Need some help identifying this revolver.

[Jonny2guns]

My son was asked to clean up this revolver, and he was asking for any info about manufacturer and where to look for parts.

 

[.38 Special]

I believe that is a "British Bull Dog". The "ELG" is a Liege proof mark, likely demonstrating Belgian manufacture. I believe several companies made these revolvers at one time or another, but am not really up to speed on the topic.

<Edit> Numrich is my usually "first look" for parts, and I was actually surprised to find a few there. https://www.gunpartscorp.com/gun-manufacturer/forehand-wadsworth/revolvers-fw/british-bulldog

 

[Mark_Mark]

That’s VERY COOL.

I hope you get it running and refinished!

 

[Jonny2guns]

That’s VERY COOL.

I hope you get it running and refinished!

Not sure who asked him to clean it up and how far he will take it, but I know I'd do it if it was mine.

 

[Mark_Mark]

Not sure who asked him to clean it up and how far he will take it, but I know I'd do it if it was mine.

any idea on the caliber?

 

[Jonny2guns]

He said it seams to be a .38 but shorter than a 38spl
Probably a 38S&W.

 

[Mark_Mark]

He said it seams to be a .38 but shorter than a 38spl
Probably a 38S&W.

if it times good, cone is good, bore is not crusty… I would shoot it

 

[.38 Special]

He said it seams to be a .38 but shorter than a 38spl
Probably a 38S&W.

I was going to suggest .380 British, but then realized I don't actually know what that means. Turns out there is the usual British ammunition mess...

Making .380 revolver ammo for an ancient Bulldog pistol | old guns and shooting

Fabricating thin rimmed .380 revolver ammunition for a Bulldog type revolver

plimking.com

 

[EMC45]

if it times good, cone is good, bore is not crusty… I would shoot it

Me too. A good bit too

 

[trackskippy]

I have something similar. Its a 32 and best I can tell, a 32 S&W. No markings on the gun, that I remember anyway, and its in rough shape. The bore and chambers are rough and look like they must have fired either blackpowder or corrosive and never cleaned the gun. Even if I could get it up and working, I don't think Id shoot it.

Now if it looked like this, I wouldn't have a problem and didn't.

Found that in my dads drawer after he died. Never saw it before and no idea where it got it from. Guessed someone gave it to him to get rid of it. All I knew was it was an S&W, but no caliber markings. Took a little bit of fiddling around and figured out it was a black powder era 32 S&W. And that's what I loaded, both round ball and conical. Neither of which would prnrtrate my burn barrel at 10'.



If yours mikes out at 38, measure the cylinder length and compare it to the different 38 loads most likely the suspect. My guess would be something like 38 S&W. Take the OAL of the round minus the rim thickness and you'll get close. That, or measure from the recoil shield to the face of the cylinder. Once you figure it out, I wouldn't load heavy bullets or loads.

If you arent sure of its era, black vs smokeless powder, Id probably load black powder if you insist on shooting it. If you're right handed, shoot it with your left first.

 

[Mark_Mark]

I have something similar. Its a 32 and best I can tell, a 32 S&W. No markings on the gun, that I remember anyway, and its in rough shape. The bore and chambers are rough and look like they must have fired either blackpowder or corrosive and never cleaned the gun. Even if I could get it up and working, I don't think Id shoot it.

Now if it looked like this, I wouldn't have a problem and didn't.

Found that in my dads drawer after he died. Never saw it before and no idea where it got it from. Guessed someone gave it to him to get rid of it. All I knew was it was an S&W, but no caliber markings. Took a little bit of fiddling around and figured out it was a black powder era 32 S&W. And that's what I loaded, both round ball and conical. Neither of which would prnrtrate my burn barrel at 10'.



If yours mikes out at 38, measure the cylinder length and compare it to the different 38 loads most likely the suspect. My guess would be something like 38 S&W. Take the OAL of the round minus the rim thickness and you'll get close. That, or measure from the recoil shield to the face of the cylinder. Once you figure it out, I wouldn't load heavy bullets or loads.

If you arent sure of its era, black vs smokeless powder, Id probably load black powder if you insist on shooting it. If you're right handed, shoot it with your left first.

have not fired my yet, but I’m going to load my with Pydex

 

[trackskippy]

I think the S&W's are strong and a different critter here from a lot of the others. Trying to figure things out, I did come across a number of articles and forum discussions where the general thought was, if its of the BP era, its better to shoot BP out of them. Then again, there was the other side that swore light smokeless loads were fine too. And then, those who said they shot 32 acp out of the 32's no problem.

For what they are, and as old as they are, I just don't see the point in stressing them or taking the risk of screwing the gun up, or worse, blowing a pinkie off.

 

[Mark_Mark]

I think the S&W's are strong and a different critter here from a lot of the others. Trying to figure things out, I did come across a number of articles and forum discussions where the general thought was, if its of the BP era, its better to shoot BP out of them. Then again, there was the other side that swore light smokeless loads were fine too. And then, those who said they shot 32 acp out of the 32's no problem.

For what they are, and as old as they are, I just don't see the point in stressing them or taking the risk of screwing the gun up, or worse, blowing a pinkie off.

I wish I can find some BP here for cheap, but Substitute is as good! less messy too

 

[RevolvingGarbage]

The European .32 caliber of the day was known as .320 Center Fire. It used a heeled bullet and therefore has a smaller diameter case than .32S&W which won't quite fit into the .320 chambers. I have some .320 brass around and only one gun that takes it so anyone that would like a small amount of fiocchi once fired brass cases PM me. Good luck finding the dies though.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

Its a kinda-sorta Belgian copy of the Webley RIC (Royal Irish Constabulary). Cartridge could be anything, maybe even .30-something rimfire.
I can't figure out how to link it, but Mike Tinker Peirce has a video of this exact model on Ytube.

 

[Jonny2guns]

The overall length of the cylinder is to short for the 38S&W.

 

[Jim Watson]

Like .320, .380 Revolver is close to .38 Short Colt.

 

[Jonny2guns]

Like .320, .380 Revolver is close to .38 Short Colt.

I'll look up their overall dimensions, thanks.

 

[trackskippy]

Its looking like both the 38 S&W and 38 Short Colt might work, with the lighter bullets. At least I think their OAL's will work with what your measurements show.

Shooter's Reference Load Data for .38 Short Colt

shootersreference.com

38 Short Colt

Shooter's Reference Load Data for .38 Smith & Wesson, Colt New Police

shootersreference.com

Either way, these oughta work.

Ten-X Ammo 38 Short Colt Blank Box of 50

Cartridges for cowboy action shooting sports. These are blank cartridges. Safe and effective for use in first generation guns. Made from the highest...

www.midwayusa.com

 

[Jonny2guns]

Its looking like both the 38 S&W and 38 Short Colt might work, with the lighter bullets. At least I think their OAL's will work with what your measurements show.

Shooter's Reference Load Data for .38 Short Colt

shootersreference.com

38 Short Colt

Shooter's Reference Load Data for .38 Smith & Wesson, Colt New Police

shootersreference.com

Either way, these oughta work.

Ten-X Ammo 38 Short Colt Blank Box of 50

Cartridges for cowboy action shooting sports. These are blank cartridges. Safe and effective for use in first generation guns. Made from the highest...

www.midwayusa.com

The cylinder length is 1.080" so 38 shorts are too long.

 

[trackskippy]

If you look at the load data for both rounds, the lighter bullets show an OAL that I think will (just) fit. The heavier bullets do appear to be too long. Wadcutters, or even round balls would, and might be, the best choice.

I suppose too, it could be chambered for some odd ball Euro round, but Im thinking its going to be one of the 38 "shorts".

One other thing you should check too maybe, what do the chambers measure on the front side of the cylinder and what does the bore measure? Best to make sure it is 38 too.

 

[Jim Watson]

There is still a CIP listing for .380 Short. Shows maximum OAL as 28mm = 1.10". Rim thickness is 1.25mm = .05", a typical thin British rim. So unless you have rim recesses, your cylinder will JUST accept that round.

Belgian proof marks, the stamps on the edge of the front strap may be a manufacturer's code. A collector once explained, and it is obvious from looking at guns, Europeans were not as brand name conscious as we are. If sold here, it would likely be marked "British Bulldog" or something similar.