New Century Arms Semi-Auto Sterling 9mm SMG
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briansmithwins
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You sure about that?
STEN mags are single position feed while the Sterling uses 2 position. I'd think the stripping lug on the bolt would be different enough to prevent interchangeability of magazines. BSW
BlackHand1917
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I remember seeing semi-auto Sterlings being sold in the eighties and then they disappeared. I seem to remember that they were rather expensive. I don't know if Century Arms was the importer back then.
AmEngRifles
Member
These are now available! Bought one just last week. Haven’t had time to fire it. Looks pretty close to an original Mk 6 semi-auto by Sterling BUT not perfect. Bought from Phoenix Distributors on GunBroker. Paid well under what an original Sterling would go for. Since the magazines ARE available and have an excellent reputation for reliability, and the gun is a blowback design, figured “How WRONG could they get it”? Will find out soon.
The difficult thing right now is that the Century Arms sales rep I spoke to shouldn’t even be allowed to speak to the outside world. THE worst phone personality I have experienced with a sales rep. Knew almost nothing about them. They are made by Wise Lite and I need to contact them next. Century International Arms is the main distributor. No idea how many are to be produced.
I am wondering as well how the kits were procured. Yes, there appears to be plenty of the full auto Sterling Mk 4 parts kits out there, but this has all the features of the Sterling designed semi-auto Mk 6. The heavy, then slim, long barrel, the special trunnion for said barrel, the firing pin spring, the knurled barrel retainer nut, modified receiver front end, and the double recoil spring set up. I can not imagine there was a huge (OR ANY) surplus market on Mk 6 kits? So Wise Lite would have to manufacture the modified bolt/firing pin, the receiver body and the barrel and nut set up. I guess this would not be too difficult for a firearms manufacturer. The barrel forward exposed section did seem slightly thinner over the original Sterling Mk6 I once owned.
But for a third of the price on what one would expect to pay for an original, I am very happy with the general appearance of the remade classic. Now to see how it performs. I will post an update when I can get to the range.
Some final observations about MY Sterling as made by Wise Lite.
The holes that are drilled around the circumference of the forward receiver appear to be slightly larger than the originals, but not by much. Probably no one will notice. There is NO bayonet stud on the receiver (really useless on a Mk6) and one of the arms on the folding stock was bent, but did not effect the folding and functioning of the stock. The end piece on the receiver tube, which contains the somewhat complicated locking camway for the tube cap and butt stock folding mechanism, is cut just forward of the rear sight and welded to the newly manufactured receiver tube. The weld is reasonably good, but is somewhat apparent. Should not effect function, as long as they got the overall finished receiver tube length correct.
The difficult thing right now is that the Century Arms sales rep I spoke to shouldn’t even be allowed to speak to the outside world. THE worst phone personality I have experienced with a sales rep. Knew almost nothing about them. They are made by Wise Lite and I need to contact them next. Century International Arms is the main distributor. No idea how many are to be produced.
I am wondering as well how the kits were procured. Yes, there appears to be plenty of the full auto Sterling Mk 4 parts kits out there, but this has all the features of the Sterling designed semi-auto Mk 6. The heavy, then slim, long barrel, the special trunnion for said barrel, the firing pin spring, the knurled barrel retainer nut, modified receiver front end, and the double recoil spring set up. I can not imagine there was a huge (OR ANY) surplus market on Mk 6 kits? So Wise Lite would have to manufacture the modified bolt/firing pin, the receiver body and the barrel and nut set up. I guess this would not be too difficult for a firearms manufacturer. The barrel forward exposed section did seem slightly thinner over the original Sterling Mk6 I once owned.
But for a third of the price on what one would expect to pay for an original, I am very happy with the general appearance of the remade classic. Now to see how it performs. I will post an update when I can get to the range.
Some final observations about MY Sterling as made by Wise Lite.
The holes that are drilled around the circumference of the forward receiver appear to be slightly larger than the originals, but not by much. Probably no one will notice. There is NO bayonet stud on the receiver (really useless on a Mk6) and one of the arms on the folding stock was bent, but did not effect the folding and functioning of the stock. The end piece on the receiver tube, which contains the somewhat complicated locking camway for the tube cap and butt stock folding mechanism, is cut just forward of the rear sight and welded to the newly manufactured receiver tube. The weld is reasonably good, but is somewhat apparent. Should not effect function, as long as they got the overall finished receiver tube length correct.
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AmEngRifles
Member
In reply to briamsmithwins inquiry about Sten mag compatibility with the Sterling; an emphatic, YES, Sten mags work in a Sterling. This was designed into the gun from the beginning. You have to imagine with millions of Sten mags, the British Government would at least want to have them as a backup. That is how I look at them, a cheap secondary supply.
The bolt is designed to be able to pick up rounds from the double feed Sterling mag and the single feed of the Sten. Don't ask me about the engineering needed there, but they designed it specifically to function that way.
The pros and cons of each mag.
Sterlings: Pros, ubbersmooth. Easy to load, well built and easy to clean. Great double roller follower that gives great performance. Cons: a little expensive, especially compared to a Sten mag. BUT, reasonable compared to many other mags out there, especially considering you are getting a real work of art in the magazine world. I have noticed Sterling mags run from the reasonable $35 to $40 price all the way up to the ridiculous $90 range.
Stens: Pros, cheap!! plentiful, hold 32 rounds, but probably should only load 30 at a time. Some have chromed followers. Cons. A b#*!ch to load. You HAVE to have a mag loader to do it, otherwise, you can load about 15 rounds before you want to just use it as a club. This now means you have to keep that mag loader handy and close by ever time you need to reload. Used to about $5 a pop, but prices are starting to climb. About $10.00 a mag seems to be obtainable for the time being.
Hope this helps.
The bolt is designed to be able to pick up rounds from the double feed Sterling mag and the single feed of the Sten. Don't ask me about the engineering needed there, but they designed it specifically to function that way.
The pros and cons of each mag.
Sterlings: Pros, ubbersmooth. Easy to load, well built and easy to clean. Great double roller follower that gives great performance. Cons: a little expensive, especially compared to a Sten mag. BUT, reasonable compared to many other mags out there, especially considering you are getting a real work of art in the magazine world. I have noticed Sterling mags run from the reasonable $35 to $40 price all the way up to the ridiculous $90 range.
Stens: Pros, cheap!! plentiful, hold 32 rounds, but probably should only load 30 at a time. Some have chromed followers. Cons. A b#*!ch to load. You HAVE to have a mag loader to do it, otherwise, you can load about 15 rounds before you want to just use it as a club. This now means you have to keep that mag loader handy and close by ever time you need to reload. Used to about $5 a pop, but prices are starting to climb. About $10.00 a mag seems to be obtainable for the time being.
Hope this helps.
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woodybrighton
member
probably the most reliable 9mm smg
the original were carved out of single blocks of steel
so should be fairly well built its not like there's much to go wrong
the original were carved out of single blocks of steel
so should be fairly well built its not like there's much to go wrong
Gunnerpalace
Member
So..................Where do I get one?
briansmithwins
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This is CAI we are talking about. I'd really like the Sterling to be good, but...
BSW
BSW
armoredman
Member
That is the most perfect Century picture ever!
Honestly, I would buy one if
A), the drunken monkeys had nothing to do with putting it together.
B) The price was reasonable for a 9mm semi auto carbine. (What IS the price?)
C) Someone comes out with an Imperial Stormtrooper dressup kit for it, like the MG42 kit for the Ruger 10/22 - I wanna Star Wars blaster....I saw that movie when it came out in '77...
Honestly, I would buy one if
A), the drunken monkeys had nothing to do with putting it together.
B) The price was reasonable for a 9mm semi auto carbine. (What IS the price?)
C) Someone comes out with an Imperial Stormtrooper dressup kit for it, like the MG42 kit for the Ruger 10/22 - I wanna Star Wars blaster....I saw that movie when it came out in '77...
Ric_Knight
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I just looked on Gun Broker.com and found one (http://v4.beta.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=127470599) for 570.00 at this point.
I am interested in one of these myself and would love to hear from someone who owns one and has shot it.
I am interested in one of these myself and would love to hear from someone who owns one and has shot it.
woodybrighton
member
I can't imagine they can mess up a blow back 9mm 
its not accurate or high powered
its not accurate or high powered
Gunnerpalace
Member
AmEngRifles
Member
Just the facts, Mame
A little more info about the Wise Lite manufactured Sterling 9mm. Century DOES NOT make these. They are the possibly the sole distributor. They are not overly free with information about this product. Wise Lite does not feature it on their website at this time, even though they are the manufacturer as inscribed on the weapons rear receiver.. No MSRP is published, that I have found.
I have observed only two for sale in the very recent past. Both came from Phoenix Distributors in PA. Both have been listed on GunBroker. When I called about my purchased rifle (through GunBroker auction) I was told they only had the ONE. That proved to be false, as another was listed immediately following mine. That one went for $735.00. I paid $850.00 for mine as I had no reference point other than what I have observed real Sterlings going for in recent months (over $2,400.00). The gun is reasonably attractive in it’s execution. It is NOT a Sterling, but then again, no where near the going prices of a Sterling.
My first range outing did not prove 100% satisfactory. I will say that 115 grain fmj ammo worked witout a hitch. But I started out with shooting 124 gr. NATO spec 9mm, which is what the original was designed around. These would jam about ever 2nd or 3rd round. What appeared to be happening was that the bullet was jamming up against the entry edge of the chamber. On many bullets, it would drive the bullet deeper into the case. A few bullets displayed deep gouges on the forward portion of the bullet, leading me to suspect the chamber needs a bit of an “entry roll”. So, as it stands, this rifle definitley doesn’t like the 124 grain fmj bullet. I am hoping Wise Lite can resolve this. If they can’t, or won’t, then some judicious Dremel work may help out. Although I am also experiencing difficulty removing the barrel by my old Mk6 proceedures. No manual was included with this rifle. Hope they do not tack weld the barrel into position. That would make the barrel nut superfolous.
By the way, bullet impact was about 12” low at 50 yards for both bullet weights. Hoping I can figure out if the front sight adjusts for elevation. It appears it will, but will need a few tools. If it won’t, there is always the file!
This gun will make an awsome SBR, but want to work out all bugs before I apply to convert. Saty tuned.
A little more info about the Wise Lite manufactured Sterling 9mm. Century DOES NOT make these. They are the possibly the sole distributor. They are not overly free with information about this product. Wise Lite does not feature it on their website at this time, even though they are the manufacturer as inscribed on the weapons rear receiver.. No MSRP is published, that I have found.
I have observed only two for sale in the very recent past. Both came from Phoenix Distributors in PA. Both have been listed on GunBroker. When I called about my purchased rifle (through GunBroker auction) I was told they only had the ONE. That proved to be false, as another was listed immediately following mine. That one went for $735.00. I paid $850.00 for mine as I had no reference point other than what I have observed real Sterlings going for in recent months (over $2,400.00). The gun is reasonably attractive in it’s execution. It is NOT a Sterling, but then again, no where near the going prices of a Sterling.
My first range outing did not prove 100% satisfactory. I will say that 115 grain fmj ammo worked witout a hitch. But I started out with shooting 124 gr. NATO spec 9mm, which is what the original was designed around. These would jam about ever 2nd or 3rd round. What appeared to be happening was that the bullet was jamming up against the entry edge of the chamber. On many bullets, it would drive the bullet deeper into the case. A few bullets displayed deep gouges on the forward portion of the bullet, leading me to suspect the chamber needs a bit of an “entry roll”. So, as it stands, this rifle definitley doesn’t like the 124 grain fmj bullet. I am hoping Wise Lite can resolve this. If they can’t, or won’t, then some judicious Dremel work may help out. Although I am also experiencing difficulty removing the barrel by my old Mk6 proceedures. No manual was included with this rifle. Hope they do not tack weld the barrel into position. That would make the barrel nut superfolous.
By the way, bullet impact was about 12” low at 50 yards for both bullet weights. Hoping I can figure out if the front sight adjusts for elevation. It appears it will, but will need a few tools. If it won’t, there is always the file!
This gun will make an awsome SBR, but want to work out all bugs before I apply to convert. Saty tuned.R.W.Dale
Member
You need a bottle of cheap booze in the pic
Remember these are supposed to be DRUNKEN monkeys
Yes, I'm sure because I own a factory original Sterling Mk6 semi-auto. Hate to tell you what I paid for it. Sterling designed the gun so that the millions of existing Sten mags could be used in it, but owners of the older Stens couldn't just buy the more advanced Sterling mags and use them in the older guns. It's a one-way compatibility. Luckily I have about a dozen original Sterling mags.
Another interesting Sterling mag fact: the original spec was for a 40 round mag. By cutting it down to 34 rounds, they were able to use the existing Sten mag pouches that had already been issued. With the roller follower and the round center spring, these mags are the easiest to load I've ever seen. The 34th round loads by thumb as easily as the first.
There are some Canadian made mags around that don't have the roller follower, as they were trying to avoid patent royalty payments.
Woody, mine is accurate as hell. Better than some of my wondernine pistols. Single hole groups.
If you want to learn more about Sterlings, get a copy of the book, "The Guns of Dagenham".
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AmEngRifles
Member
Heads up Sterling fans. Once again, Phoenix Distributors has a CAI Sterling up on GunBroker. So, that means I jumped too quickly as this one starts at $500 and with only 4 days left, no one has bid. No reserve either, so you could end up with a reasonable copy of a very nice sub-gun for just 500! Hell, you can't get an AT-9 Feather or a Marlin camp carbine for that! Well, MAYBE a camp carbine if you shop it.
As has been detailed though, expect possibly some issues with the feeding of 124 grain NATO rounds. Mine feeds 115 grain just fine, but still trying to resolve with Wise Lite the issue of jams with the heavier bullet. I suspect I will need to soften the transition from the breech face to the chamber, but before I do it on my own, I am giving Wise Lite the chance to make mine right.
One other little detail I don't particularly like. I inquired about the non-removable barrel. I was instructed that they are removable but a TIGHT fit and that if I was to remove mine (which they didn't recommend), and not be able to re-install, that this would NOT be covered under the warranty. Ugh. Why is it so hard for people to get the little things right!?
As has been detailed though, expect possibly some issues with the feeding of 124 grain NATO rounds. Mine feeds 115 grain just fine, but still trying to resolve with Wise Lite the issue of jams with the heavier bullet. I suspect I will need to soften the transition from the breech face to the chamber, but before I do it on my own, I am giving Wise Lite the chance to make mine right.
One other little detail I don't particularly like. I inquired about the non-removable barrel. I was instructed that they are removable but a TIGHT fit and that if I was to remove mine (which they didn't recommend), and not be able to re-install, that this would NOT be covered under the warranty. Ugh. Why is it so hard for people to get the little things right!?
I have watched the last 5 auctions, and they all jump up in price at the very end, your not going to get that for $500 nor are you going to get it for $600. Now that these are getting more press on boards like this, your probably wont get it for $700 either.
VirgilCaine
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briansmithwins
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How much would a Sterling + 10 mags cost?
I got my Uzi for $650. 10 X 32rnd mags were about $137, for a total cost of $787.
Seems that if Sterling mags are $40 each, you'd have to get the Sterling itself for $390 or so for it to be competitive costwise.
BSW
I got my Uzi for $650. 10 X 32rnd mags were about $137, for a total cost of $787.
Seems that if Sterling mags are $40 each, you'd have to get the Sterling itself for $390 or so for it to be competitive costwise.
BSW
AmEngRifles
Member
BSW, when did you get your Uzi? A few months back; a year? Prices have become so volatile since Obama's election that I can't see how one would get an Uzi for anything under a grand unless it was a Norinco, and I won't buy any gun made in China.
Anyway, at todays prices, the CAI Sterling is less expensive than a quality Uzi. Figure an Uzi today will run anywhere between $1,100 to $1,500 for a Vector on up from $1,600.00 plus range for an IMI.
Yes, mags are a little cheaper for the Uzi, but the Sterling mag has a stellar reputation with the roller follower and 34 round capacity. Uzi wins if you like to run the 40 rounders or even the 50 rounders sometimes seen. Did IMI ever make 40's and 50's or are these strictly "aftermarket"?
There is that undefinable quality in the process of just plain individual taste. I like the Uzi, but to me it seems overly heavy and a bit bulky for a 9mm. That being said, I know this is a benefit in a full auto. So my observations are based more on the fact most of us are probably comparing semi-auto rifles at the moment. But for me, the Sterling is a little seen weapon of limited distribution in this country. It does seem slighter and lighter to my taste. Some have said they don't like the balance of the Sterling. I do not have any issue with the side protruding magazine. I still support the forward section under the receiver and don't grab the mag from above like so many seem to do with the Sterling.
Anyway, at todays prices, the CAI Sterling is less expensive than a quality Uzi. Figure an Uzi today will run anywhere between $1,100 to $1,500 for a Vector on up from $1,600.00 plus range for an IMI.
Yes, mags are a little cheaper for the Uzi, but the Sterling mag has a stellar reputation with the roller follower and 34 round capacity. Uzi wins if you like to run the 40 rounders or even the 50 rounders sometimes seen. Did IMI ever make 40's and 50's or are these strictly "aftermarket"?
There is that undefinable quality in the process of just plain individual taste. I like the Uzi, but to me it seems overly heavy and a bit bulky for a 9mm. That being said, I know this is a benefit in a full auto. So my observations are based more on the fact most of us are probably comparing semi-auto rifles at the moment. But for me, the Sterling is a little seen weapon of limited distribution in this country. It does seem slighter and lighter to my taste. Some have said they don't like the balance of the Sterling. I do not have any issue with the side protruding magazine. I still support the forward section under the receiver and don't grab the mag from above like so many seem to do with the Sterling.
AmEngRifles
Member
Current CAI Sterling auction is now at $700. Thanks Gelgoog, I am less disappointed at spending the money I did if they continue to hover above the 700 to 750 mark. Wished I had known there was a supply of them and watched a few go through the auction process.
Do you recall if all 5 were from Phoenix Distributors?
Do you recall if all 5 were from Phoenix Distributors?
Apple a Day
Member
Oops.
Disregard/
Disregard/
briansmithwins
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Yes, I got my Uzi a year ago. This one sold for $995 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=126009953 so prices have gone up.
I agree that the Uzi is a heavy firearm. It's heavy because it's very, very overbuilt. The receiver on the Uzi is substantially thicker than the receiver on my RPK Klone. Uzi's are also very compact. The telescoped bolt makes for a very efficient use of space.
I wouldn't know about 40 or 50 round mags for the Uzi. I only have IMI mags, which have all been totally trouble free.
I'm not seeing a lot of Sterling mags. The ones I did see were $40 ea. So if I redo my math:
$1000 Uzi + 10 mags = $1137
$700 Sterling +10 mags = $1100
Which does tend to make the Sterling look a bit better from a cash standpoint. BSW
I agree that the Uzi is a heavy firearm. It's heavy because it's very, very overbuilt. The receiver on the Uzi is substantially thicker than the receiver on my RPK Klone. Uzi's are also very compact. The telescoped bolt makes for a very efficient use of space.
I wouldn't know about 40 or 50 round mags for the Uzi. I only have IMI mags, which have all been totally trouble free.
I'm not seeing a lot of Sterling mags. The ones I did see were $40 ea. So if I redo my math:
$1000 Uzi + 10 mags = $1137
$700 Sterling +10 mags = $1100
Which does tend to make the Sterling look a bit better from a cash standpoint. BSW
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