Is this scope defective?
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cdb1
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Where I worked the bench for mounting scopes was in the gun vault. Most employees were not allowed in the vault, much less a customer.
Trail Rider
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I've got a .300 Win Mag I bought used at a gun shop. I fired it several times with the scope that came on it and it was zeroed very well and worked fine. There was a recall notice on the rifle for the trigger. I simply removed the scope, packaged the rifle as instructed and sent it off. When I got it back I put the scope back on it and was test firing it and I couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. No matter how much I adjusted it, it would not move the strike of the round. I shot 3 boxes of rounds with no luck on the windage and elevation. It was low and to the right. I finally broke down and bought a new scope (about 400.00) and that was the answer. The original scope must have been the cheapest they could put on it to get it out the door.
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BrocLuno
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You pays you money, and you takes your chances. I've had some good Simmons scopes. I've had some bad ones. Since I buy used, it's not much of a hit .. I have a used Simmons 2.5 shotgun scope that has never given me a one bit of trouble in 20 years. I do believe that fixed power (4X say) is better than zoom in cheap scopes.
I've also had good luck with Tasco. Especially the old "Made in Japan" models. I have an old Tasco adjustable objective (AO) 6X scope on a 22 that is a real work horse. Not a bit of trouble
But, the others are right. Things get better as you move up the food chain. The thing is the cost accelerates faster than the quality. Is the clarity that much better between a $300 scope and $3000 scope ... $2,700 will buy a lot of other stuff including a good hunt...
The MFGs know this, so they make up for some of that with lifetime warranties and such. That's nice to have if you drop it, or break it somehow. Nikon and Leupold are both good at this. With Nikon you need your paperwork, and keeping track of that for 20 years is iffy... With Leuplod you don't. Just send it in and they will fix it
The sweet spot for me used to be Weaver Micro-Trac. Older steel tube Weavers were cheap and durable as a hammer. Not so anymore. Micro-Tracs are going for new scope money now, and maybe more. Part of that is blued steel tubes that look right on older rifles. Part of that is folks have figured out it was/is a good internal mechanism. They are still building it in some of their new scopes.
But for 22 you want an appropriate scope with the correct parallax. You don't want a high-power rifle scope on a 22. The new sweet spot for me with 22's is Nikon 22 scopes. Pretty durable and they are clear and clean with a decent warranty
I've also had good luck with Tasco. Especially the old "Made in Japan" models. I have an old Tasco adjustable objective (AO) 6X scope on a 22 that is a real work horse. Not a bit of trouble
But, the others are right. Things get better as you move up the food chain. The thing is the cost accelerates faster than the quality. Is the clarity that much better between a $300 scope and $3000 scope ... $2,700 will buy a lot of other stuff including a good hunt...
The MFGs know this, so they make up for some of that with lifetime warranties and such. That's nice to have if you drop it, or break it somehow. Nikon and Leupold are both good at this. With Nikon you need your paperwork, and keeping track of that for 20 years is iffy... With Leuplod you don't. Just send it in and they will fix it
The sweet spot for me used to be Weaver Micro-Trac. Older steel tube Weavers were cheap and durable as a hammer. Not so anymore. Micro-Tracs are going for new scope money now, and maybe more. Part of that is blued steel tubes that look right on older rifles. Part of that is folks have figured out it was/is a good internal mechanism. They are still building it in some of their new scopes.
But for 22 you want an appropriate scope with the correct parallax. You don't want a high-power rifle scope on a 22. The new sweet spot for me with 22's is Nikon 22 scopes. Pretty durable and they are clear and clean with a decent warranty
He did take it somewhere out of site. I believe it was in the back where employees go. I understood that customers probably wouldn't be allowed to go back there. Never know what's back there for a customer to steal that's unsecured while the employee is working with my scope.
I still haven't tried it out yet, but will let you kow when I do. We just went from Spring-like weather that lasted for a couple weeks and melted all our snow to now having a foot of snow on the ground and mid-20s for temperature in just one day (the day after I got my scope mounted!). More snow expected on Monday. It might be 2 or 3 weeks before I get to shoot. Stupid weather!
Until you look through really good glass you won't really know how clear your glass is.
I've got some cheap 10X tasco monoculars that I use at the indoor pistol range so I don't have to pull my target in from 25 yards all the time to see 22 holes.
I pulled one out the other day at my outdoor range and to my surprise it was easier for me to make out 22 holes at 50 yards with my 4X Leupold scope than with the 10X monocular
Nature Boy
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If the scope is sold in a blister package hanging on an end cap next to bags of trail mix and sun glasses, it's pretty much a disposable item. Get 2 and if one breaks slap the back up on and keep shooting
Why not? Competitive folk have been using 20 to 25 power scopes on rimfire 22's for decades.
if they don't, put your aiming eye on the scope axis. You gotta do that with open or aperture sights. No big deal.
Scopes focus for target range just like camera lenses do. That focus adjustment does not fix the cause of parallax errors. I have no idea why scope focus for target range got changed to parallax adjustment.
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cdb1
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Cabela's has four "Super" stores for lack of a better term. They are much bigger than the other stores. One of them is in Fort Worth Texas. I worked there part-time from August 2014 to November 2016. I worked there because of the dealer programs available, especially the ones available for firearms and optics. I wanted to upgrade all of my scopes and was able to accomplish that. Examples of discounts are eight Leupold products a year at 60% off MSRP and the same on Vortex except you could get ten of their product at 60% off MSRP. Think there might be a huge mark-up on optics at the retail level? The store discounts suck until you've been an employee for seven years.
It evolved very quickly that I became the optics mounter when I was working because I'd been doing it for years and we had fewer returns and screw-ups that way. Some days I'd spend my whole shift mounting scopes, some days were wholely spent behind the counter selling scopes and guns. I learned a lot and was able to check out MANY different scopes and brands. The most important lesson learned was this: Everyone's eyes are different so some scope brands you will see better through than others. What that that means practically is that when a person poses a "which scope" question on a forum, they can receive some decent advice on durability, tracking, ergos and eyebox but no one can give the OP relevant advice on optic lens quality. If the OP isn't able to look through the scopes under consideration then it's a crapshoot.
I digress though. I don't know how many times someone would walk up and say something along the lines of, I want a really good scope for shooting out to 500 yards with a 30mm tube, 50mm objective for under $200.00. My normal response was "Check on aisle 5 next to the unicorns". "You get what you pay for" holds true for optics more than any other type of product I have experience with. There is also a point of diminishing returns in scope pricing which for me starts at roughly $750.00, give or take. There are subtle differences in better scopes that are hard to notice in a store. One example is the first time you use your new $75.00 scope at 1:00 PM on a very sunny day and you can't use it because the flare is so bad.
Where I worked we had scopes at the counter behind glass. When a person purchased one of those we retrieved a new unopened one for them from the vault. There was another section with scopes on an aisle close by, where a customer could grab what they wanted and take it to checkout. This is where Tasco, Simmons and Sightron were located. What I find telling is we had less shrinkage on those optics, than the ones behind the counter that required employee assistance to obtain.
To each his own. I'd rather hunt with a $300.00 Savage Axis wearing a $200.00 Burris Fullfield II than a $2,500.00 Weatherby wearing a $50.00 scope.
It evolved very quickly that I became the optics mounter when I was working because I'd been doing it for years and we had fewer returns and screw-ups that way. Some days I'd spend my whole shift mounting scopes, some days were wholely spent behind the counter selling scopes and guns. I learned a lot and was able to check out MANY different scopes and brands. The most important lesson learned was this: Everyone's eyes are different so some scope brands you will see better through than others. What that that means practically is that when a person poses a "which scope" question on a forum, they can receive some decent advice on durability, tracking, ergos and eyebox but no one can give the OP relevant advice on optic lens quality. If the OP isn't able to look through the scopes under consideration then it's a crapshoot.
I digress though. I don't know how many times someone would walk up and say something along the lines of, I want a really good scope for shooting out to 500 yards with a 30mm tube, 50mm objective for under $200.00. My normal response was "Check on aisle 5 next to the unicorns". "You get what you pay for" holds true for optics more than any other type of product I have experience with. There is also a point of diminishing returns in scope pricing which for me starts at roughly $750.00, give or take. There are subtle differences in better scopes that are hard to notice in a store. One example is the first time you use your new $75.00 scope at 1:00 PM on a very sunny day and you can't use it because the flare is so bad.
Where I worked we had scopes at the counter behind glass. When a person purchased one of those we retrieved a new unopened one for them from the vault. There was another section with scopes on an aisle close by, where a customer could grab what they wanted and take it to checkout. This is where Tasco, Simmons and Sightron were located. What I find telling is we had less shrinkage on those optics, than the ones behind the counter that required employee assistance to obtain.
To each his own. I'd rather hunt with a $300.00 Savage Axis wearing a $200.00 Burris Fullfield II than a $2,500.00 Weatherby wearing a $50.00 scope.
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RugerBassMan
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I am tough on scopes. I have Leupold, Burris, Weaver, Vortex and SWFA. Eventually, some go back to the factory when they rattle when shaken, reticle has drooping cross hairs, or they are unable to hold better than a 3 foot group at 100. All 5 makers cheerfully help me out with either a repair or replacement. They cost between $300 and $1,000 - UPS knows my address real well. Put light scopes on heavy kickers.
This is good advice for everyone. I've wasted money on cheap scopes, but not much because I learned quickly that you truly do get what you pay for. You can't expect ribeye for bologna prices. That said however, you can and should look for ways to save. My nephew is a certified hunter safety instructor and with that comes access to great discounts on scopes....,once a year. He's not buying scopes at the moment so each year he gets me another Leupold for 50% off MSRP. Also, I am a member of the Kansas State Rifle Association and with that membership I get a 40% discount on Bushnell scopes in the Bushnell Outlet Store in KC. I've bought 3 nice Bushnell Elite scopes for about $330 each that have an MSRP of $550. In this way I have upgraded my scopes. And another thought, buying cheap because it's a rimfire is still buying cheap. Now my rimfires all have Leupold which is a big plus in the sometimes dimly lit woods.
cdb1
Member
There are screaming deals out there where you can get scopes that IMO are worth far more than what you pay. As an example Camera Land has two scopes on permanent markdown that fit the description.
Minox ZV 3 3-9x40 for $99.99
Meopta MeoPro 3.5-10x44 for $349.99
If you don't live in New York State you pay no sales tax and there is free shipping.
Minox ZV 3 3-9x40 for $99.99
Meopta MeoPro 3.5-10x44 for $349.99
If you don't live in New York State you pay no sales tax and there is free shipping.
cdb1
Member
The owner Doug said on another forum that if you purchase one and don't like it he will give you a full refund.
UPDATE TIME!!!!
I finally got to try out the replacement scope yesterday. It's the one that the store employee installed and bore sighted for me before I left the store. It shot about 5" too low and about 2" to the right. So I tried adjusting it, and once again, it made no difference. It was identical to the previous scope it replaced. I tried again and again to adjust the bullet impact point and I kept hitting the target in the same place. That's "Strike 2" for this scope! Today, I took it back to Gander Mountain and decided I just wanted a refund since I've now gotten 2 faulty scopes. But they wouldn't refund me. They said I could only get another exchange since the package had been opened, or I could get store credit. I reminded him that it was defective and the only way to know that was to open the package and try it out. He still wouldn't give me my money back, but only offered either an exchange for another scope similar to the 2 that already proved to be faulty, or store credit. To make a long story short, I now have a replacement scope on my rifle--a 3rd one of the same Simmons scope. I asked the employee if he adjusted both the windage and elevation to make sure they functioned, and he said he did. (That's what I was told the previous time too). Third try is the charm, right? I'll post again when I find out if this one works or not. Hopefully, I'll be trying it out tonight and updating here tomorrow.
How many clicks are you adjusting the scope, and at what range?
Those scopes if I remember correctly have a .25"@100yd adjustment. So 4 clicks (ish with those scopes) is 1" @ 100yds. At 50yds 1" would be 8 clicks, and 25yds 16clicks......or something like that i forget exactly.
Those scopes if I remember correctly have a .25"@100yd adjustment. So 4 clicks (ish with those scopes) is 1" @ 100yds. At 50yds 1" would be 8 clicks, and 25yds 16clicks......or something like that i forget exactly.
cdb1
Member
I guess some people love beating dead horses.
I was shooting at 20 yards. I used 10 clicks per adjustment on the elevation each time. So in 3 attempts, it should have showed a difference, but it didn't. The adjustment barrel indicated 1/4 M.O.A. per click. On the first scope I had, I finally stopped counting clicks and just started making half and full rotations of the dial to try to make something happen, but it still made no difference. I estimate that a full rotation probably contains about 50 clicks. It may even be closer to 100.
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I ended up walking out with a replacement again. This is now my 3rd attempt. There was nothing else in the store I wanted, so store credit wouldn't have helped me. Most of what they have that I might use is overpriced, which is why I don't normally shop there. I went there for this scope originally because they had a 20% off everything in the store sale. That's over now. Still can't believe they wouldn't refund me for a defective scope. But when they treat customers this way, it explains why they're in a position to file for bankruptcy. http://www.bizjournals.com/twinciti...-mountain-issues-statement-on-bankruptcy.html
Anyway, I tried out this new one last night. It seems to be pretty much on target. I'm afraid to try making any adjustments to see what it does. With my previous scope attempt, they bore sighted it at the store, then I tried shooting it about a week later and it was nowhere near being on target, and I couldn't adjust it either. This time, they bore sighted it and I was able to test shoot with it the same day. We'll have to see if it will stay lined in beyond one day.
My 30 day return period will be over next Monday. I might try it out on Sunday to see if it can hold its zero for that long. If it can't, and I can't line it back in, it's going back to the store again, or the garbage can. Whichever is closer
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