Travis McGee
Member
Tamara: you can bet that those "high velocity rounds" in his pocket were deadly (shudder) "COP KILLER BULLETS!!!"
MD - Homemade Guns Seized In Highlandtown Rowhouse
- Thread starter Mark Tyson
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Dave McCracken
Moderator In Memoriam
A tempest in a teapot.....
Caught part of this on local news,two channels, early yesterday. In both, the anchor intoned the buzz words, "Guns,Ammunition, Explosives", with the same look on their faces they had on 09/11/01.
The film footage was interesting. They show the cops carrying what sureasheck looked liked milsurp bolt actions sans stocks and roughed out stocks like many of us use for upgrading hunting rifles. NO AKs, Uzis, M-16s, Ar-15s, SKSs or anything else newer than WWII.
IOW, he was restocking some obsolete rifles and loading his own ammo.
His wife was interviewed. She's elderly, and was dressed in Colonial era garb, with mobcap. She mentioned she was a member of some White Supremacist group.
Undoubtedly, these folks are racist whackos. Also undoubtedly, the media are blowing all of this out of proportion,from sheer ignorance or malice, it matters not.
Lessee, if they kicked in my door, I guess the news would go something like this....
"In a raid today, police in Howard County seized an arsenal of handguns, rifles and shotguns as well as ammunition and a manufacturing setup for making more.More than 10 firearms, some possibly unregistered, were seized after a tip was received from an anonymous source. Several pounds of powder were also seized from the home of a man who is a former firearms and self defense instructor, hunter, Veteran and retired Correctional Officer.
5 computers were also seized, and an investigation continues into possible ties to militia groups and the Gun Culture.
When interviewed, neighbors said that the man was often seen loading guns and ammo into his car to go hunting or target shooting.
Chandra _____, who lives next door, says "He's a nice guy, he often gives us deer meat and fish he catches.
Police state that they've found no evidence of wrongdoing yet, but will continue the investigation until they do"....
Caught part of this on local news,two channels, early yesterday. In both, the anchor intoned the buzz words, "Guns,Ammunition, Explosives", with the same look on their faces they had on 09/11/01.
The film footage was interesting. They show the cops carrying what sureasheck looked liked milsurp bolt actions sans stocks and roughed out stocks like many of us use for upgrading hunting rifles. NO AKs, Uzis, M-16s, Ar-15s, SKSs or anything else newer than WWII.
IOW, he was restocking some obsolete rifles and loading his own ammo.
His wife was interviewed. She's elderly, and was dressed in Colonial era garb, with mobcap. She mentioned she was a member of some White Supremacist group.
Undoubtedly, these folks are racist whackos. Also undoubtedly, the media are blowing all of this out of proportion,from sheer ignorance or malice, it matters not.
Lessee, if they kicked in my door, I guess the news would go something like this....
"In a raid today, police in Howard County seized an arsenal of handguns, rifles and shotguns as well as ammunition and a manufacturing setup for making more.More than 10 firearms, some possibly unregistered, were seized after a tip was received from an anonymous source. Several pounds of powder were also seized from the home of a man who is a former firearms and self defense instructor, hunter, Veteran and retired Correctional Officer.
5 computers were also seized, and an investigation continues into possible ties to militia groups and the Gun Culture.
When interviewed, neighbors said that the man was often seen loading guns and ammo into his car to go hunting or target shooting.
Chandra _____, who lives next door, says "He's a nice guy, he often gives us deer meat and fish he catches.
Police state that they've found no evidence of wrongdoing yet, but will continue the investigation until they do"....
Drizzt
Member
Courtroom Confusion Over Homemade Guns Case
Wheeler Almost Freed Due To Technicality In Laws
POSTED: 5:41 p.m. EDT July 3, 2003
UPDATED: 7:07 p.m. EDT July 3, 2003
BALTIMORE -- There was confusion in court Thursday in the case of a Highlandtown man who was arrested Tuesday after police seized gunpowder and homemade firearms from his house.
WBAL-TV 11 News I-Team reporter David Collins said a public defender believes she came close to freeing Lovell Wheeler under a technicality -- two out of three charges were modified during this year's General Assembly session but don't take effect until late in October.
Wheeler was returned to jail Thursday on $2 million bail. Prosecutors pushed for a high bail amount out of concern that if Wheeler was released, he could stash ammunition and gunpowder in other places, Collins reported.
Prosecutors said police found 20,000 rounds of live military-grade ammunition and racist literature in Wheeler's house. The literature is protected under the First Amendment and included papers, books and information from at least two Web sites -- the National Alliance and "From The Wilderness" Web sites, Collins said.
The significance of the racial literature may be explained in a sealed police search warrant, Collins said. Police said they also found four boxes of ammunition in a locker and six rounds in Wheeler's pocket when they arrested him Tuesday at his place of occupation.
A preliminary hearing is scheduled for July 29, according to the Baltimore City State's Attorney's Office -- either a court proceeding could go forth or the charges could be dropped based on the police evidence, Collins reported.
Police seized 14 rifles, eight handguns and more than 1,000 rounds of ammunition, Collins said. Authorities said it is legal to make weapons in Maryland. Investigators said they are most concerned about 80 pounds of gunpowder they found improperly stored in the man's rowhouse which could be potentially harmful to others if exploded, prosecutors said.
http://www.thewbalchannel.com/news/2311772/detail.html
Wheeler Almost Freed Due To Technicality In Laws
POSTED: 5:41 p.m. EDT July 3, 2003
UPDATED: 7:07 p.m. EDT July 3, 2003
BALTIMORE -- There was confusion in court Thursday in the case of a Highlandtown man who was arrested Tuesday after police seized gunpowder and homemade firearms from his house.
WBAL-TV 11 News I-Team reporter David Collins said a public defender believes she came close to freeing Lovell Wheeler under a technicality -- two out of three charges were modified during this year's General Assembly session but don't take effect until late in October.
Wheeler was returned to jail Thursday on $2 million bail. Prosecutors pushed for a high bail amount out of concern that if Wheeler was released, he could stash ammunition and gunpowder in other places, Collins reported.
Prosecutors said police found 20,000 rounds of live military-grade ammunition and racist literature in Wheeler's house. The literature is protected under the First Amendment and included papers, books and information from at least two Web sites -- the National Alliance and "From The Wilderness" Web sites, Collins said.
The significance of the racial literature may be explained in a sealed police search warrant, Collins said. Police said they also found four boxes of ammunition in a locker and six rounds in Wheeler's pocket when they arrested him Tuesday at his place of occupation.
A preliminary hearing is scheduled for July 29, according to the Baltimore City State's Attorney's Office -- either a court proceeding could go forth or the charges could be dropped based on the police evidence, Collins reported.
Police seized 14 rifles, eight handguns and more than 1,000 rounds of ammunition, Collins said. Authorities said it is legal to make weapons in Maryland. Investigators said they are most concerned about 80 pounds of gunpowder they found improperly stored in the man's rowhouse which could be potentially harmful to others if exploded, prosecutors said.
http://www.thewbalchannel.com/news/2311772/detail.html
Orthonym
Member
Baltimore, eh?
Isn't that the same city whose police (not THAT long ago) burned some citizens to death by aerial bombing? (And, to boot, burned several neighbors' houses down as well?)
Isn't that the same city whose police (not THAT long ago) burned some citizens to death by aerial bombing? (And, to boot, burned several neighbors' houses down as well?)
Dave McCracken
Moderator In Memoriam
Actually, it was Philly, but the mindset is similar.
So Wheeler has to sit in jail for a month just to get a preliminary hearing to decide if the police have enough evidence or not?
So much for the right to a speedy trial and "innocent until proven guilty".
14 rifles and eight handguns would have most of us in jail for $10 million bail.
So much for the right to a speedy trial and "innocent until proven guilty".
14 rifles and eight handguns would have most of us in jail for $10 million bail.
Byron Quick
Moderator In Memoriam
"'E's got to be guilty or 'e wouldn't be 'ere!"
PAshooter
Member
On last night's news they reported that the State's Attorney is considering dropping all charges because... well, ummm... you see... it doesn't appear the guy's actually done anything illegal. Damn those loopholes!
If (and given the veracity of the local media that's a big if) the guy's really a racist wacko he gets no sympathy from me, but last time I checked that wasn't a crime (of course I haven't read all of the fine print in the Patriot Act). My understanding is you're supposed to actually commit a crime before being arrested, convicted, and incarcerated. Call me old fashioned.
Of course, the way the local news reported the story, the fact that the man had "thousands of military-style bullets" in his home makes him guilty of a felony. I appeal to my fellow THRers not to rat me out
They did, however, show one of those "man on the street" type interviews that rather surprised me. They asked a neighbor how he felt about the fact that they guy might be freed, and he said "Yeah, I was wondering about that. We do, after all, have the right to keep and bear arms."
If (and given the veracity of the local media that's a big if) the guy's really a racist wacko he gets no sympathy from me, but last time I checked that wasn't a crime (of course I haven't read all of the fine print in the Patriot Act). My understanding is you're supposed to actually commit a crime before being arrested, convicted, and incarcerated. Call me old fashioned.
Of course, the way the local news reported the story, the fact that the man had "thousands of military-style bullets" in his home makes him guilty of a felony. I appeal to my fellow THRers not to rat me out
They did, however, show one of those "man on the street" type interviews that rather surprised me. They asked a neighbor how he felt about the fact that they guy might be freed, and he said "Yeah, I was wondering about that. We do, after all, have the right to keep and bear arms."
Tamara
Senior Member
Dear me! He has... *GASP!* "military-grade" ammunition!
Orthonym
Member
OOPS!
Yep, Philadelphia. Sorry, those places all look alike to me. Row houses are a bad idea for all sorts of reasons,IMHO.
Yep, Philadelphia. Sorry, those places all look alike to me. Row houses are a bad idea for all sorts of reasons,IMHO.
Giant
Member
We have here no, none, nada, verified statements of what this old guy is reported to have said. Could have been anything or nothing. "I like white bread and black beans" or was it; "Black bread and white beans."
Who do we know who might have a drill press, a Dremel Tool set, various power tools?
Fourteen rifles and six or eight wheel guns or pistols. Anyone here know someone like that.
Anyone here have a couple of old Mausers or Enfields laying about, no stock and waiting for parts or a new barrel?
Any reloaders here? I reload, at times have twenty five or thirty pounds of powder in plastic bottles and tin cans. Bottles and cans DOT approved. Also, at least five thousand and sometimes ten thousand primers. Minimum order where I shop is five thousand primers. Everything properly stored, as per DOT pamplet. Everything legal, I'm way under the limit set by the state and federal folk.
How about military approved ammo? Know of anyone with "Mil Spec" ammo? I have over twelve thousand rounds in different calibers on hand, some of it "Mil Spec" and dated 1939 or 1940, and since I'm running a little low I might buy another case or two. It is legel for me to buy ammo and I intend to buy it and shoot it! I always need more .22LR and I don't even bother to count that in my inventory.
My home looks like a library, one can find books, newspapers, magazines here on many subjects. How can anyone know their friends or their enemy without informing oneself of what their philosophy might be? I am not what I read or think!
We here on The High Road are among the most brilliant and accomplished in the nation. Look at the corporation of our employment, the professional or hobby organizations we belong to and the think tanks we advise, the institutes we are fellows of. Anyone here think we are not on a bunch of list?
We are the intelligentsia of the nation. Let us do what we can in a legal way to maintain freedom in america. If we lose focus of that we are lost!
Giant
Who do we know who might have a drill press, a Dremel Tool set, various power tools?
Fourteen rifles and six or eight wheel guns or pistols. Anyone here know someone like that.
Anyone here have a couple of old Mausers or Enfields laying about, no stock and waiting for parts or a new barrel?
Any reloaders here? I reload, at times have twenty five or thirty pounds of powder in plastic bottles and tin cans. Bottles and cans DOT approved. Also, at least five thousand and sometimes ten thousand primers. Minimum order where I shop is five thousand primers. Everything properly stored, as per DOT pamplet. Everything legal, I'm way under the limit set by the state and federal folk.
How about military approved ammo? Know of anyone with "Mil Spec" ammo? I have over twelve thousand rounds in different calibers on hand, some of it "Mil Spec" and dated 1939 or 1940, and since I'm running a little low I might buy another case or two. It is legel for me to buy ammo and I intend to buy it and shoot it! I always need more .22LR and I don't even bother to count that in my inventory.
My home looks like a library, one can find books, newspapers, magazines here on many subjects. How can anyone know their friends or their enemy without informing oneself of what their philosophy might be? I am not what I read or think!
We here on The High Road are among the most brilliant and accomplished in the nation. Look at the corporation of our employment, the professional or hobby organizations we belong to and the think tanks we advise, the institutes we are fellows of. Anyone here think we are not on a bunch of list?
We are the intelligentsia of the nation. Let us do what we can in a legal way to maintain freedom in america. If we lose focus of that we are lost!
Giant
Alan Smithiee
Member
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2002
- Messages
- 248
Amazing! after almost 4 years someone FINNALY got the joke!!
"Also Nanaimo Bar(r), got a good recipe? I haven't had a good one since moving from the PNW 5 years ago. I always thought the best were on the BC Ferries."
as a matter of fact I do.. right from, of all Places, Nanaimo British Columbia, my old home town.
BC Ferries and a Theater on on Dunbar St. in Vancouver have the best.
now back to the topic at hand...
so, what we actualy have is a guy held on some sort of secret warrent? no one seems to actualy know the charges this guy is faceing? or did I miss something?
"Also Nanaimo Bar(r), got a good recipe? I haven't had a good one since moving from the PNW 5 years ago. I always thought the best were on the BC Ferries."
as a matter of fact I do.. right from, of all Places, Nanaimo British Columbia, my old home town.
BC Ferries and a Theater on on Dunbar St. in Vancouver have the best.
now back to the topic at hand...
so, what we actualy have is a guy held on some sort of secret warrent? no one seems to actualy know the charges this guy is faceing? or did I miss something?
PAshooter
Member
Update on the Lovell Wheeler case.
Mr. Wheeler had his "day in court" yesterday and this was the outcome:
Keep in mind the most serious charge against him is Reckless Endangerment, a misdemeanor which carries a maximum penalty of 5 years in prison. The charge stems from the fact that Mr. Wheeler had "large quantities" of smokeless powder stored "improperly" in his row home. Mr. Wheeler is 61 years old, employed, and has no prior criminal record. All cash, guns, and powder were removed from the Wheeler home by police.
Prosecutors presented an expert witness - an explosives expert from the Army Corp of Engineers - who testified that there was enough smokeless powder in Wheeler's home to create an explosion that would not only demolish his house but also the homes of his immediate neighbors. In addition, the quantities of loaded ammunition present would keep detonating for hours, preventing firefighters and rescue workers from getting near the house to put out the fire and care for any victims. It was also presented that quantities of white supremacist literature were found in the home... not sure what that's evidence of, but they wanted to make sure the judge heard that.
The judge ruled that Mr. Wheeler's $2 million bail (which he never posted) be revoked and he be held without bail until his trial in November. Obviously he's a danger to the community.
Sorry I can't provide a link to an article - I heard the story on WBAL radio in Baltimore on my way to work this morning and have tried to relate what I heard as accurately as I could.
I leave it to the good readers of THR to draw their own conclusions.
In other news: murderers, drug dealers, gangbangers, and sundry other lowlifes continue to routinely make their meager bails and are returned to the streets of our fair city...
Mr. Wheeler had his "day in court" yesterday and this was the outcome:
Keep in mind the most serious charge against him is Reckless Endangerment, a misdemeanor which carries a maximum penalty of 5 years in prison. The charge stems from the fact that Mr. Wheeler had "large quantities" of smokeless powder stored "improperly" in his row home. Mr. Wheeler is 61 years old, employed, and has no prior criminal record. All cash, guns, and powder were removed from the Wheeler home by police.
Prosecutors presented an expert witness - an explosives expert from the Army Corp of Engineers - who testified that there was enough smokeless powder in Wheeler's home to create an explosion that would not only demolish his house but also the homes of his immediate neighbors. In addition, the quantities of loaded ammunition present would keep detonating for hours, preventing firefighters and rescue workers from getting near the house to put out the fire and care for any victims. It was also presented that quantities of white supremacist literature were found in the home... not sure what that's evidence of, but they wanted to make sure the judge heard that.
The judge ruled that Mr. Wheeler's $2 million bail (which he never posted) be revoked and he be held without bail until his trial in November. Obviously he's a danger to the community.
Sorry I can't provide a link to an article - I heard the story on WBAL radio in Baltimore on my way to work this morning and have tried to relate what I heard as accurately as I could.
I leave it to the good readers of THR to draw their own conclusions.
In other news: murderers, drug dealers, gangbangers, and sundry other lowlifes continue to routinely make their meager bails and are returned to the streets of our fair city...
greyhound
Member
There seems to be little interest in the media about this right now. One local talk show host (Ron Smith on WBAL) has been hammering this subject all week long, including interviews with the wife.
Most of the callers seem to be of the opinion that this is ridiculous and clearly based soley on his (despicable) un-PC views. I am sad to report, though, that I have not heard one African-American caller who does not agree with his imprisonment/huge bail (though given his views maybe this is understandable).
Most of the callers seem to be of the opinion that this is ridiculous and clearly based soley on his (despicable) un-PC views. I am sad to report, though, that I have not heard one African-American caller who does not agree with his imprisonment/huge bail (though given his views maybe this is understandable).
gun-fucious
Member
i kinda doubt that, as stored in various asundry plastic containers, the Gunpowder could detonate to the calculated potential power. If the GP was in 20 bleach bottles on a shelf and the row house caught on fire, there would be an impressive series of low power WOOOMPS!!, but its not as if the man had assembled a bunker buster.
Theres enough potential power in every parked cars gas tank to either drive 350 miles or drop a rowhouse.
i also wonder how many THRers have access to enough uranium to build a bomb capable of destroying a city just because there is an ore bearing outcrop on the back 40.
Theres enough potential power in every parked cars gas tank to either drive 350 miles or drop a rowhouse.
i also wonder how many THRers have access to enough uranium to build a bomb capable of destroying a city just because there is an ore bearing outcrop on the back 40.
greyhound
Member
There was also a good point on the radio show about how many people overall have all their chemicals stored in accordance with federal, state, and local registrations.
Things like gasoline, fertilizer, cleaning supplies, etc.
Seems like if they wanted to go around busting people for these types of violations, they could create a new federal bureau....:banghead:
Things like gasoline, fertilizer, cleaning supplies, etc.
Seems like if they wanted to go around busting people for these types of violations, they could create a new federal bureau....:banghead:
Poodleshooter
Member
Want to scare yourself? Go check out you local and state fire regulations. Search for ammunition, powder, gunpowder, primers,etc.
If you live in the suburbs or a city, what you find out may surprise you.
Live in Virginia and reload?
http://www.dhcd.state.va.us/Forms/DBFR/1SFPC.pdf
Scroll to page 20 in your PDF browser
Go to page 20. Hope you only have 1000 primers (1 box!!!!) and less than 15lbs of powder!
If you live in the suburbs or a city, what you find out may surprise you.
Live in Virginia and reload?
http://www.dhcd.state.va.us/Forms/DBFR/1SFPC.pdf
Scroll to page 20 in your PDF browser
Go to page 20. Hope you only have 1000 primers (1 box!!!!) and less than 15lbs of powder!
Augustwest
Member
And a judge bought the argument.
More and more, I'm aware of just how compromised the judicial branches of the Fed and State gov'ts really are.
edited to add:
Better still...
I think the "dangerous" part was supposed to be the 60,000 plus rounds of ammunition he allegedly had.
I've never had more than 300 rounds stored at a time, so I have no idea of the real magnitude of storing this much ammo.
Oh....and the prosecutors admitted that they're going after him so hard because his views are too radical and dangerous.
Thank God for the First Amendment, eh?
Interesting too, is that he's been appointed a Black Public Defender.
I've never had more than 300 rounds stored at a time, so I have no idea of the real magnitude of storing this much ammo.
Oh....and the prosecutors admitted that they're going after him so hard because his views are too radical and dangerous.
Thank God for the First Amendment, eh?
Interesting too, is that he's been appointed a Black Public Defender.
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