More armor, tougher crooks

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Fred Fuller

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http://www.twincities.com/mld/twincities/news/14943409.htm

More armor, tougher crooks
Police concerned as more criminals wear bulletproof vests
BY MARA H. GOTTFRIED
Pioneer Press

Twin Cities criminals aiming to get a leg up on the law and other thugs are increasingly donning bulletproof vests when they hit the streets, say police officers alarmed by the trend.

When St. Paul police officers pulled over a reputed gangster in April, they found the traditional tools of a would-be criminal in his van — a ski mask and a semi-automatic handgun. They also spotted criminal gear that appears to be gaining in popularity — body armor.

Last month in Minneapolis, body armor surfaced in two cases. Police say a man they arrested was wearing a bulletproof vest he wore during a drive-by shooting. And robbers who brandished guns and ordered people in a business to the floor left body armor behind.

Blame it on three factors, says one Minneapolis police official. Body armor is more readily available than before, especially on the Internet. It's less expensive than it once was, although still fairly pricey. And criminals may be getting more violent.

"Wearing it is almost a fashion statement to some of these guys," said Minneapolis Capt. Rich Stanek. "I think about when I started as a cop 25 years ago, most cops didn't wear body armor. Now, a large majority of police officers do, but more and more of the bad guys are, too. They think it makes you invincible, when in fact it doesn't."

That criminals are increasingly turning to body armor is another stage of the age-old battle between cops and robbers. When bad guys started using semi-automatic pistols, cops upgraded from revolvers. Highway patrols have turned to Ford Mustangs or other sporty squads to keep up in chases.

Locally, law-enforcement officers say it's still relatively rare to come across body armor on criminals in action. Police say most of the vests they've discovered surfaced during searches of homes or cars.

Criminals probably turn to body armor to protect themselves in case they get in a shootout with another bad guy or the police, said St. Paul police Cmdr. Todd Axtell.

That nightmarish scenario came to life in a prominent case in 1997, when Los Angeles police got into a gun battle with robbers wearing full-body armor. The robbers fired thousands of bullets from their automatic weapons, injuring 10 officers and six bystanders, while officers' bullets bounced off of them. Finally, the officers fatally shot the two men.

"It always concerns me when the bad guys are better equipped than law enforcement," said Kent Bailey, acting agent in charge of the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency's Twin Cities office.

FBI agents in the agency's Minneapolis bureau have observed that people with body armor tend to be "the more violent felons," said Special Agent Paul McCabe.

Drug dealers, afraid of being robbed, are one group the DEA has seen with bulletproof vests, Bailey said. The majority of the cases Bailey has encountered involved people in the methamphetamine trade.

Gangsters also seem to gravitate to bulletproof vests, police said.

In the late 1990s, a couple of members of one Minneapolis gang were known for wearing bulletproof vests whenever they went outside, said Ron Ryan, Metro Gang Strike Force commander. The members of that gang were "so hated by other gangs, everyone was shooting at them," he said. "It was a survival thing."

But a recent case that Ryan found "more of a concern to us in law enforcement" involved a St. Paul gang member who had a bulletproof vest and allegedly carried a handgun with armor-piercing bullets.

"People of that mindset are obviously gearing up for police," said Ryan, whose son, St. Paul police officer Ron Ryan Jr., was fatally shot in the line of duty in 1994.

With the knowledge that criminals might be wearing body armor, police departments now train officers to vary their target pattern if they get into a shootout with such a person, Axtell said. Officers also have access to weapons that can penetrate vests, he said.

Under Minnesota law, it's legal for anyone to buy or wear body armor, but it's a felony to wear or possess it while committing or attempting to commit a crime.

Even so, not everyone will sell body armor to people who don't work in law enforcement.

"We don't want it to fall into the wrong hands," said Jeff Schneider, store manager of KEEPRS Inc.'s St. Paul store. "We're in the business of protecting law enforcement."

Some states have moved to ban violent criminals from possessing body armor. California passed such a law after the 1997 shootout there. Locally, some in law enforcement said they think it's a good law that Minnesota should look into adopting.

Body armor was mentioned in three criminal complaints the Ramsey County attorney's office filed in April and May, but in only one of those cases was a person charged with committing a crime while wearing or possessing a bulletproof vest.

In one case, a Ramsey County sheriff's deputy pulled a car over in Shoreview and spotted what appeared to be a police badge inside. He searched the car and found numerous knives, drug paraphernalia, a red police-style dash light, binoculars, a large can of tear gas, a semiautomatic handgun and a bulletproof vest. The badge was for a bail-enforcement agent, the complaint said.

The man, a felon, told authorities he had always wanted to be a police officer or to get into the bounty hunter business, but that story might have been a cover, said Tom Rudenick, a sheriff's office investigator.

"Any time felons are in possession of body armor, it really raises our level of suspicion as to what his true intentions were," he said.

Another complaint detailed St. Paul officers pulling a man over and noticing he was wearing a bulletproof vest when he got out of the car. When asked why he was wearing it, he told officers it was a fashion statement, the complaint said.

Axtell, the St. Paul police commander, believes that was a flip response.

"These are people engaged in criminal activity," he said. "They are wearing it for a reason."
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Computer-assisted reporting editor MaryJo Sylwester contributed to this article.

Mara H. Gottfried covers St. Paul public safety. She can be reached at [email protected] or 651-228-5262.
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Posted for information purposes only, fair use provisions apply-
 
"These are people engaged in criminal activity," he said. "They are wearing it for a reason."

They are wearing body armor for the same reasons as the cops. They hope to be protected by the armor from bullets and other insults. Unlike the officers, the criminals are more likely to be at risk for bullets and other such insults because they are engaged in illegal and high risk activities.
 
Criminals have worn body armor since it was first invented in all it's forms. This is nothing new, and about all this amounts to is the beginnings of a psyops campaign to prime the masses up for legislation - or "bans" - on private use.

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http://ussliberty.org
http://ssunitedstates.org
 
The solution is very simple. We just need to pass a law making body armor illegal and the problem is solved.

Already on the books in Indiana.

Edit: adding text for Indiana Code

IC 35-47-5-13
Unlawful use of body armor
Sec. 13. (a) As used in this section, "body armor" means bullet resistant metal or other material worn by a person to provide protection from weapons or bodily injury.
(b) A person who knowingly or intentionally uses body armor while committing a felony commits unlawful use of body armor, a Class D felony.
 
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Under Minnesota law, it's legal for anyone to buy or wear body armor, but it's a felony to wear or possess it while committing or attempting to commit a crime.
Isn't that enough law?
Police say most of the vests they've discovered surfaced during searches of homes or cars.
Looks like it's working.

The article really doesn't even delve into the whole gangster culture of rap icons like fifty-cent and G-unit who can be seen on most appearances and videos wearing bullet proof vests.
Seems like they may have missed a key cultural point there.

If you were in an area conducting business and thought you might get shot at by someone with a handgun or carbine, wouldn't you wear one?
I would.
 
The solution is very simple. We just need to pass a law making body armor illegal and the problem is solved.

Already on the books in Indiana.

...and that doesn't make it right. When will people learn that making an inanimate object illegal only inhibits those that follow the law. Criminals by definition break the law.

Make Crime illegal and enforce and allow all people access to the tools to protect and defend themselves and loved ones (guns of all kinds and body armor).... Only that will solve the problem.

Crime doesn't pay when citizens can fight back.
 
This shows why one must strive for accuracy in training. Getting hit's on the COM at speed are not enough one must be able to punch the head of a moving target.
 
Sounds like another good reason to repeal the ban on armor piercing handgun rounds.
 
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Problem with AP pistol rounds is that they don't expand - so if you are up against an armored or unarmored opponent, you're basically using ball ammo. Unless we had an armor piercing expanding round. I have an idea for that, but of course since we can't own AP pistol ammuniton, I can't test it.
 
Air Tasers work on body armor

Many sources say that air tasers work on body armor, because the air taser doesn't rely on impact, but electrical current which will penetrate so many inches of clothes and doesn't need to have the barbs pierce the skin. They can hook onto the clothes and jump into the body to make it to the other probe.
 
knives work on body armor as well.

The nice/bad thing about body armor, depending on which end your on, is that if you stop a slug with it you still have to suck up the energy.

The bonus here is that if you wop a BG in the chest with your .357 he probably wont stay down but he'll probably go down for a little bit.

.02
 
Maybe you guys could play this out to your advantage.

It could help your argument to retain the right to buy and own 'Armour Piercing bullets' and other 'Cop Killa (TM)' articles.


:D :D :D :D :D :D
 
Preacherman is right. This is old news. Criminals have used body armor as long as there has been body armor.

I'd suggest that you use a rifle or get really, really good at failure drills if this is a concern of yours.

I'm closing this before a member is banned for advocating illegal acts.

Jeff
 
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