. I'm going to be the first to say anything over 120 yards is going to be a waste of ammunition. Partly due to the rifle, partly due to the guy using said rifle.

 

[Beetle Bailey]

My SHTF rifle is a USGI M1, and I haven't tried shooting it from field positions out to 600 yards. The furthest I have tried is 400 yards sitting with the 1907 sling, and I missed more than I hit, so I didn't try it on the greater distances.

But. . . now that you mention it, I suppose the next time I go to a 600 yard shooting range, I'll give it a try, just to see .

 

[Mulliga]

I can't hit anything at that range. I can barely see anything at that range - if we're talking SHTF rifles, that means iron sights to me.

200 yards is about the maximum I feel comfortable with.

 

[jefnvk]

take your honest, actual SHTF rifle and make one shot out of five on a target at 600 yards.

In that case, never tried.

Just wondering what makes shooting 600 yards more important than close quarter training, or for some SHTF proclaiming guys, being able to run 600 yards

 

[Dr.Rob]

Here's a more practical idea:

you need 5-6 gallon jugs painted an odd color... neon pink etc. A buddy or two and your rifles... whatever that means. You can fill the jugs with water for easier scoring.

Conceal them/set them along a creek bed that you have hunted use both sides of the creek... low and high but watch your backstops. Pick someplace in the middle of nowhere on public land.

Act as your buddy's 'guide' and as SOON as you see a target you MUST engage it from that range... sort of IDPA for hunting rifles.

Dad and I came up with this idea and it worked really well.

Shot #1 might be 10-20 yards at a 'bedded deer', shot #2 might be 100 or more. In any case you should only need as many bullets as you have targets, right?

This works for 22's as well as it does for hi-power or SHTF rifles.

Of course it only works if your buddy has no idea where the targets are... and the same goes for you when HE sets up the targets.

 

[cracked butt]

If I had to take a shot over 300 yards, It wouldn't be with a sks or M1, I would pull out a bolt action for it. I've never shot at 600 yards, only to 500. The longest shot that 'counted' was a deer at a few steps over 400 yards with a remington 788, I would never take that shot with a semi-auto battle rifle.

With an M1, I can hit the bull of a 200 yard SR target from sunup to sundown shooting from my hind legs- plenty good enough for any 'realistic' social problems that might ever happen.