Milsurp rifles questions (probably beating a dead horse)

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loki.fish

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Starting at the beginning of next year, I'm wanting to start on a mil surp collection, so I've got a couple questions for you milsurp junkies. I don't think I'm going to go the C&R route yet, it just depends on how deep I end up getting into this.

Ok, I think I'm finally coming around to the old Milsurps. I'm wanting to buy my first one, but I can't think of the name of it. It holds I believe 5 rounds and when the clip?(no sure if that's what it's called) gets ejected, it has a very distinct ping. I'm wanting to say it's a 1903, but honestly haven't the slightest idea. Could somebody please straighten me out on this.

Last question, and this will require somebody to be extremely nice to me :)

Can somebody put a link, or a list of all the common milsurp rifles and average pricing for average-excellent condition?
 
M1 Garand- US service rifle. .30-06, semi auto, clip holds 8 rounds. Has the ping.

1903- US service rifle. Bolt action, .30-06, integeral magazie holds 5 rounds. No ping
 
well the US M1 Garand holds 8 rounds, pings and ejects the clip out the top. it is semi automatic

the Steyr Mannlicher M95 from austria holds 5 rounds, unknown if it makes a ping. clip ejects out the bottem of the rifle and is bolt actions

those are the only 2 En Bloc rifles i know of.
 
Loki, check out surplusrifle.com. There's enough good information and links there to keep you busy for quite a while. Milsurps have a real tendency to multiply rapidly, so be careful!

-jagd
 
GET THE GARAND!
Okay, then you might as well get an M1903.
As other have said, the Garand had the ping and won WWII.
The '03 was in the both the big wars, although to a lesser degree (actually only about 30% of the American infantry rifles at the end of WWI were '03s, most were the M1917--oh yeah, get one of those as well.)
Get the 03FFL C&R (It's only 30 bucks) and get on over to CMP PDQ or you will be SOL. :evil:
 
One nice thing about a C&R is that you can get some pretty good discounts on stuff from the online accesory places like Midway.

A Garand is a great start to a milsurp collection and the best way to get one is to buy from the CMP. There some requirements for purchasing but a C&R is not required and they will ship directly to your home. Go to www.odcmp.com and clikc on "Rifle Sales" You will find out what you need to do to order one. If you live close to Camp PErry, OH or Alliston AL, you can even go there to pick one out yourself

I would recommend a Field Grade to start (Cost will be around $500) The Rack Grade rifles are less but they may not be as good a shooter. That in itself is not a biggie if you want to shoot the rifle. You can find new barrels for the M1 at reasonable prices and a good gunsmith can do the install.

For cheap and really fun rifles, look at the different varieties of Mosin-Nagants. A 91/30, M44 or M38 can be had for under $90 and there are plenty of them out there that are pretty accurate. 7.62x54R ammo is very cheap and plentiful. Another good rifle to have is a British Lee Enfield. Not expensive and a mainstay of the English Army for many years.

If you have a Big 5 Sporting Goods store near you, they typically have sales each month where the Mosins and Enfields go for cheap.
 
yea I am a junkie, and this is what I have learned about mil surplus:
1. American made is high dollar, unless you have deep pockets start cheaper
2. as stated above you can`t beat the mosin nagant as a starter, and you can get into some very accurate and very collectable like the ones made in finland
3. enfields are great and price reasonably, the longbranch made in canada and the savage from the US are at the top of the market
4. mausers, the german are pricey, the swedes and persians show workmanship out of this world. lots of turks, yugos, chinese, out there cheap
5. arisakas from japan,(mauser action) all are bring backs, some series and arsenels very rare and pricey, collectors somewhat anal about them
6. then you have the french MAS, the swiss K-31, the steyr, the italian carcano, bolt actions cheap and fun to collect
7. then the semi autos, like the common SKS, ak-47, ar-15, hakim, rasheed, fn-49, fal, garand, M1 carbine, SVT-40, etc, the ones from the 1950 and 1960`s can be collectable and a hoot to shoot
8 snipers watch out!! high dollar and unless you know what you are looking at, easy to fake.
 
Buying Military Rifles

My rule is: Always buy at least two and sell the worst one. That is, unless you can buy THREE and keep the best one at nearly no cost.

Right now I would get a Mosin, an Enfield, a K31 walnut, a K98 Mauser, and an M1 Garand. Two or three of each, sell the extras. You learn more from two or three examples than you will from one.

www.aimsurplus.com

www.cmphq.com

You are going to spend your money on something and this is cheaper than fishing, golf, tennis, or motorcycles and safer than restoring an old car or bowling.
 
There are literally hundreds of main war rifle types, and thousands of subtypes. Military Mauser rifles alone have enough subtypes to fill a very large book. US rifles comprise a small segment of the field, and unfortunately they also tend to be among the most expensive. For someone starting out, it's cheaper to collect non-US and non-German surplus. Whatever you buy, take the time to study it and appreciate it. There are great "for collectors" paperback volumes on most of the major types.

Right now, I'd suggest grabbing up pre-39 Finnish Mosins, WWI war rifles of all types, and offbeat Mausers from South America, Siam and the like. These have been going up in value quickly, and most have an inherent rarity that the market hasn't been savy enough to recognize. You can still get 28/30 Finns and M-27's for under three bills, though they're quite rare and almost all saw frontline combat.

The Swiss K-31's are excellent, and still quite cheap. But for collector's value look for underpriced 96/11's and 1911's. The K-31's will be under three bills for some years to come.

As a general rule, don't buy bubba and don't be bubba. That is, don't cut any steel on your rifles and don't cut any wood. If you want to swap it to a sporter stock or put a non-permanent scope mount on it, fine. But you can't replace anything you cut, and countless thousands of fine rifles have been ruined in misguided gunsmithing exercises.
 
If you want a M1 Garand like you originally described then join the www.odcmp.com and get one soon. They WILL disappear fairly soon and there are no more coming in to the CMP. Of course there are many in the country but you will pay a lot for them. As far as cheap milsurps that are worth way more than what you pay: Get a K31! Incredible weapon for what they sell for. And of course get a Mauser of some type.
 
I'd urge you to get the C&R regardless. You'll recoup the thirty bucks on your first purchase by not paying for a transfer - not to mention all the discounts on non-firearm purchases from many suppliers. The application is easy.
 
Get the C&R License

I agree with zoom6zoom. You will also save by not paying local sales tax if you buy from an out-of-state dealer. Spend some time on-line at dealers like Southern Ohio Guns, Samco Global Arms, Aim, and J&G Sales, (there are others as well) to get a feel for what's available, prices, shipping, etc.
 
+1 on the savings.
Once you get into Milsurp collecting, re-loading is close behind (.30-'06 and .308 are not cheap!!).
Heck, even just buying the $30 bucks for the C&R is gotten back with the first SKS you get (saving the FFL transfer fee).
 
The reason behind not wanting to mess with a C&R is because of having to keep a bound book of all C&R guns. I've got a bad memory and am trying to keep all my guns logged in case of theft, fire, etc. but can't even remember to log them.

CMP seems like a whole lot of trouble to go through just to get a rifle. Having to join a club, proving I know how to safely handle a firearm. Why not just go through a local gun store to get one?

Reloading is in the works now.....just working on finding a place to call my reloading area.
 
The reason behind not wanting to mess with a C&R is because of having to keep a bound book of all C&R guns. I've got a bad memory and am trying to keep all my guns logged in case of theft, fire, etc. but can't even remember to log them.
Click to expand...

heres bad news for ya. if your a C&R holder, you have to log ALL guns you get. after you get your CR. ALL GUNS. wether they were bought with the C&R or not.
 
I've never gotten a C&R myself because I detest the paperwork and federal oversight. I've seen enough over the years to confirm that choice. In one case, a wholesaler sold a nice Mosin to a C&R holder, and the buyer turned around a few weeks later and sold it at a nice profit on gunbroker. The wholesale seller was so angry at a buyer stealing what should have been "his" profit, he reported the incident to the BATF as an abuse of the C&R license. I doubt if anything came of it, but I sure don't like the notion of buying firearms with federal strings attached.

Basically, don't get one unless you *REALLY ARE* a collector and really will be hording your firearms. If you buy and sell a lot as I do, you can get yourself in trouble.
 
but you have to log them irregardless of wether you actualy used the license to get the firearm. ( meaning you walked into a gun store and bought a gun as a commercial customer) correct?

in that case, as far as im concerned thats the same as having to log all guns. :barf: ( moraly)
 
What's the big deal (from a practical standpoint)? If you're buying as a commercial customer, you fill out a 4473 - I don't see why also having to log it in your own bound book is an outrage. Just jot down the info quick and there you are, done in 15 seconds. :confused:

As a matter of principle, of course logging your purchases sucks, but we're not gonna get that one changed anytime soon.
 
In my case, logging is bad because I'd forget to log something and get myself in all sorts of trouble. Sure, I could save money, or I could not worry about forgetting a log and getting in all sorts of legal trouble with the ATF. I know how I am, and I know getting a C&R could be a problem for me.

Do any of you know if an FFL can order a rifle from CMP for me, then I just go through the normal 4473 and such from the FFL to get it?
 
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