cluttonfred
Member
Cripes, what the heck are you guys doing to get stopped so often? It sounds like some of you have been stopped more in a week than I have in my whole life!
My first armed run in with the police
- Thread starter thewillweeks
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A Pause for the Coz
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What!!! Wow, what kind of car are you driving? I have maybe been pulled over 4 times in my entire life.
Do they do that to every one in your town?
There has to be some reason they have singled you out for special dispensation.
RustyShackelford
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Post #24....
Thanks for the kind words & input.
I agree with your remarks 100%.
As I've posted a few times on gun-tactical forums, sworn LE officers in traffic stops are often looking for: guns & drugs.
Smaller PDs or sheriff's offices may want "asset seizures" or drug "forfeitures".
Larger LE agencies have more sworn patrol personnel. Many of these cops "work the road" & want to get the "big score" that will make them stand out in HR/annual reviews. They want to be "meat eaters" and known for making gun-drug collars.
The Miami Hearld did a series of articles a few years ago about how the Sunrise FL police made huge drug and gun busts. One narcotics Sgt earned approx $250,000.00 over a 3 year period.
And before you get upset or think I don't understand how cops work or how dangerous traffic stops are, I served 24mo in the Richmond VA area near 95(Fort Lee, Military Police).
Rusty
PS; once, before I went on duty, I searched my marked unit's back seat area. I found a hat pin about 6" long.
Thanks for the kind words & input.
I agree with your remarks 100%.
As I've posted a few times on gun-tactical forums, sworn LE officers in traffic stops are often looking for: guns & drugs.
Smaller PDs or sheriff's offices may want "asset seizures" or drug "forfeitures".
Larger LE agencies have more sworn patrol personnel. Many of these cops "work the road" & want to get the "big score" that will make them stand out in HR/annual reviews. They want to be "meat eaters" and known for making gun-drug collars.
The Miami Hearld did a series of articles a few years ago about how the Sunrise FL police made huge drug and gun busts. One narcotics Sgt earned approx $250,000.00 over a 3 year period.
And before you get upset or think I don't understand how cops work or how dangerous traffic stops are, I served 24mo in the Richmond VA area near 95(Fort Lee, Military Police).
Rusty
PS; once, before I went on duty, I searched my marked unit's back seat area. I found a hat pin about 6" long.
Sheepdog1968
Member
Sounds like it went fine and you did fine. Don't over analyze it.
THIS. remember that cop in Ohio, Dan Harless, who threatened to execute the CCW holder a few years back? Well, guess what videos is been watching on YouTube an hour before the first time I ever got pulled over, and while I was carrying
I was WAY more nervous than the other two times I've been pulled over, and the traffic stop was DEFINATELY different.
Sav .250
Member
Lesson learned.
Taurus 617 CCW
Member
When I get pulled over I have my DL and CCW permit in hand before the officer gets to the window. The CCW permit is on top so they can see it as I hand it over. I then let them know that I am legally carrying a firearm in location X and ask how they wish to proceed. I have never been treated with anything other than respect for doing so. The last time I got pulled over the officer thanked me for the way I handled things.
thewillweeks
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In response to the "don't idolize them"/"sir didn't help you" responses, I say sir and ma'am to anyone who's in authority to me so I wasn't especially using it per say. Teachers, even most of my friends are sir/ma'am, unless I know you really well you're sir/ma'am to me. Even if you're younger.
Sir helped me because it's my way of expressing politeness and respect. Each has their own way, and as long as it's recognized as the due respect required of law enforcement/ anyone else who can write us a ticketevil: ) you should be fine. Sir is my way of not being a jerk haha.
And, I will continue to open carry until I have my CCHL. I do it respectfully, and around here it doesn't cause any problems. Only one store in the whole town that asks you not to carry. It's a very conservative community. There is nothing wrong with open carrying as long as you have counted the costs appropriately. (Biblical reference to know exactly what the heck you're getting yourself in to before you start)
Sir helped me because it's my way of expressing politeness and respect. Each has their own way, and as long as it's recognized as the due respect required of law enforcement/ anyone else who can write us a ticket
evil: ) you should be fine. Sir is my way of not being a jerk haha.And, I will continue to open carry until I have my CCHL. I do it respectfully, and around here it doesn't cause any problems. Only one store in the whole town that asks you not to carry. It's a very conservative community. There is nothing wrong with open carrying as long as you have counted the costs appropriately. (Biblical reference to know exactly what the heck you're getting yourself in to before you start)
coyotehitman
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Yep. Because not immediately informing and having an officer see it, perhaps with your hand passing near it while retrieving your wallet, will be a much more relaxing, low stress, experience.
Arizona_Mike
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I can't claim to have had a lot of experience with police contact while armed, as I'm squeaky-clean. I'm mister 6-over and it's pretty much impossible for me to be pulled over. I think my last speeding ticket was '91 or '92 (was BS) but I had a very legit one in '89 that could have been handled as more than an infraction based on raw speed (and I'm lucky no tow trucks were available)--I learned my lesson.
In recent years I got pulled over twice, once for a license plate lamp out and once because of a call that I was driving erratically (so they said--my passenger didn't think so). No tickets in both cases. My observation is that AZ cops are super relaxed in these situations. I suspect handing them the "not a felon or violent misdemeanant card" along with your DL actually makes them more relaxed. Logically it should but I think many areas have cultural factors that interfere with logic.
Mike
In recent years I got pulled over twice, once for a license plate lamp out and once because of a call that I was driving erratically (so they said--my passenger didn't think so). No tickets in both cases. My observation is that AZ cops are super relaxed in these situations. I suspect handing them the "not a felon or violent misdemeanant card" along with your DL actually makes them more relaxed. Logically it should but I think many areas have cultural factors that interfere with logic.
Mike
RustyShackelford
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Related....
A few months ago(early Jan) there were a few posts on the forum about New York Jets football player Chris Johnson being arrested for a "open" firearm in his motor vehicle during a "routine" traffic stop(failure to stop at a posted stop sign). The Orlando FL police officer stated in the police report he saw the gun immediately when he approached Johnson's vehicle(approx 8:54pmEST). The make & model of the NFL player's vehicle wasn't listed either which I find odd.
Johnson who's from Florida has a valid Florida CCW/W license & pled not guilty. Note; the Orlando PD neither released any DV-body cam images or the city IRIS(street camera) footage of the traffic stop to the media.
To address a few other recent posts, if I were a sworn LE officer or state trooper, Id approach to the front passenger side(unless mandated by the LE agency of traffic stop SOPs). Id ask the occupant/driver: "is there anything in vehicle I need to know about? Are there any weapons or ammunition in the vehicle?". This would give the driver/CCW license holder the chance to explain how they armed or have guns in the vehicle w/o it being threatening or confrontational.
Police officers & state troopers are not super human or robots. In a traffic stop, I as the gun owner/driver would rather have the trooper-officer dictate what happens or how things go. When a officer asks about guns or weapons then gets a response that will allow things to go smoother. If other officers or deputies arrive, the officer will say; "he/she has a valid CCW & is armed, I already asked them" not "this #%*+ has a loaded gun that they were trying to hide from me".
A few months ago(early Jan) there were a few posts on the forum about New York Jets football player Chris Johnson being arrested for a "open" firearm in his motor vehicle during a "routine" traffic stop(failure to stop at a posted stop sign). The Orlando FL police officer stated in the police report he saw the gun immediately
when he approached Johnson's vehicle(approx 8:54pmEST). The make & model of the NFL player's vehicle wasn't listed either which I find odd. Johnson who's from Florida has a valid Florida CCW/W license & pled not guilty. Note; the Orlando PD neither released any DV-body cam images or the city IRIS(street camera) footage of the traffic stop to the media.
To address a few other recent posts, if I were a sworn LE officer or state trooper, Id approach to the front passenger side(unless mandated by the LE agency of traffic stop SOPs). Id ask the occupant/driver: "is there anything in vehicle I need to know about? Are there any weapons or ammunition in the vehicle?". This would give the driver/CCW license holder the chance to explain how they armed or have guns in the vehicle w/o it being threatening or confrontational.
Police officers & state troopers are not super human or robots. In a traffic stop, I as the gun owner/driver would rather have the trooper-officer dictate what happens or how things go. When a officer asks about guns or weapons then gets a response that will allow things to go smoother. If other officers or deputies arrive, the officer will say; "he/she has a valid CCW & is armed, I already asked them" not "this #%*+ has a loaded gun that they were trying to hide from me".
200Apples
Mojave Lever Crew
.
Your pistol absolutely! should be retained within a fitted holster attached to at least a seat framework when your vehicle is in operation. Why do you wear a seatbelt? Think! man, think! lol. Whoever mentioned an AD being possible if shoving the pistol between seats is spot on. Even trained LEO's often shoot themselves when re-holstering their trigger-safety-only Tupperware.
Otherwise, thank you for posting your experience with your traffic stop. It illustrates how cooperation can behoove everyone involved.
Your pistol absolutely! should be retained within a fitted holster attached to at least a seat framework when your vehicle is in operation. Why do you wear a seatbelt? Think! man, think! lol. Whoever mentioned an AD being possible if shoving the pistol between seats is spot on. Even trained LEO's often shoot themselves when re-holstering their trigger-safety-only Tupperware.
Otherwise, thank you for posting your experience with your traffic stop. It illustrates how cooperation can behoove everyone involved.
JustinJ
Member
In my opinion its a bad idea to have a visible gun in one's vehicle as it presents a situation in which a cop is likely to see it before one can volunteer the information. When the gun is seen first conclusions can easily be jumped to. Also, if one gets in a traffic accident and gets injured or disoriented its preferable that people coming to help not be surprised by a gun out in the open.
I would suggest being mindful of how one notifies a cop that they have a firearm. For example:
Bad - "I have a gun".
Good - "Officer, I would just like to inform you that i am lawfully in the possession of a firearm and that it is on my hip".
Better yet, if one has a permit say "Officer, i would like to inform you that i have a CHL and am currently carrying".
I would suggest being mindful of how one notifies a cop that they have a firearm. For example:
Bad - "I have a gun".
Good - "Officer, I would just like to inform you that i am lawfully in the possession of a firearm and that it is on my hip".
Better yet, if one has a permit say "Officer, i would like to inform you that i have a CHL and am currently carrying".
RustyShackelford
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Winner winner, chicken dinner...
The post really nailed it, .
Your attitude, behavior, mindset, speech etc can directly affect how a traffic stop goes.
You can say & do everything right then still be in a jam sometimes but the post above makes the point(s).
Do not use slang, profanity, sarcasm, humor, etc. Speak slowly and clearly.
As noted in other posts, gather all your pertinent data(insurance card, CCW license, DMV reg, DL) then slowly hand it to the trooper-officer when asked.
Don't get out(you may think it's rare, but in many areas it happens to cops often).
Rusty
The post really nailed it,
.Your attitude, behavior, mindset, speech etc can directly affect how a traffic stop goes.
You can say & do everything right then still be in a jam sometimes but the post above makes the point(s).
Do not use slang, profanity, sarcasm, humor, etc. Speak slowly and clearly.
As noted in other posts, gather all your pertinent data(insurance card, CCW license, DMV reg, DL) then slowly hand it to the trooper-officer when asked.
Don't get out(you may think it's rare, but in many areas it happens to cops often).
Rusty
bikerdoc
Moderator In Memoriam
Virginia does not have a duty to inform law.
I dont look like a retired police officer, long hair, beard, wear lots of camo, kind of look like uncle Si.
I have only been stopped once- tail light out- and got to use the line I teach.
With both hands on the wheel.
"Officer for your safety and mine I am licensed and armed, how do you wish to proceed? (Oh and my retired badge is in the console)
He said get it fixed and have nice night.
I dont look like a retired police officer, long hair, beard, wear lots of camo, kind of look like uncle Si.
I have only been stopped once- tail light out- and got to use the line I teach.
With both hands on the wheel.
"Officer for your safety and mine I am licensed and armed, how do you wish to proceed? (Oh and my retired badge is in the console)
He said get it fixed and have nice night.
Zaydok Allen
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It sounds like you did fine. I guess I agree with the cop that you should have the gun in some sort of holster if possible. The chances are slim, but I don't like the idea of shoving a gun with only a trigger safety into a tight fitting space that has no proper channel to cover the trigger guard.
Good rules are to be polite and respectful, just as you would want them to treat you, and it sounds like you were.
I'm not required by law to disclose, but I choose to in my county in some cases. The reason being, around here for a minor traffic violation the highway patrol asks you to exit the vehicle and come sit in the front seat of their car with them while you talk. I'm not sure if the reason is for safety, or to observe you and look for signs of intoxication or drug impairment. I've always questioned the legality of it, but I really have no reason not to comply. If I'm getting pulled over, I deserve it because I'm definitely breaking the law.
In that case, I'd probably tell the officer so incase he, or she catches a glimpse of my gun they don't get nervous.
I've been pulled over 5 times in my life, and gotten 3 speeding tickets. WestKentucky, buy a Segway or golf cart maybe?
I got pulled over in Wyoming once. The cop asked for my registration, and I realized it was sitting in the center console inside my manual, and on top of the manual was my 357. I just told the officer I'd need to move my gun out of the way to get to it. He was grateful that I told him before I had reached inside the console.
If a cop is respectful to me, I am respectful back. It isn't idolizing them, or bowing to their wishes, its just common courtesy. We pay them to enforce laws. If they are doing their job properly and according to the law, we have no reason to go ridged or get upset with them.
OP, you did fine.
Good rules are to be polite and respectful, just as you would want them to treat you, and it sounds like you were.
I'm not required by law to disclose, but I choose to in my county in some cases. The reason being, around here for a minor traffic violation the highway patrol asks you to exit the vehicle and come sit in the front seat of their car with them while you talk. I'm not sure if the reason is for safety, or to observe you and look for signs of intoxication or drug impairment. I've always questioned the legality of it, but I really have no reason not to comply. If I'm getting pulled over, I deserve it because I'm definitely breaking the law.
In that case, I'd probably tell the officer so incase he, or she catches a glimpse of my gun they don't get nervous.
I've been pulled over 5 times in my life, and gotten 3 speeding tickets. WestKentucky, buy a Segway or golf cart maybe?
I got pulled over in Wyoming once. The cop asked for my registration, and I realized it was sitting in the center console inside my manual, and on top of the manual was my 357. I just told the officer I'd need to move my gun out of the way to get to it. He was grateful that I told him before I had reached inside the console.
If a cop is respectful to me, I am respectful back. It isn't idolizing them, or bowing to their wishes, its just common courtesy. We pay them to enforce laws. If they are doing their job properly and according to the law, we have no reason to go ridged or get upset with them.
OP, you did fine.
silicosys4
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Sounds to me like the OP did just fine. Some officers are a better than others about CCW's, It sounds.
first time I got pulled over after getting my CC permit I told the officer I had my handgun and a CCW. It is not a requirement here to let a police officer know you have a CCW.
The police officer asked to see the gun, and I thought he just meant to see where it was located.
No, he took it from me, unloaded it in front of me, muzzle swept me as he was unloading it, took it back to his car without my permission, ran the numbers on it without probable cause, brought it back to me, handed it back unloaded, and kept my 6 rounds of expensive premium SD ammo.
That first time was enough for me. It was the last time I ever told a police officer I have a concealed firearm unless they directly ask me.
That was the only interaction I've had with an officer concerning my CCW until a few months ago, when I was pulled over for talking on a cell phone. Well, turns out that a following-too-closely ticket I'd PAID in full a few months previously had not been updated with my payment, and I was arrested for driving with a suspended license. I did not know this as no notification had been sent out because the ticket had been paid. It was a clerical error that led to a computer automatically suspending my license after a set time as there was no payment inputted into their computer records. I was a little miffed.
Anyways, during the course of that I was disarmed, of course. After sorting it all out there on the side of the road, the officer let me go to take care of it at the DMV....
but not before unloading my gun, keeping my premium SD ammo, locking my gun into the trunk of my car and ordering me to stay 50' away until he left because "he was scared of me going ballistic and shooting him, police have to be worried about that, you know"....after my having complied completely to the letter.
In my experience, if they aren't stealing your ammo, they are insulting your intentions.
I don't inform anymore unless I'm directly asked. Each time its cost me near $10 in hard to replace ammo.
That said, I'm always polite, respectful, and compliant, I doubt I would have been on my way so quickly with a suspended license, mistake or not, if I had acted as angry as I felt at the time.
first time I got pulled over after getting my CC permit I told the officer I had my handgun and a CCW. It is not a requirement here to let a police officer know you have a CCW.
The police officer asked to see the gun, and I thought he just meant to see where it was located.
No, he took it from me, unloaded it in front of me, muzzle swept me as he was unloading it, took it back to his car without my permission, ran the numbers on it without probable cause, brought it back to me, handed it back unloaded, and kept my 6 rounds of expensive premium SD ammo.
That first time was enough for me. It was the last time I ever told a police officer I have a concealed firearm unless they directly ask me.
That was the only interaction I've had with an officer concerning my CCW until a few months ago, when I was pulled over for talking on a cell phone. Well, turns out that a following-too-closely ticket I'd PAID in full a few months previously had not been updated with my payment, and I was arrested for driving with a suspended license. I did not know this as no notification had been sent out because the ticket had been paid. It was a clerical error that led to a computer automatically suspending my license after a set time as there was no payment inputted into their computer records. I was a little miffed.
Anyways, during the course of that I was disarmed, of course. After sorting it all out there on the side of the road, the officer let me go to take care of it at the DMV....
but not before unloading my gun, keeping my premium SD ammo, locking my gun into the trunk of my car and ordering me to stay 50' away until he left because "he was scared of me going ballistic and shooting him, police have to be worried about that, you know"....after my having complied completely to the letter.
In my experience, if they aren't stealing your ammo, they are insulting your intentions.
I don't inform anymore unless I'm directly asked. Each time its cost me near $10 in hard to replace ammo.
That said, I'm always polite, respectful, and compliant, I doubt I would have been on my way so quickly with a suspended license, mistake or not, if I had acted as angry as I felt at the time.
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RobNDenver
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Ok, I'm in full geezer mode here, but I have not been pulled over or contacted by law enforcement in twenty (20) years. At home I drive an F150, when traveling the rent a car du jour. I am a retired cop and have zero interactions that I didn't initiate.
To the OP, don't drive a defective vehicle.
To the OP, don't drive a defective vehicle.
DHJenkins
Member
+1 JVaughn
IME cops are like horses - if you're nervous it makes them nervous; and nothing says "I'm nervous" like being chatty and overly friendly.
It doesn't hurt, but it doesn't really help, either.
Then again, I'm not one for volunteering info to anyone...
IME cops are like horses - if you're nervous it makes them nervous; and nothing says "I'm nervous" like being chatty and overly friendly.
It doesn't hurt, but it doesn't really help, either.
Then again, I'm not one for volunteering info to anyone...
thewillweeks
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Ideally, yes, don't drive a vehicle with a light out. It was on when I left home, parked at the church for evening service, and I didn't think to check when I came back out and drove to walmart.
I figured it'd be more noticeable if I tried to alter my normal behavior (chatty). As stated, I check out with the same cashier just so I can talk to them haha. I was afraid I'd make myself nervous by not talking normally.
I figured it'd be more noticeable if I tried to alter my normal behavior (chatty). As stated, I check out with the same cashier just so I can talk to them haha. I was afraid I'd make myself nervous by not talking normally.
besafe2
Member
This. However I'm not a retired leo just former & drive a Nissan Versa or Altima & it's been 30 + for me.
Ha ha. That is the way I feel, middle aged white guy, driving a white SUV, short hair. I don't think I could get a ticket if I tried. I have been pulled over once in 20 years and I was speeding. My son even blurted out "I told you not to speed" in front of the officer and on top of that I did not have my driver license with me. Officer just said I should slow down and keep my license with me at all time. I almost felt bad I didn't get a ticket .
I read somewhere that most felon and warrants are caught by traffic stops. I sometimes think LE uses stops to catch the bad people and don't really car if I am speeding (assuming it is not around schools).
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