The Lone Haranguer
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I will say CZ75 and the all steel (carbon or stainless) Smith & Wessons.
Most durable and dependable all steel 9mm?
- Thread starter MRick
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The CZ-75, Browning Hi-power, and the S&W 5906 series are the only all steel 9mm's that come to mind other than a few built on 1911 frames. The Beretta, Ruger P-89, and SIG pistols are aluminum frames.
The S&W guns are highly under rated and may be thge best of the bunch.
The S&W guns are highly under rated and may be thge best of the bunch.
3 gun
Member
Any CZ.
AnaxImperator
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- 81
I'll suggest a 9mm Tokarev TT-33 (or Tokarev-clone, i.e. Norinco 213).
All steel, massively durable, very little recoil/muzzle flip, easily taken down & simple construction, 4-1/2" barrel, sufficiently accurate within CQB ranges, and AK-like dependability.
At close range (15yds & less) it's a snap to sight down the slide (or use the finger-point method) and hammer targets in the A-zone.
While a full-size pistol, the TT-33 is a very slim piece, and doesn't print as readily as other full-size handguns.... especially wide high-capacity, or medium-frame/compact pistols with magazine/grip extensions.
Tokarevs are single-action only, and generally have an awkward (or no) manual safety.
They were designed originally with only a half-cock "safety", but as of yet nobody (including the Soviets) could get the hammer to release without pulling the trigger (or running it over with a tank). Seriously. The Soviet Army did drop-tests of TT-33s from 3 story buildings onto concrete and they wouldn't accidentally fire, and TT-33 collectors have reported that repeated pounding on the cocked hammer with a mallet or 2x4 would also fail to accidentally fire the pistol. The half-cock also serves as a catch, requiring that constant pressure be maintained upon the trigger for the hammer to fully drop. Jarring/snagging the trigger will release the hammer, but it will catch at the half-cock.
Most imported TT-33s have an added manual safety, with there being two types; one locks the trigger and is just above it, and the other is a trigger/sear disconnect located at the rear of the frame. Either are effective, although the trigger/sear disconnect used on Norincos is easier to rapidly manipulate.
Some people refuse to carry their TTs locked-n'-cocked, but plenty others who have a TT-33 as their main carry-piece (including myself) have no compunctions against doing so.... which overcomes the slow SAO and allows an 8+1 round capacity.
Although taking a lot of cues from the 1911 & Browning 1903, Tokarev did do a few things differently. Two of the most notable is the modular hammer/sear assembly which has integral round guides and drops out as a whole, and internal feed lips which aid & ensure proper cartridge feeding in case of a damaged magazine. The TT-33 was designed to endure the high-pressure 7.62x25mm subgun cartridges, so it can also endure +P 9mm rounds as readily.
As I said before, the TT-33 is a snap to field-strip
Aside from a low magazine capacity (for a 9mm, unless you can find a 12rd Norinco Model 213); a near-90 degree grip angle which some people find uncomfortable; an obviously military trigger-pull (gritty, but not bad); and the aforementioned added-safety, the Tokarev TT-33 makes for a very affordable and capable defensive handgun.
All steel, massively durable, very little recoil/muzzle flip, easily taken down & simple construction, 4-1/2" barrel, sufficiently accurate within CQB ranges, and AK-like dependability.
At close range (15yds & less) it's a snap to sight down the slide (or use the finger-point method) and hammer targets in the A-zone.
While a full-size pistol, the TT-33 is a very slim piece, and doesn't print as readily as other full-size handguns.... especially wide high-capacity, or medium-frame/compact pistols with magazine/grip extensions.
Tokarevs are single-action only, and generally have an awkward (or no) manual safety.
They were designed originally with only a half-cock "safety", but as of yet nobody (including the Soviets) could get the hammer to release without pulling the trigger (or running it over with a tank). Seriously. The Soviet Army did drop-tests of TT-33s from 3 story buildings onto concrete and they wouldn't accidentally fire, and TT-33 collectors have reported that repeated pounding on the cocked hammer with a mallet or 2x4 would also fail to accidentally fire the pistol. The half-cock also serves as a catch, requiring that constant pressure be maintained upon the trigger for the hammer to fully drop. Jarring/snagging the trigger will release the hammer, but it will catch at the half-cock.
Most imported TT-33s have an added manual safety, with there being two types; one locks the trigger and is just above it, and the other is a trigger/sear disconnect located at the rear of the frame. Either are effective, although the trigger/sear disconnect used on Norincos is easier to rapidly manipulate.
Some people refuse to carry their TTs locked-n'-cocked, but plenty others who have a TT-33 as their main carry-piece (including myself) have no compunctions against doing so.... which overcomes the slow SAO and allows an 8+1 round capacity.
Although taking a lot of cues from the 1911 & Browning 1903, Tokarev did do a few things differently. Two of the most notable is the modular hammer/sear assembly which has integral round guides and drops out as a whole, and internal feed lips which aid & ensure proper cartridge feeding in case of a damaged magazine. The TT-33 was designed to endure the high-pressure 7.62x25mm subgun cartridges, so it can also endure +P 9mm rounds as readily.
As I said before, the TT-33 is a snap to field-strip
Aside from a low magazine capacity (for a 9mm, unless you can find a 12rd Norinco Model 213); a near-90 degree grip angle which some people find uncomfortable; an obviously military trigger-pull (gritty, but not bad); and the aforementioned added-safety, the Tokarev TT-33 makes for a very affordable and capable defensive handgun.
searcher451
Member
The venerable WWII P38 from the Walther, Mauser, and Spreewerk plants: still locking and loading and going strong after 65+ years. And you can put that in your modern-day firearms and smoke it! 
fastbolt
Member
If I were going to choose an all-steel 9mm pistol destined for a lot of use I'd pick up a 5906/5906TSW. I'd think it not unfair to categorize them as under-rated 'workhorse' pistols. The 3906 would be a close runner-up, too, even though it's a single column model.
I'd think the Browning HP could also be considered a viable choice. Their reliability with feeding JHP ammunition might be variable, though, depending on the particular pistol. You can also hear of different experiences regarding the magazines.
I have a copy of a FBI Academy Firearms Training Unit report titled Semiautomatic Pistols 1987-88 (which I received when I attended a LE firearms instructor course in which the FBI was involved). It discusses the results of in-house testing of several 9mm service-type pistols popular back in the 80's. While the Browning wasn't included in the testing, it did note in the commentary section, for comparison purposes, that the Brownings used by their HRT (at that time) had over 80,000 rounds through them and were still considered good (notwithstanding replacement of barrels and small parts).
Although I've handled and used Brownings with good results ... (I have a friend who used to enjoy working on them, and kept a nicely tuned example which reliably fed JHP ammunition and exhibited excellent accuracy) ... I don't care for them, myself. However, that's not to imply there's anything 'wrong' with them, only that they don't particularly suit my tastes. Different strokes.
Although I can't remember spending any range-time with one, I'd think the P226ST might deserve some consideration, too.
FWIW, I've always wished that S&W had offered a stainless steel-framed version of their excellent 3913 model. A '3916', as it were. Such a model would have a good chance of becoming my choice in the 'one & only' 9mm defensive pistol category.
I'd think the Browning HP could also be considered a viable choice. Their reliability with feeding JHP ammunition might be variable, though, depending on the particular pistol. You can also hear of different experiences regarding the magazines.
I have a copy of a FBI Academy Firearms Training Unit report titled Semiautomatic Pistols 1987-88 (which I received when I attended a LE firearms instructor course in which the FBI was involved). It discusses the results of in-house testing of several 9mm service-type pistols popular back in the 80's. While the Browning wasn't included in the testing, it did note in the commentary section, for comparison purposes, that the Brownings used by their HRT (at that time) had over 80,000 rounds through them and were still considered good (notwithstanding replacement of barrels and small parts).
Although I've handled and used Brownings with good results ... (I have a friend who used to enjoy working on them, and kept a nicely tuned example which reliably fed JHP ammunition and exhibited excellent accuracy) ... I don't care for them, myself. However, that's not to imply there's anything 'wrong' with them, only that they don't particularly suit my tastes. Different strokes.
Although I can't remember spending any range-time with one, I'd think the P226ST might deserve some consideration, too.
FWIW, I've always wished that S&W had offered a stainless steel-framed version of their excellent 3913 model. A '3916', as it were. Such a model would have a good chance of becoming my choice in the 'one & only' 9mm defensive pistol category.
Ivy Mike
Member
don't forget the new CZ inspired designs being imported by Armalite as well as the Witness guns and Baby Eagles.
There are also the old Star pistols that had quite a reputation for being tough as nails. Sadly, I think those no longer qualify as they are all getting on in age and parts aren't exactly plentiful anymore.
There are also the old Star pistols that had quite a reputation for being tough as nails. Sadly, I think those no longer qualify as they are all getting on in age and parts aren't exactly plentiful anymore.
PX15
Member
HK P7..
Jesse
berettaprofessor
Member
HK P7 or Beretta 92 Steel I (all steel version...and very pretty).
Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
member
- Joined
- Nov 14, 2007
- Messages
- 13,146
A lot of knowledgeable people think the CZ 75 series wins the most-durable race, due to the slide design. Supposed to stand up to many thousands of +P rounds.
CH47gunner
Member
Baby Eagle - not one malfunction in ten years.
All steel, big, heavy, what's not to like?
Bruce
All steel, big, heavy, what's not to like?
Bruce
atblis
Member
Yeah
Slide mounted decocker to start with.
Slide mounted decocker to start with.
BlindJustice
Member
CZ 75 Variants
CZ 75B - thumb safety
CZ 75B Compact w/Thumb Safety
CZ 75BD - De-Cocker
S&W 5906
Browning Hi-Power P-35
THe Brits had a standing order of no more than
12 in the mag. and with the normal troops of today
coming in, a DA/SA with Decocker seems preferred.
Guess I made my decision since I own a CZ 75B - left
the factory in Jan. '08 - It has 715 rds of various FMJ &
JHPS with 100% reliability.
I had a browning Hi-Power in the early '80s. One of the first
models with adjustable sights. THe sights were better than the
Combat Commander I had at the time in .45 ACP. It did have the
occaisional FTF and FTE=Stovepipe with one brand of ammo
Federal I think. Nice but it and the CZ 75B could use a bit
bigger tab on the thumb safety.
I think the Colt COmbat Commander in 9MMx19 suffers like the
T33 in single stack mag. capacity.
Randall
CZ 75B - thumb safety
CZ 75B Compact w/Thumb Safety
CZ 75BD - De-Cocker
S&W 5906
Browning Hi-Power P-35
THe Brits had a standing order of no more than
12 in the mag. and with the normal troops of today
coming in, a DA/SA with Decocker seems preferred.
Guess I made my decision since I own a CZ 75B - left
the factory in Jan. '08 - It has 715 rds of various FMJ &
JHPS with 100% reliability.
I had a browning Hi-Power in the early '80s. One of the first
models with adjustable sights. THe sights were better than the
Combat Commander I had at the time in .45 ACP. It did have the
occaisional FTF and FTE=Stovepipe with one brand of ammo
Federal I think. Nice but it and the CZ 75B could use a bit
bigger tab on the thumb safety.
I think the Colt COmbat Commander in 9MMx19 suffers like the
T33 in single stack mag. capacity.
Randall
david_place_834
Member
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2005
- Messages
- 9
Hmm. Seems no one has mentioned the Sig 226ST in 9mm. They are getting tougher to find as everyday passes. I have a 226ST .40 and I love it. Seems a little bigger than my other 226's made from alloy, however with the same Sig quality. Another is HK P7M8 (wish I had the duckets).
Bartholomew Roberts
Member
From what I have seen first hand, the Glock is more dependable than any of the all steel frame pistols listed.
From personal experiences of people I trust, I think the S&W M&P and Springfield XD have the potential to beat most older all-steel frame pistols as well in terms of durability and dependability.
doc2rn
Member
Browning, Ruger, CZ in that order.
Another vote for the Browning Hi Power......
I have owned Hi Powers for over 40 years. My current favorite is a venerable model "T" made in 1969. It is the most beautiful handgun I own. It is fit and finished with care and shows it. It is also reliable and functional. What more can be said of a handgun ?...regards, Hersh
I have owned Hi Powers for over 40 years. My current favorite is a venerable model "T" made in 1969. It is the most beautiful handgun I own. It is fit and finished with care and shows it. It is also reliable and functional. What more can be said of a handgun ?...regards, Hersh
Thanks for all the replies! Some very interesting suggestions. I'm def leaning towarda a cz75b sp01 or a colt commander 9mm. Nobody suggested it yet but I'm also considering a g17 with a ccf stainless frame that I could always swap in and out for plastic depending on mood or temp...starting to grow on me.
pistolero6869
Member
9mm
for carry a Kel-Tec PF-9 only 12.7 oz 7rds +1 in the chamber $229.99
for carry a Kel-Tec PF-9 only 12.7 oz 7rds +1 in the chamber $229.99
pistolero6869
Member
9mm
for carry a Kel-Tec PF-9 only 12.7 oz 7rds +1 in the chamber $229.99
for carry a Kel-Tec PF-9 only 12.7 oz 7rds +1 in the chamber $229.99
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