Long Range Handgun Shooting

[ARTiger]

I had the opportunity a few weeks back to shoot a HiPower with tangent sights. [rear sight is like that on many military rifles, except this one was 50-500 meters].

Now, having hunted deer and hogs with .357 and .44 magnum handguns for many years, I knew certain handguns can have quite a surprising effective range. Guess I never thought of 9X19 as a long range caliber, but the HiPower opend my eyes. Was able to hit gallon sized paint cans at well over 100 yards consistently and also, it was fairly close out to about 200.

So then yesterday I thought I'd try it with a few other pistols that wouldn't generally be thought of as long range guns. I looked up the ammo manufacturers bullet drop tables and just aimed over the targets correspondingly. The targets were gallon milk and Clorox jugs at 100 yards, shooting using a tree as a rest.

S&W model 10 .38 special with 125 grain Rem +P JHP's . . . 30% hits

Model 642 with same ammo . . . no hits, but one really scared milk jug.

CZ 75 BD with 115 grain WWB 9mm . . . 50% hit

Wilson CQB 1911 with WWB .230 grain JHP . . . 20% hit

and the real surprise . . .

Bersa Thunder .380 with 95 grain WWB . . . 60% hit.

In all cases the misses were not off very much judging by the dust puffs around the bottles.

It's unnatural to aim so high for many of these shots unlike the Hi Power Capitan with it's adjustable sight, but once you get the hang of it not difficult.

Guess that debunks the "most handguns are only useful to about 25 yards" fable. Anyhow it was good practice and much fun. Thought I'd share.

 

[ARTiger]

Now on the gotta get me one of these list . . .

 

[moooose102]

yeah, i was shooting my 45 acp last week at about 100 yards, at a stump the other side of where i normally practice, suprisingly close most of the time, and when i walked over to it, i could see where i hit is 4 times for sure. out of 12 shots. not to bad, especially for me. i think with enough practice, and some fmj's or pure lead slugs, i MIGHT even take it along for deer hunting! actually, i always do, in case i get a very off hand very close range shot. but i had always thought i would limit that to about 15 yards.

 

[JDGray]

The big dots on the sights, is the limiting factor for me, but long range handgun shooting is still fun. Shooting at something smaller than the frt sight dot, is quite the challenge

 

[steveracer]

At 100M I can hit 10 or 11 out of twelve shots standing two-hand hold in a 4" model 29 .44MAG. This is at a 10" by 16" steel plate.
Same plate at 200M, and it's down around seven out of twelve.
Steve

 

[The Bushmaster]

My Colt SAA in .357 magnum 4 3/4" barrel is capable of hitting steel targets at 100 yards from the bench without very much elevation of the sights and consistanly. So...I'm not all that suprised. People DO under estimate handgun long range capability...

 

[Walkalong]

People DO under estimate handgun long range capability...

Don't they though...

A milk jug within 100 yards of my 1911, with a red dot, is in serious trouble. Even without a red dot, it is in jeopardy.

 

[wanderinwalker]

I used to plink at the 100 yard gong at our range with my G-17 on a regular basis. The gong *was* a 2.5-foot circle. Now it is about 11"x14", no, maybe 14x18-20-ish. Still, it's not THAT much harder to hit, just out of practice now!

Of course, the other day I threw a silhouette target up at 50 yards and shot it with the Glock and a .44 Magnum. The Glock went 12 of 15, and the .44 went 12 for 12, including 6 DA.

Problem is, once the long-range handgunning gets into you, your shooting buddies look at you funny! And now I have this NEED for a 1911 with its better trigger, just to make those shots past 25 yards.

 

[Geno]

T/C Contender still holds the world record for a handgun at 500 yards using iron sights. The group measured right around 3/4" by 3.5".

 

[1911Tuner]

Long-range handgunning used to be one of my favorite pastimes. If I had a dollar for every old Model 29 and Model 19 that I shot apart in the pursuit of that tiny dot on a distant hillside...I could buy a couple more and start over.

 

[S&Wfan]

Yep . . . the bullet is gonna go exactly where it's gonna go!

The only two secrets are KNOWING the arc's trajectory (from a specific length barrel and cartridge load . . . and developing good shooting technique.

For my Model 29-5 S&W .44 Magnum, this means a 32" hold over at 200 yards (6" barrel and a 300 grain Hardcast flatnose bullet. The gun consistently groups under 2" at 50 yards, which equals 4" at 100 and 8" at 200 yards.

Once you know the various distances, in without a lot of wind to compensate for, you should be able to drop your typical "group" size right into the spot your are intending.

In a way, it's like arcing a football on a long pass, ya just drop in onto your target!

T.

 

[The Bushmaster]

T/C contender (and others like it) isn't a real hand gun or should I say a normal handgun. It's a specialized firearm and probably need not be mentioned in this string...Revolvers and semi-auto pistols...

 

[Old Fuff]

In .38/.357 Smith & Wesson revolvers, bullet weights of between 158-180 grains do better because of the slow 18 3/4" to 1 barrel twist. 50 yard machine rest groups are seldom good with lighter weights, and in particular those in the 125 grain ballpark.

For better results, buy an 6" older Military & Police, and you can hold up the front sight to adjust for trajectory and not cover the target with the front sight blade. A Model 14 (K-38 Target Masterpiece) or Colt Officers Model Match is even better. Colt's by the way, have a 16" to 1 twist, and will handle lighter bullets.

100 yards is a piece of cake, going further is quite possible.

 

[M2 Carbine]

I like shooting small or compact defense type guns at 100 yards, while standing, using two hands.
The results can be surprising.
Trouble is, with my 70 year old eyes the target is mostly a blue blob and the sights aren't much better.


Some targets from a little while back.

Beretta 22 Short Minx (white pasters) and S&W J Frame. Sitting.
I missed the silhouette, I think 5 times, with the Beretta.
No misses with the J Frame. But I consider sitting and resting the gun is cheating.


Makarov.


Kimber Tactical Ultra II. The 3 inch Kimbers are very accurate.


CZ83 9x18. 8 misses out of 40 shots. The CZ83 is right accurate.


I've since bought a tractor with a front end loader and moved the berm back to 110+ yards but haven't had a chance to shoot the pistols at the longer range yet.

 

[1911Tuner]

But I consider sitting and resting the gun is cheating.

While I'll agree that using sandbags for a rest is fudgin' a little...if the purpose of pullin' the trigger is hittin' the target...anything that you can do on the fly to help accomplish that is fair game.

Makeshift rests abound.
The wise man sees them and makes use of them when the need arises.

 

[M2 Carbine]

While I'll agree that using sandbags for a rest is fudgin' a little...if the purpose of pullin' the trigger is hittin' the target...anything that you can do on the fly to help accomplish that is fair game.

True.
But in this case I'm not interested in seeing how well I can bench rest the gun.

I'm trying to equally test myself and the (defense type) gun in the manner it's "supposed" to be shot.
I've got other pistols that are more suited for bench rest shooting.

So using a rest at 100 yards is the same as using a rest at 15 yards, "cheating".
Resting the gun just shows how well the gun shoots, not how well the gun and shooter can do.

I just like to make things harder.

 

[The Bushmaster]

Shooting a standard revolver or semi-auto at long ranges is just fun...Makes for a good afternoon of friends and shooting...Whether you "rest" the handgun or off hand. FUN!!

 

[1911Tuner]

I'm trying to equally test myself and the (defense type) gun in the manner it's "supposed" to be shot.

Understood, and acknowledged...BUT..just to play Devils' Advocate a bit...

IF...your antagonist is at a hundred yards, armed with a pistol...you've got time to drop to one knee and take a rest. If he has a rifle, you need to be scootin' while ya shoot, 'cause you're in way over your head.



If he's at a hundred yards and armed with a pistol...it might be better not to shoot at all. Not hard to convice a jury that you had no other choice across a kitchen. Much more prickly across the end zones of a football field.

 

[jgo296]

just think what you could do with a 10mm

 

[Snapping Twig]

I was surprised to find that my 5" .45lc was able to hit the 100 yd. gong w/o any hold over, just point and shoot!

250g RNFP over 7g W231 or 8.5g Unique and it's good to go to 100 yards.

As to .44 or .357, faggeddaboutit! You hear that satisfying knock just about every trigger pull.

 

[loneviking]

Hey---a CZ 83! I have a CZ 82 and after putting a Wolf 18 recoil spring and replacing the trigger spring (it's a surplus gun that's been sitting for years), mine was putting 12 of 12 under a pie plate size circle at 50 yards using Wolf military ammo.

My Colt 357 at 50 yards is often putting the slugs in right on top of one another. I like those steel targets that spin. Set up the target at 100 to 150 yards and see how fast you can make it spin.

 

[tasco 74]

has anyone here ever been to or competed in an ihmsa match? there are different classes as in revolver,single shot, and even .22 rimfire... my friend and i went to silhouette matches for a few years and we even ran the state match here in iowa one year... it's really amazing to see how good a guy can get at knocking down steel rams at 200 yards, the target aim point sweet spot is only 18" (of course the target is bigger) and the target must be knocked from the rail to count... they have to shoot off hand so to speak so they use a creedmore position with is laying on your back with your handgun at your ankle.... some of them still do pretty good in the standing position though...... it is kind of a neat game as you have shoot targets at different ranges and the targets are different sizes... like i said it is amazing how good a guy can get shooting long range with a handgun!!

 

[SASS#23149]

I am teaching a fella how to shoot his SP101 .38 special,and had him spot while I plunked at a rock at a measured 135 yards.He about fell over when I hit it once and scared the heck out of it the other four times.Then I had him do it ...same results.
He now knows the FUN a handgun can be on an outing.

 

[1911Tuner]

has anyone here ever been to or competed in an ihmsa match?

Have done so in the past, and loved the game. Fullscale pistol with 200-meter rams, and half-scale. Shot a "Silhouettas Metallicas" match twice...rifles...and was greatly humbled. Nothin' more frustrating than hearin' that distant "clank" and seein' that ol' ram wobble a little...and then stand there blowin' a kiss back atcha, like he's sayin':

"Izzat the best you got? C'mon boy! Bring it!"



Warning:

It's an addicitive pursuit. You'll drive ridiculous distances just to have the time of your life gettin' spanked by 2/3rds of the field.

 

[bigmike45]

ART,

The results of the CQB were kind of surprising to me. I have been shooting mine at that range and average 75%. I have actually hit 100% a couple of times. Like 1911Tuner, I love long range handgun shooting. I started out with revolvers and eventually started using some of my semi-autos. I really like to head out into a plowed up cornfield and set out baloons at different distances and see how many shots it takes for me to pop one. I used to shoot my handloads out of my Model 10 that were running about 750fps and you could actually see the back end of the bullet traveling down range. This really helped in adjusting the trajectory and hitting the target.

tex45acp