Look What Followed Me Home The Other Day

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Driftwood Johnson

Driftwood Johnson

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My club was having its annual Christmas Party, Pot Luck, and Auction Monday night.

There were several Black Powder guns going up for auction.

A couple of Hawkens, a few single shot pistols, a couple of basket cases,

But look what caught my eye. A stainless Ruger Old Army.

pmcxLuOKj.jpg




We don't have many Black Powder shooters in my club, and when this item came up I shot my hand up. I got it for a song without any other bidders.

I have been playing around with it for a couple of days now. It turns out Ruger 'original model' Vaquero grips fit, so I took off the hideous oversized grips it came with and 'borrowed' a set of grips from one of my Vaqueros. They fit fine.

poKztZifj.jpg



It came with a faded copy of the original manual, but I went to the Ruger website and downloaded the latest version. Holy Cow, 40 pages. Used up a lot of ink and paper, but there is lots of good information in it.

It turns out this is an early one, it shipped in 1975 or 1976. Yes, I have blotted out the last two digits of the Serial Number in these photos, the SN is 27XX. I learned that the stainless Old Army revolvers came with a matte finish, somebody must have polished this one up himself.

I popped some caps to make sure they would fire, then I took the whole thing apart to give it a good cleaning and coat the insides with Ballistol. There was very little soot inside, but the spring and plunger for the hand had been installed backwards. It functioned fine with them backwards, but I put them back in correctly.

pnXqyWsLj.jpg




I have not messed around much with Cap & Ball in a long time, the only reason I bought this one was I got it for a song. I have a good supply of Schuetzen FFg, some CCI #10 and #11 caps, some Speer .457 round balls, and I must have some Wonder Wads laying around somewhere. I used to goop Crisco over the balls in a C&B, but I stopped doing that when I heard about Wonder Wads.

I may get a chance to shoot it this weekend.
 
Last edited:
Mark_Mark said:
Is this the Red Headed Step Child of the Cap&Ball Ruger made? I like the Look!!!
Click to expand...

I highly recommend one if you have the means.

@Driftwood Johnson , I’ve seen them installed backwards, also seen a situation where the grip strap pinched the last 1/4” of the spring so the plunger was only barely making contact with the hand. It functioned just fine.
 
woodnbow said:
I highly recommend one if you have the means.

@Driftwood Johnson , I’ve seen them installed backwards, also seen a situation where the grip strap pinched the last 1/4” of the spring so the plunger was only barely making contact with the hand. It functioned just fine.
Click to expand...
They have a Cult following, what do those bad boys run?
 
[QUOTE="Driftwood Johnson, post: 12484270, member: 174234]...But look what caught my eye. A stainless Ruger Old Army...[/QUOTE]

Congratulations! You've got the best C&B manufactured, ever. To be frank, I was bit surprised when you said revolver is stainless, looked more like blue on photos.

One of the most important features on this revolver is cylinder collar, with small groove, protruding from front side, so lube, powder and lead debris and particles have very little chance from getting into base pin bore:

r4536x75sn2.jpg

Fellow shooters have 1858, and they told me that after dozen or so rounds, they have to take cylinder out and clean it, base pin also. Part of the problem is that black powder we can get in our area isn't on a par with Swiss BP, so revolver gets dirty, smudged, quite soon. Hopefully, next spring I will get Pietta 1858, cal. 36, target, stainless, and one of the first things I will do is to unscrew barrel, machine about 3-4 mm frame under barrel bore and install bushing in the cylinder. I would rather be on the range shooting, than cleaning revolver several times in a single day.
 
Onty said:
One of the most important features on this revolver is cylinder collar, with small groove, protruding from front side, so lube, powder and lead debris and particles have very little chance from getting into base pin bore:
Click to expand...

Yup, Ruger had a lot of experience designing revolvers. A nice big bushing on the front of the cylinder should go a long way towards keeping fouling blasted out of the barrel/cylinder gap from being deposited on the cylinder pin. The main reason revolvers tend to bind up when fired with Black Powder.

posPYyUGj.jpg




Onty said:
Fellow shooters have 1858, and they told me that after dozen or so rounds, they have to take cylinder out and clean it, base pin also. Part of the problem is that black powder we can get in our area isn't on a par with Swiss BP, so revolver gets dirty, smudged, quite soon. Hopefully, next spring I will get Pietta 1858, cal. 36, target, stainless, and one of the first things I will do is to unscrew barrel, machine about 3-4 mm frame under barrel bore and install bushing in the cylinder. I would rather be on the range shooting, than cleaning revolver several times in a single day.
Click to expand...

I have never used Swiss. Just never wanted to pay the extra cost. All of my Black Powder shooting has been with Goex and Schuetzen for many years now. Schuetzen tends to burn a little bit cleaner than Goex because it uses a better grade of charcoal.

Yup, absolutely true about Remingtons binding up quickly. I have a couple of 1858 Remingtons, and they bind up quickly with fouling because they lack a bushing on the front of the cylinder. I mostly shoot my 1858s with cartridge conversion cylinders chambered for 45 Colt. Almost exclusively with cartridges loaded with Black Powder. The style of conversion cylinder I use in my Remingtons is the R&D style, that needs to be removed from the revolver in order to load it because it has a separate cap for the rear of the cylinder.

plHhasuij.jpg




There is no collar on the front of the cylinder, with either the conversion cylinder on the left in this photo, or the original C&P cylinder on the right.

powY4pFDj.jpg




The front of the cylinder on a Remington is in the same plane as the barrel/cylinder gap. Because there is no collar on the front of the cylinder to shield the cylinder pin from fouling blasted out of the b/c gap, fouling builds up quickly on the cylinder pin, binding the cylinder. Because this style of conversion cylinder needs to be removed from the frame to poke out empty brass and reload with fresh ammo, I always wipe the front of the cylinder with a damp rag every time I pull out the cylinder.

pngFkofHj.jpg




Cap and Ball Colts tend to do better, regarding the buildup of fouling. As can be seen in this photo, my Pietta replica of the 1860 Colt Army had a helical groove running around the arbor. This tends to give fouling a place to collect without binding the cylinder. Also, the Colt arbor is much larger in diameter than the Remington cylinder pin, which is only about 1/4" in diameter. The larger surface area of the 'Colt' arbor means fouling will not tend to build up as quickly as on the Remington pin. You can see I cut some grooves around the pin of this Remington, in an attempt to create reliefs for fouling to build up. It did not help much. In practice, when shooting the Remingtons I load up the cylinder pin with bore butter, and wipe off the front of the cylinder with a damp cloth at every reload. This seems to work pretty well.

poZu3rgMj.jpg




While I'm on the subject of cylinders, take a look at the bushings on the front of these cylinders. Left to right, an Uberti Cattleman, Ruger 'original model' Vaquero, and 2nd Gen Colt. These revolvers all perform very well with Black Powder because the prominent cylinder bushings shield the underlying cylinder pins from fouling. Frankly, when Ruger designed their Blackhawks, I doubt they gave much thought to shooting them with Black Powder, but following along with what Colt was doing on the front of the cylinder must have seemed like a good idea.

poOObZ0Jj.jpg




Way back in the 1880s Smith and Wesson understood the necessity of installing a bushing on the front of their cylinders. This cylinder is from a S&W New Model Number Three. Notice the prominent collar or bushing pressed into the front of the cylinder.

pmA9BC4gj.jpg




Uberti compromised with their replicas of S&W Top Break revolvers by lengthening the cylinders to accept 45 Colt ammunition, but they did not lengthen the frame a similar amount to allow for a big enough bushing. Consequently, the Uberti replicas of the S&W Top Breaks tend to bind up quickly when fired with Black Powder. The cylinder at the front in this photo is an Uberti cylinder. Notice the puny bushing on the front, the result of lengthening the cylinder without lengthening the frame enough to allow for a prominent bushing.

pozmvmn6j.jpg




I'm really on a roll here with one of my favorite Black Powder subjects; cylinder bushings. Left to right in this photo the cylinders are from Remington Model 1890, Remington Model 1875, 2nd Gen Colt, and S&W New Model Number Three. Remington did seem to learn the lesson with their 1875 and 1890 models and did include a bushing on the front of the cylinder, although not the removable style that Colt used, and not as prominent either. Still the Remington bushings worked reasonably well. Notice how prominent the bushing is on the S&W New Model Number Three cylinder. I can shoot that revolver all day long with Black Powder loads and I never have to wipe it down.

pn9dDtyvj.jpg
 
Last edited:
Jackrabbit1957 said:
Depends on where you look, Gunbroker prices run high, seen them go crazy in auctions there, average price seems to be about 600.00 or so. Every once in a while I see one for less.
Click to expand...
I got my stainless ROA with fixed sights off Gunbroker for a buy now price of $650. I thought it was a very reasonable price since they’re quite a bit more scarce than the adjustable ones.
 
I took some photos this morning out on the deck in diffuse light from a cloudy sky. There should be no doubt in anybody's mind that my 'new' Old Army is stainless. It really dwarfs my old EuroArms 1858 Remington. The Ruger weighs 3 pounds 8 ounces. The Remington weighs 2 pounds 10 ounces. The Ruger weighs close to what a Colt Dragoon weighed (4 pounds 4 ounces). Not as much as a Walker though (4 pounds 5 ounces).

The thing is so big I don't think it will fit in any of my holsters if I want to take it to a CAS match. Might have to get a new holster.

pm4PSHPej.jpg




P.S, Yes, the Remington is wearing its 45 Colt cartridge conversion cylinder.
 
Driftwood Johnson said:
I took some photos this morning out on the deck in diffuse light from a cloudy sky. There should be no doubt in anybody's mind that my 'new' Old Army is stainless. It really dwarfs my old EuroArms 1858 Remington. The Ruger weighs 3 pounds 8 ounces. The Remington weighs 2 pounds 10 ounces. The Ruger weighs close to what a Colt Dragoon weighed (4 pounds 4 ounces). Not as much as a Walker though (4 pounds 5 ounces).

The thing is so big I don't think it will fit in any of my holsters if I want to take it to a CAS match. Might have to get a new holster.

View attachment 1120106




P.S, Yes, the Remington is wearing its 45 Colt cartridge conversion cylinder.
Click to expand...
look so dangGOOD!
 
Very nice find.

The loading lever design on the ROA is very similar to the Rogers and Spencer, as is the cylinder bushing. The rear of the cylinder with the safety notches is very Remington, however.
 
Range Report

I took the Old Army to the range today. Here is what I took with me. A mostly full bottle of Schuetzen FFg, a couple of Black Powder measures, Speer .457 round balls, CCI #11 caps, and some Wonder Wads.

poBSHxIZj.jpg




The temperature was hovering right around freezing, so my fingers got pretty numb putting caps on the nipples. Per standard practice, I fired six caps with no powder to clear the nipples and burn out any remaining oil.

I started out with some single shots, just to see how much powder to put into the cylinders. The manual said to start with 20 grains of powder. I loaded one chamber, but with only 20 grains and a Wonder Wad It was pretty clear the loading lever did not have enough throw to seat the ball and Wonder Wad and compress the powder. So I fired that load and moved onto 30 grains. It's been a long time since I shot C&B, but I quickly realized it was much simpler to use the large, cylindrical powder measure and pour powder directly into the chambers than to pour powder into the measure with the sliding rod and then pour the powder into the chambers. Best I could figure, with the old thumb over the nozzle technique, the funnel on the end of that powder measure was throwing pretty close to 30 grains. I charged each chamber with powder and popped a Wonder Wad on top to keep the powder in place. No grease over the balls for me, I gave up on that long ago when I discovered Wonder Wads. After loading powder and wads into five (yup, just five CAS habits die hard) chambers I then seated a .457 ball in each chamber. .457 is the size usually recommended for the Old Army, and seating these balls shaved off a nice ring of lead and gave a satisfying crunch with the full throw of the loading lever. Then I seated caps on the charged chambers with my partially frozen fingers.

I was shooting sitting down using an improvised rest. I started out very close with the targets only 15 feet away. I fired two five shot groups. I had one flyer on one target, and a ragged group on the other target. Then I moved two more targets out to 25 feet and fired two more five shot groups. I gotta tell ya, I was stunned when I walked up to inspect my 25 foot targets. Yup, I'm pretty sure that is one ragged hole that five balls went through. The other 25 foot target was not quite as good, so I only photographed this one.

pmb7Bu0Ej.jpg




I wanted to see what would happen with 35 grains of powder and 40 grains, if I could stuff in that much with the Wonder Wads. But I had been at the range for about an hour and a half with the temperature still hovering around freezing, so 35 and 40 grains will have to wait for another day. All in all, very pleased with the Old Army. A little bit more than 20 shots, no caps failed to fire and most of the spent caps shook loose pretty easily. Not to mention, this sucker is accurate as all get out.

Now I'm gonna go upstairs and clean it.
 
Last edited:
Driftwood Johnson said:
Range Report

I took the Old Army to the range today. Here is what I took with me. A mostly full bottle of Schuetzen FFg, a couple of Black Powder measures, Speer .457 round balls, CCI #11 caps, and some Wonder Wads.

View attachment 1120209




The temperature was hovering right around freezing, so my fingers got pretty numb putting caps on the nipples. Per standard practice, I fired six caps with no powder to clear the nipples and burn out any remaining oil.

I started out with some single shots, just to see how much powder to put into the cylinders. The manual said to start with 20 grains of powder. I loaded one chamber, but with only 20 grains and a Wonder Wad It was pretty clear the loading lever did not have enough throw to seat the ball and Wonder Wad and compress the powder. So I fired that load and moved onto 30 grains. It's been a long time since I shot C&B, but I quickly realized it was much simpler to use the large, cylindrical powder measure and pour powder directly into the chambers than to pour powder into the measure with the sliding rod and then pour the powder into the chambers. Best I could figure, with the old thumb over the nozzle technique, the funnel on the end of that powder measure was throwing pretty close to 30 grains. I charged each chamber with powder and popped a Wonder Wad on top to keep the powder in place. No grease over the balls for me, I gave up on that long ago when I discovered Wonder Wads. After loading powder and wads into five (yup, just five CAS habits die hard) chambers I then seated a .457 ball in each chamber. .457 is the size usually recommended for the Old Army, and seating these balls shaved off a nice ring of lead and gave a satisfying crunch with the full throw of the loading lever. Then I seated caps on the charged chambers with my partially frozen fingers.

I was shooting sitting down using an improvised rest. I started out very close with the targets only 15 feet away. I fired two five shot groups. I had one flyer on one target, and a ragged group on the other target. Then I moved two more targets out to 25 feet and fired two more five shot groups. I gotta tell ya, I was stunned when I walked up to inspect my 25 foot targets. Yup, I'm pretty sure that is one ragged hole that five balls went through. The other 25 foot target was not quite as good, so I only photographed this one.

View attachment 1120210




I wanted to see what would happen with 35 grains of powder and 40 grains, if I could stuff in that much with the Wonder Wads. But I had been at the range for about an hour and a half with the temperature still hovering around freezing, so 35 and 40 grains will have to wait for another day. All in all, very pleased with the Old Army. A little bit more than 20 shots, no caps failed to fire and most of the spent caps shook loose pretty easily. Not to mention, this sucker is accurate as all get out.

Now I'm gonna go upstairs and clean it.
Click to expand...
one ragged hole!
 
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