JUST "assault" PISTOLS that civillians are allowed (for now) to own

[t49si83]

My favorite "assault pistols" are the MACs. Here's one in .45 from MasterpieceArms.com [all pics are clickable for more info]:


Their new "mini" 9mm is probably the most practical:


MACs are affordable (between $330 and $360 NEW) and take military magazines (grease gun mags for the .45 and sten mags for the 9mms).

For a tad more federal reserve credits, an AK pistol REALLY means business:



If you've got the federal reserve credits to get something flashy, Vector arms makes some nasty stuff:

A Vector MP-5 type:


Vector's mini UZI pistol:


Vector's V-53 in .223:


I had one of these AR pistols built. They're loud! Save $$$ and buy the kit from Model 1 THEN an AR pistol lower receiver from a dealer.


This wicked thing is only about a year old:

 

[LooterLefty]

homeland defense

If you'd like to continue to be able to purchase and own these pistols, I'd refraim from using the term "assault" to describe them. No need to give the antis any more ammo.

By my definition (and the DODs) all 'assault' weapons have a full-auto mode.

 

[Alan Fud]

Are these available "regular" purchase or do they involve the $200 registration fee?

 

[Alan Fud]

Never mind. I see that some are classified as a NFA Weapon and some are not. I also see that the mini UZI pistol is out of stock. Anybody have specs for these two guys ...

... length? mag capacity? etc.

 

[1 old 0311]

Assault pistols are a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.

 

[Alan Fud]

I've got a PPK that sits in my safe because I have a Colt Pocket Nine that is about the same size but chambered in 9mm Parabellum instead of .380ACP and most people would agree that seven rounds of 9mm beats seven rounds of .380 any day of the week. This was all known and thought out when I purchased the PPK but I got it anyway.

If I had the cash available, I would buy one of these for the same reason -- just because ...

 

[LooterLefty]

Because of people making rifle-caliber 'pistols', all of that surplus steel-core .223 and 7.62x39 is banned from import. Because 'cop killer' pistol rounds are illegal.

Edit: And I don't think you need a NFA for an AK 'pistol'.. Or any other rifle with a PG and the stock permanently removed. the $200 fee is for SBRs, SBSs, FA, and suppressors, AFAIK.

 

[t49si83]

Are these available "regular" purchase or do they involve the $200 registration fee?

Everything I pictured is SEMI auto (click pics for more info).

Because of people making rifle-caliber 'pistols', all of that surplus steel-core .223 and 7.62x39 is banned from import. Because 'cop killer' pistol rounds are illegal.

Yes I am aware of that issue. The government would LIKE you to blame the "people" making rifle caliber pistols (divide and conquer). The REALITY is that the government saw an opportunity to expand it's power and TOOK it, then offered a flimsy excuse knowing full well that some gun owners would blame those "people" making "those pistols" instead of blaming the PERPETRATOR of the ban.

Assault pistols are a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.

Huh? Ever heard of the L.A. riots? There are many scenarios where a larger mass, longer barreled, high capacity pistol would be very helpful. How about just owning something the government is RABID about banning? I would say that is a problem that actually DOES exist!

If you'd like to continue to be able to purchase and own these pistols, I'd refraim from using the term "assault" to describe them. No need to give the antis any more ammo.

Notice that I put that phrase in QUOTES. You seem awful scared of the antis. All of the antis' "ammo" is based on lies/half truths anyway, so what I say isn't going to change their behavior in the slightest. I'm not AFRAID of my position (and the position of the 2nd amendment) that CITIZENS have every right to possess/manufacture more than JUST defensive weapons. These pistols have features that COULD be a little more useful for OFFENSIVE maneuvers than "most" pistols, and I choose to exercise my right to own them. I own several from that list EXCEPT the HK style guns, of which I have none because they're a tad pricey for me. Hopefully the PLR-16s will become more widely available.

 

[buzz_knox]

Yes I am aware of that issue. The government would LIKE you to blame the "people" making rifle caliber pistols (divide and conquer). The REALITY is that the government saw an opportunity to expand it's power and TOOK it, then offered a flimsy excuse knowing full well that some gun owners would blame those "people" making "those pistols" instead of blaming the PERPETRATOR of the ban.

Not quite. Those who made the pistols (Olympic Arms initially) were advised of what the existing law was, and were begged not to make them. Some even offered to pay Olympic Arms NOT to make them. However, OA decided to. As soon as the pistol existed, the ammunition was banned as a matter of law. All ATF did was enforce the ban, not "seize" the opportunity.
I don't care for ATF, but the blame for this one lies solely with the manufacturer who knew what the stakes were, knew what the law was, and decided to go ahead regardless.

 

[LooterLefty]

Wow, some people's egos bruise quite easily..

PS: I ain't scurred.. I just like to use the right nomenclature when it comes to firearms. And assault is a term that should only be used to describe FA or select-fire weapons. Or the actual physical act.

 

[1 old 0311]

Hi T49,

Ever try to aim one of these or are you more of the "spray, and pray, crowd?"

 

[Correia]

Pistols like that are fun toys, but I wouldn't want one for serious use. (I've used MACs, Uzis, and the Vector shorty of the above listed guns).

As a pistol, they are too big and heavy. Can't conceal them, and they are harder to aim. (usually have rifle type peep sights)

As a rifle, you can't aim them worth squat without a stock, and you take a long range weapon and turn it into a short range weapon. All the bulk, none of the fun.

For the riots that were pointed out, I would take any rifle over a stockless rifle any day of the week. (Personally I like suppressed SBRs) I've worked with subguns also, and would take one with a stock any time over one with out. A MAC on full auto with no stock is an exercise in frustration.

As fun toys, guns like this are a blast.

 

[LooterLefty]

Ever heard of the L.A. riots?

Ever heard of a 'riot gun'? It aint one of those..

 

[albanian]

"Assault pistols are a solution to a problem that doesn't exist."

I have to agree. I have always liked and wanted many of these. I got a few of them and I am growing somewhat cold on them. I have a AR-15 pistol right now that I have shot and it was fun but not as much fun as a AR carbine when all is said and done.

My buddy likes his MAC 9mm but I don't. I really can't see the point. I have a Beretta 92fs and I have three 20rd mags for it. I can conceal the Beretta and put it in s holster even with the 20rd mag. I can actually hit what I am aiming at with the Beretta and it is balanced much better. It is lighter and more compact and more accurate and more reliable. I can shoot it faster as well because I can control it much better than the MAC.

That being said, I still would buy one of those UZIs if I got the chance just to have it. I do like the UZI carbine and unlike the pistol, it is actually a good weapon. I can hit with the carbine. For anyone that has never shot an UZI, you have to shoot one before you can judge because they do shoot well.

 

[rchernandez]

In theory, these make good anti home invasion guns...high capacity mags and that fear-inspiring look

 

[MachIVshooter]

Take this as you may, but IMO these things are worthless as semi-auto pistols. They offer no increase in firepower, only excess weight and bulk. They are clumsy, hard to aim and more often than not ugly. Why get one of these things when you can get 30 round mags for your 92FS, G17, CZ-75 or a host of other pistols? The SMG versions have some value, but a select-fire carbine firing a rifle cartridge is far more useful.

OTOH, the AK and AR pistols, as well as the PLR-16 do represent an interesting and useful segment of the arsenal. They offer near-rifle ballistics in a far more compact package. While they aren't as carry-friendly as normal handguns, they are far more portable than carbines. I only have a PLR-16, but I have found it to be a very enjoyable firearm. With a supresssor, it would be an ideal HD weapon (far too loud right now, though). I'm getting ready to fill out that form 4.

 

[LooterLefty]

I have an AMD-65, hungarian tanker version of the AKM. It's short and handy, has a folding stock. Pretty much an AK pistol when folded up. I've practiced clearing the house with it, but personally a rifle caliber weapon would be my last choice for HD. Home defense senarios happen in close quarters. And you're reacting, on the defensive so you may not always be aware of your background. IMO, if you live anywhere near other human beings, it's an irresponsible choice if you have other options available to you.

In my mind, the 12ga shotgun is king when it comes to HD. There are varying opnions on what load is best, but you have a number of options to choose from. I recently purchased an old pump-action made by Hi-Standard from a friend. Now I'm in the process of refurbing it, and I'm planning to cut the barrel down to 18.5". The action's loud when you work it, and that sends a clear message in a universal language.

Sincerely,
A gun-grabbing liberal. (as in, I usually keep a loaded gun within reach. And if you enter my house uninvited, I'm gonna grab it.)

 

[Hkmp5sd]

How about a real "assault pistol"...that civilians can own...

My little Cobray M11/9....Cyclic rate of 1200 rounds per minute, which is a complete magazine dump in 1.5 seconds. Great for shooting down low flying aircraft and wasting lots of ammo.



As stated, the semi-auto clones are too big, too heavy, hard to aim, generally have lousy sights.

 

[t49si83]

Ever try to aim one of these or are you more of the "spray, and pray, crowd?"

The only ones that are difficult to aim are my MACs, which is a shame because once you figure out how to use the crude sights, the simpleness of the action, combined with a 6 inch stationary barrel, provide totally unexpected and consistent accuracy.

(Personally I like suppressed SBRs)

Hell that goes without saying, but this isn't an NFA weapons thread. I would consider a suppressed SBR with a folding stock to be my ultimate home defense setup, but the group I picked is made up exclusively of pistols that we can purchase and take home the same day. Complying with the NFA, in my mind, is working AROUND a ban (since NFA guns are totally banned if they're not registered/taxed).

Why get one of these things when you can get 30 round mags for your 92FS, G17, CZ-75 or a host of other pistols?

It's not that easy (except for the glock) to find 30 round pistol mags of CONSISTENT quality. Most are aftermarket.

I have an AMD-65, hungarian tanker version of the AKM. It's short and handy, has a folding stock. Pretty much an AK pistol when folded up.

Yep. I love the AMD. Vector makes a nice one that I want.