Methods to Remove Unfired 7.62 Cartridge Stuck In Chamber

[a5werkes]

I have been reviewing recommended gunsmith methods, ~1940 to present day, of removing a unfired cartridge stuck in the chamber; I am particularly interested in determining if its possible to have a consensus of professionals as to approach sequence or a recommended safe algorithm for a specific cartridge and gun in order to limit the methods that may not be otherwise applicable.

Besides the obvious as treating it as is, a loaded weapon when it arrives in the shop....what happens next ?

Your methods in 2016 with best do's / don'ts to

Prevent gunsmith injury - working on the bench, vise, ballistic cloths e.g. kevlar over the action, dedicated armored shielding / shrouding about the breech ?

Attempts at "mortaring" the action to solve the malfunction ?

prevent / neutralize primer ignition ?
solvents / drilling

Expose cartridge case - remove bolt / action / unscrew barrel ?

Approaches from breech v. muzzle ?

Rods (material and size relative to caliber) v. hydraulic methods

Let's use a premium factory loaded standard .308 / 7.62 match tip 168 grain cartridge really chamber stuck with about 0.25" from being in full battery in a standard AR10 action.

Thanks.

 

[TRX]

I'd also want to examine the rest of that box of ammunition...

Something stuck *that* tight, unless the cartridge were bent or otherwise damaged, I'd suspect debris in the chamber.

I originally thought I'd just force the gun into battery, fire it, and then drive the spent case out, but that would be a bad idea if the chamber had trash in it.

 

[joem1945]

No suggestions but good luck and be careful.

 

[dogrunner]

PLEASE do not rely on solvents or penetrating oils to 'kill' that primer even if you can gain access to the cartridge interior.

I, stupidly, managed to stick a loaded '06 round in my Dillon crimp die......I managed to get a hole thru the 165 hp boattail by carefully and slowly drilling....shook much of the powder out, but not all. The rim had been damaged to the point that no purchase was possible. I resorted to using a jewlers saw to remove the entire cartridge head....barely clearing the primer pocket. From that point I just collapsed the case body from it's base and freed it.....I'm just fortunate that I had enough ctg base to work with tho that cut was extremely close to the primer.

Out of curiosity I then took that primer and seated it in a fresh case....it fired! And that's after three days of soaking it with Kroil and bore solvent......;Be your own judge, but if that was my gun I'd give serious consideration to letting a smith do it or I'pull the bbl if my die method was a possibility.

 

[dogrunner]

PLEASE do not rely on solvents or penetrating oils to 'kill' that primer even if you can gain access to the cartridge interior.

I, stupidly, managed to stick a loaded '06 round in my Dillon crimp die' tried driving it out...no go, just jammed the bullet into the powder charge ......I managed to get a hole thru the 165 hp boattail by carefully and slowly drilling....shook much of the powder out, but not all. The rim had been damaged to the point that no purchase was possible. I resorted to using a jewlers saw to remove the entire cartridge head....barely clearing the primer pocket. From that point I just collapsed the case body from it's base and freed it.....I'm just fortunate that I had enough ctg base to work with tho that cut was extremely close to the primer.

Out of curiosity I then took that primer and seated it in a fresh case....it fired! And that's after three days of soaking it with Kroil and bore solvent......;Be your own judge, but if that was my gun I'd give serious consideration to letting a smith do it or I'pull the bbl if my die method was a possibility.

 

[Hummer70]

First off what caused the stuck cases? Wrong caliber? chamber obstruction?

Tapping them with rod from the muzzle can be tricky. Hard whacks can drive the bullet down and if conditions are right can ignite it. I have never seen it but that was the word at the Army Small Cal Lab from the guys in product engineering that had worked there for years.

I once saw a guy shoot five rounds of 7.62 in a 30.06. The 7.62 will normally cause hard bolt closure and he had picked up the wrong ammo by mistake. The rifle was not hurt but the cases were just about straight wall all the way to the mouth.

 

[edwardware]

I can attest to what dogrunner said from personal experience (Note: I am not recommending this, simply recounting it):

I wanted a couple dead LPPs (not struck) for use in case head medallions for a set of grips, so took a couple new primers, gingerly removed the anvils, gingerly removed the paper seal, and dumped out the loose priming compound. This left some harder priming compound in the cup.

I flushed the cup thoroughly with brake cleaner, and then lit the remaining brake cleaner with a torch. The brake cleaner burned off for a few seconds, and as soon as the solvent was gone, the residual priming compound exploded.

In summary, the priming compound survived flushing with a broad-spectrum mix of solvents (brake cleaner), and exploded as soon as it dried out. Count your fingers and eyes and think carefully about how badly you want to keep all of them.

 

[bainter1212]

I have heard that if you put the action in a freezer overnight, the brass will shrink ever so slightly, allowing you to pull out the cartridge (have never tried it myself).
The rest of the methods involve working from the muzzle end which carries inherent risks.

 

[627PCFan]

My recommendation, 2 days of PB Blaster down the barrel, muzzle up, then deep freeze it, as cold as you can get, then hit the chamber with a torch to get a quick temperate variance from the chamber steel to the round hopefully that combined with the pb blaster will loosen it up enough to tap out with a full bore size brass rod.

 

[WardenWolf]

Whoops, didn't fully see the OP. AR10. Presumably without a forward assist, as those were primarily AR15s. That's not going to be fun. You're going to have to pry the action loose in some fashion. Almost certainly the bullet is stuck in the rifling. You COULD try using one of these no-spark drill bits to drill into the case and drain the powder out:

http://bestsafetytools.com/product-1-9-6-non-sparking-drill-bit-en/134209#.VoqIovkrI-U

 

[jerkface11]

Drilling into the case would be a bad idea. Even with a non sparking bit it will still get HOT.

 

[WardenWolf]

Drilling into the case would be a bad idea. Even with a non sparking bit it will still get HOT.

Not if you go slow enough. Besides, cases aren't really thick enough for it to heat up before you break through.

 

[jerkface11]

This is what is known as bad advice don't do it.

 

[WardenWolf]

This is what is known as bad advice don't do it.

It's called having and using the right tools. Anything can be done with the right equipment. I would never recommend that with a standard bit. That said, the drill bits to do it are expensive. Over $100 apiece.

You know, if you can get to it, maybe you could simply pry the bolt carrier back with a screwdriver.

 

[W.E.G.]

On the AR-type rifle, mortar it until the round comes out, or the extractor strips the case rim.

If case rim strips, disassemble rifle so as to remove bolt assembly from rifle.

Freeze barrel as previously suggested, and use close-fitting brass rod to drive cartridge out of bore, and without placing you body in a position of peril.

If freezing/driving method does not work, fabricate hydraulic system to attach to muzzle, and force hydraulic fluid into bore until pressure forces cartridge from chamber.

 

[a5werkes]

Gentlemen, thank you for your responses.

I would like to focus for a bit on the various drilling methods to gain access to the powder / primer charges.

Of course, furthest away from the primer would be best, but with limited case exposure to the gunsmith I have not seen any firm recommendations as to the closest point of approach to a live primer .....would a Minimum of 2 primer widths above the top of the primer location be a reasonable recommendation ?



I believe from the above testimonials, it could be agreed and recommended that solvent neutering of the primer is NOT to be trusted.

With regard to drilling thru the head of the bullet it has been my observation that once the drill bit flutes grab / engage the lead even at low RPM, either the small bit
might break, the bullet may rotate within the cartridge neck or the entire cartridge may begin to rotate (which may / may not be a good thing ? Match tip bullets are virtually impossible to start a drill into.

Any tricks to drill from the muzzle approach please .
Special drill bits ? Minimum bit size ? Use of O-rings to keep bit centered ?



And finally amputation of the primer from the remainder of the cartridge ? Only after powder neutralization efforts ?
I see someone used a jewelers saw; I know some have used the lathe for the task. Any other recommendations ?

 

[rcmodel]

Was it me??

And it was stuck in an AR-10 with enough case showing to attempt drilling into it??

I would use a small screwdriver or dental pick to lift the extractor out of the case rim and open the bolt.

Then I would block it open so it couldn't slam back shut on the stuck round.

Then with the mass of the bolt carrier out of the way?
I would drop a 1/4" brass rod down the barrel and let the weight knock it out.

If that didn't work?
Then I would squirt some penetrating oil down the barrel and lean it in the corner overnight.

Then I would knock it out the next day.

Trying to drill into a live round to neutralize the powder, or saw the case head off is a recipe for disaster!!

DONT DO IT!!

rc

 

[dogrunner]

A5: The cut I referenced using a jewelers saw was quite close to the primer pocket....perhaps halfway thru the solid web....I believe I kept that stub, but darn me if I know where......Far as the drill issue went, since mine was in a taper die and held firmly so I did not experience any drill lock up and spin....I'd suggest you purchase a high quality unused drill and just proceed very slowly, you ought to be able to obtain full penetration if you take your time & back out at the least sign of binding.

From your description I would not be at all surprised to hear that you had to remove the bbl extension to gain base access to that ctg.....good luck with it!!


Just read RC's comments and I have to solidly agree with him.......touchy, touchy stuff you're dealing with....I knew the die issue I described was hazardous and I exercised all due caution, I tried the soak with some hope that I could get that ctg out but it refused to move. Chucked it in a vise & proceeded with the method I described..WHILE WEARING SAFETY GLASSES AND HEAVY GLOVES...and making sure that both ends of that die were directed to a relatively harmless area........and just because my method worked for me, it may not for you!

I gotta ask tho, just how do you anticipate gaining access to your described case sections in that AR10, plus why not separate the upper and lower entirely, ought be a lot easier to deal with and you won't beat that lower if you go the mortar route.

 

[243winxb]

Fix the AR10 in position, braced so it can't move. Put steel rod down barrel and apply pressure with the jack. Cover the action/exposed case head with a bag of cat litter or bird seed, or what ever is handy. Push the bullet into the case. Take out rod. Ball powder should dump out the muzzle. Finish "jacking" till case is pushed out. Not a professional. Just my 2 cents.

 

[rcmodel]

Just another thought on getting oil in the case to kill the powder, then pounding it out.

Are you familiar with how a Diesel engine works??

Compressing oil & air in the cylinder raises the temperature to the ignition point of the fuel.
And that's all that makes a diesel engine able to run.

That's what you have with a case full of air and oil when you start pounding on it!!!

Pounding on the dry powder won't ignite it.
Pounding on oil soaked powder might!!

rc

 

[Jim K]

Unfired cartridge stuck in the chamber? Fire it.

Jim

 

[243winxb]

about 0.25" from being in full battery in a standard AR10 action.

Don't fire it.

 

[Jim K]

There are just too many variations involved. Why is the cartridge stuck? Is the bolt closed and locked? Was the primer struck or not? Is the cartridge the right caliber? Is it a factory load or a dubious handload? Can the bolt carrier by pried back? Can the extractor be reached to disengage the extractor? Etc., etc.

The the OP gets into drilling and cutting up cartridge cases, which has nothing to do with removing a cartridge that is stuck in the chamber. Then there is the idea of drilling the bullet of the stuck round with a 6 inch long drill bit. Or cutting the head off.

Rcmodel seems to have the only sensible approach, though simply detaching the lower will be better than blocking the bolt carrier and will take away the chance of the round being fired by the hammer, a proper first step with that general type of rifle.

Jim

 

[rcmodel]

I'm not sure he can take it apart if the bolt carrier is 1/4" back in the buffer tube.

That's why I suggested prying up the extractor and opening the bolt all the way, then blocking it from closing on the cartridge again.

It can't 'blow up' if there is nothing behind the case holding it in the chamber.

It can ignite and blow the case out of the chamber, leaving the bullet stuck in the bore.

So stand to one side of the ejection port when you start pounding on the bullet tip.

rc

 

[Traffer]

I had a bullet stuck in a home made die and used the drill a hole through the slug from the muzzle end method. It depends on whether you can get a long enough drill bit in from the muzzle. But if you can get a long enough bit it is really a piece of cake. Otherwise you can try tapping with a cleaning rod fairly hard. (If you don't know how hard, don't do it.) Basically any way to make a hole in the case to the powder (obviously not going through the primer) to get water or oil in there will work. It doesn't take much oil to keep powder from burning.