armoredman
Member
The salesman at J&G said "no problem" to a semi-auto firearm going full auto unintentionally? Double plus ungood! Glad you traded it back before ATFE found you with it, and put you next to the kid with the malfunctioning AR-15!!
New Century Arms Semi-Auto Sterling 9mm SMG
- Thread starter Kind of Blued
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sterling7c
Member
- Joined
- May 1, 2009
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- 71
HAVOCCENTRAL said:
If they've done the semi conversion properly (as per the original Sterling semi) this sould be impossible. I've used an original semi from Sterling Armaments UK for many years and not once have I had a double. As for ammo it should feed just about anything including Wolf (if you absolutely must use it
Seems that the Sterling just doesn't appeal too much in the US (as in better get an UZI) and I've seen several posts say they're inaccurate, not too reliable and don't balance well. I must've been shooting different Sterlings for donkey's years because I've NEVER had a problem. Had problems with UZI's in sandy environments which sounds crazy seeing as where they came from but the Sterling worked in course sand, talcum sand, snow, ice, mud and everything else it was subject to. For the record this isn't my opinion - it's been my experience and the experience of just about everyone else who used them.
Got to say though that the full size UZI does balance better if using only one hand. Now ... anyone got a 'GUZI L34A1' by any chance I'd sure be in the market for something like that even if my bank balance wasn't !!
If they've done the semi conversion properly (as per the original Sterling semi) this sould be impossible. I've used an original semi from Sterling Armaments UK for many years and not once have I had a double. As for ammo it should feed just about anything including Wolf (if you absolutely must use it
Seems that the Sterling just doesn't appeal too much in the US (as in better get an UZI) and I've seen several posts say they're inaccurate, not too reliable and don't balance well. I must've been shooting different Sterlings for donkey's years because I've NEVER had a problem. Had problems with UZI's in sandy environments which sounds crazy seeing as where they came from but the Sterling worked in course sand, talcum sand, snow, ice, mud and everything else it was subject to. For the record this isn't my opinion - it's been my experience and the experience of just about everyone else who used them.
Got to say though that the full size UZI does balance better if using only one hand. Now ... anyone got a 'GUZI L34A1' by any chance
I'd sure be in the market for something like that even if my bank balance wasn't !!AmEngRifles
Member
Still seek others experience with their Century Sterlings
Just to reiterate, this thread started about the Century built Sterling. I understand the observations about the original Sterling from the UK. I agree from past experience, that whether full auto or semi-auto, they function flawlessly under most conditions. But even a first rate firearm can malfunction if not serviced properly.
In Century's case, even small dimensional changes can change things. There seems to be a question about Century's barrel dimensions as they appear to display 2 issues. One of disassembly (barrel too tight in trunion) AND feeding issues CAN occur, but not always. From my early observations and range time, I am pretty sure that Century is having barrels made that DO NOT have the exact same breech face to chamber radius, thus giving some feed issues, IF a magazine has questionable feed lip geometry and is not just so and in spec. When the bullet does not release from the magazine at the intended moment and angle, that is when issues can occur, especially if there is a sharp edge to impale your bullet onto.
My original barrel appeared to have a larger/smoother radius transitioning from the breech face into the chamber, but without being able to remove the barrel (Wiselite informs me that replacement of barrel back into a tight trunnion IS NOT covered by warranty), it is hard to get an exact account of that radius. Plus, these barrels that Century is having made somewhere, do not have chrome chambers, like the original Mk 6. I am absolutely certain that a softer transition and a chrome chamber would go along way to forgiving a magazine that might be slightly out of spec due to damage.
Century has also been very slow to respond to my request for a manual. Mine came without one because I suspect someone at Phoenix Distributors removed it to browse and never returned to box. I sent my serial number in (as instructed) including where it was purchased, but no manual yet to date. Been 2 weeks. Seems a company would gladly send a manual on a current production firearm, even without having a serial number.
Just be aware that these guns ARE NOT Sterling Manufactured rifles. Therefore, they will not display all the good manors of the original. Not yet at least.
Would still like to hear anyone else's experience with their Century Sterling. Looking to ring out all issues so that others may not suffer a similar fate.
Just to reiterate, this thread started about the Century built Sterling. I understand the observations about the original Sterling from the UK. I agree from past experience, that whether full auto or semi-auto, they function flawlessly under most conditions. But even a first rate firearm can malfunction if not serviced properly.
In Century's case, even small dimensional changes can change things. There seems to be a question about Century's barrel dimensions as they appear to display 2 issues. One of disassembly (barrel too tight in trunion) AND feeding issues CAN occur, but not always. From my early observations and range time, I am pretty sure that Century is having barrels made that DO NOT have the exact same breech face to chamber radius, thus giving some feed issues, IF a magazine has questionable feed lip geometry and is not just so and in spec. When the bullet does not release from the magazine at the intended moment and angle, that is when issues can occur, especially if there is a sharp edge to impale your bullet onto.
My original barrel appeared to have a larger/smoother radius transitioning from the breech face into the chamber, but without being able to remove the barrel (Wiselite informs me that replacement of barrel back into a tight trunnion IS NOT covered by warranty), it is hard to get an exact account of that radius. Plus, these barrels that Century is having made somewhere, do not have chrome chambers, like the original Mk 6. I am absolutely certain that a softer transition and a chrome chamber would go along way to forgiving a magazine that might be slightly out of spec due to damage.
Century has also been very slow to respond to my request for a manual. Mine came without one because I suspect someone at Phoenix Distributors removed it to browse and never returned to box. I sent my serial number in (as instructed) including where it was purchased, but no manual yet to date. Been 2 weeks. Seems a company would gladly send a manual on a current production firearm, even without having a serial number.
Just be aware that these guns ARE NOT Sterling Manufactured rifles. Therefore, they will not display all the good manors of the original. Not yet at least.
Would still like to hear anyone else's experience with their Century Sterling. Looking to ring out all issues so that others may not suffer a similar fate.
AmEngRifles
Member
Your welcome Dawg.
While I jumped before looking on this rifle, it is because I have a real love of the little machine. Paid too much for the first one, but have now paid the right price for a second through J&G. I don't expect anything to be significantly different than the first rifle, but plan on moving forward with getting one SBR'ed. The great thing is they are reasonably priced, in my mind. That is because when I did own an original Sterling, I sold it for about 2.5k. WAY too much for that little piece of metal, but that is how the market was working at the time. Of course, like almost all my guns sold, I missed it after it was gone. I like the fact that we can now get them for well under 1k.
While I jumped before looking on this rifle, it is because I have a real love of the little machine. Paid too much for the first one, but have now paid the right price for a second through J&G. I don't expect anything to be significantly different than the first rifle, but plan on moving forward with getting one SBR'ed. The great thing is they are reasonably priced, in my mind. That is because when I did own an original Sterling, I sold it for about 2.5k. WAY too much for that little piece of metal, but that is how the market was working at the time. Of course, like almost all my guns sold, I missed it after it was gone. I like the fact that we can now get them for well under 1k.
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I have a buddy who has two Sterling MK VI guns, and deicded to sell one and buy one of these so he could still have two sterling carbines and could pocket about $1300 in the process!
He actually has a very rare Sterling fixed stock and wants to mount it, but wouldn't dare do that to an original Sterling, so he felt this was the best way to go about it (and end up with some play money to boot).
He actually has a very rare Sterling fixed stock and wants to mount it, but wouldn't dare do that to an original Sterling, so he felt this was the best way to go about it (and end up with some play money to boot).
AmEngRifles
Member
Yeah. Congrats on the purchase. It is a sweet little rifle. Received my 2nd and looks every bit as good as the first, maybe slightly better.
Looking forward to your report. I am trying to get to the range today. Going to carefully check each mag for function issues.
Looking forward to your report. I am trying to get to the range today. Going to carefully check each mag for function issues.
AmEngRifles
Member
Range Trip Good, Paper Targets Bad
OK, I am starting to see things differently. I LOVE this little carbine. Just got back from 3rd outing and it ran 100%. Used two like new Sterling mags, no issues. Used two Sten mags, no issues.
Feed 115 fmj and hollow point. Feed 124 grain fmj and hollow point. Feed 125 grain lean round nose. Feed 147 grain hollow points. Seems it was all due to a few bad mags. Ate everything I fed it. Got the sights adjusted as well so I am spot on now at 100 yards. Great fun double tapping like running through a pistol course. Have more than a few chewed up targets now.
I am a believer. Hope you will become a believer too.
OK, I am starting to see things differently. I LOVE this little carbine. Just got back from 3rd outing and it ran 100%. Used two like new Sterling mags, no issues. Used two Sten mags, no issues.
Feed 115 fmj and hollow point. Feed 124 grain fmj and hollow point. Feed 125 grain lean round nose. Feed 147 grain hollow points. Seems it was all due to a few bad mags. Ate everything I fed it. Got the sights adjusted as well so I am spot on now at 100 yards. Great fun double tapping like running through a pistol course. Have more than a few chewed up targets now.
I am a believer. Hope you will become a believer too.
jhco
Member
Cool, but I don't think I would buy one.
AmEngRifles
Member
MP44, Haven't really been too concerned about ringing out the accuracy issue yet. At this point, I am getting around 3" at 50 yards, and guessing about 7" or 8" at 100 yards. I am sure I could probably bring this down. I know the 2nd range report was on a very blustery day. I don't see this as being a much over 100 yard gun for sure. I was somewhat more focused on the reliability issue.
I can now move forward with finding a good match for the gun ammo wise. I am happy it feeds hollow points and lead. Save money by making lead practice rounds, and good to know if I want to run defensive ammo through her, the gun can handle it without choking up. Don't recall if I mentioned it, but she will handle CCI Blazer aluminum cased stuff as well. I am definitely getting more of that. Has a good strong recoil impulse, so I know I am getting some performance out of that load over my reloads. Was noticeably hotter. I have to say I have not thought of Blazer ammo as particularly accurate, but that may have been the 9mm pistol I used to use the stuff out of.
Airpower, I do not find the long barrel to do anything to the balance, but I am comparing that to things like handling an M-1 carbine, not a true Sub-gun sized Sterling. All I know up to this point is rifles that have minimum 16" barrels. Seems to me the only item which would throw off "balance" is a side protruding full 34 round magazine. And even that does not bother me. With the small round receiver, a good grasp, assisted by the textured "crinkle" finish help one get a good purchase on the rifle, or certainly as good a grasp as one needs. I pretty much just lightly craddle the forend as I shoot. Not finding much need to choke the thing. If it was full auto, that might be a different matter!
I can now move forward with finding a good match for the gun ammo wise. I am happy it feeds hollow points and lead. Save money by making lead practice rounds, and good to know if I want to run defensive ammo through her, the gun can handle it without choking up. Don't recall if I mentioned it, but she will handle CCI Blazer aluminum cased stuff as well. I am definitely getting more of that. Has a good strong recoil impulse, so I know I am getting some performance out of that load over my reloads. Was noticeably hotter. I have to say I have not thought of Blazer ammo as particularly accurate, but that may have been the 9mm pistol I used to use the stuff out of.
Airpower, I do not find the long barrel to do anything to the balance, but I am comparing that to things like handling an M-1 carbine, not a true Sub-gun sized Sterling. All I know up to this point is rifles that have minimum 16" barrels. Seems to me the only item which would throw off "balance" is a side protruding full 34 round magazine.
And even that does not bother me. With the small round receiver, a good grasp, assisted by the textured "crinkle" finish help one get a good purchase on the rifle, or certainly as good a grasp as one needs. I pretty much just lightly craddle the forend as I shoot. Not finding much need to choke the thing. If it was full auto, that might be a different matter!AmEngRifles
Member
Noticed that by an earlier link and a search, the J&G website no longer has the Sterling listed?? Wonder what's up?
AmEngRifles
Member
I have noticed that there are now many more Sterlings for sale on GB and Phoenix Distributors starts their's at $500.00 with NO RESERVE. Glad they are down to a realistic number. Hoping this means many more people jump into the Sterling craze and we may see some new aftermarket products become available.
Would love to see a fake silencer that contains a new barrel nut so that if someone doesn't want to go the SBR route, they can still make the rifle look asthetically pleasing by having the profile of a silencer and not that pencil thin barrel protruding forward of the receiver.
Would love to see a fake silencer that contains a new barrel nut so that if someone doesn't want to go the SBR route, they can still make the rifle look asthetically pleasing by having the profile of a silencer and not that pencil thin barrel protruding forward of the receiver.
AmEngRifles
Member
Continued reply
I am in the middle of NOT cleaning my rifle and have a little over 600 rounds with no cleaning and no issues due to this. No stoppages due to cleaning issues. I still stick in a used mag once in a while and get a stoppage, but have now figured that those mags probably need to have their feed lips bent inward a little to delay release of the round. The ones that stop are releasing out of the mag too early and catching against the very sharp angle of the extractor relief cut on the breech face and chamber edge. If their release was delayed by just a little bit, I should have no problems. Using a new mag completely eliminates this.
Accuracy is getting a bit worse, but that is to be expected. I never experienced fantastic accuracy from this rifle. But without cleaning, I am sure the barrel is clogging up a bit.
I will definitely be applying to SBR this gun. If WiseLite was smart, they would offer a front cap that one could tap the existing holes in the barrel trunnion plate and attach a replica or real Mk4 cap with slightly oversized cap bolts. I just don't want to buy a $500.00 or even $250.00 parts kit to get that front cap to modify. Would really make the look, but I can probably get a shop to turn a close facimile for less than $100 if I have to.
I am in the middle of NOT cleaning my rifle and have a little over 600 rounds with no cleaning and no issues due to this. No stoppages due to cleaning issues. I still stick in a used mag once in a while and get a stoppage, but have now figured that those mags probably need to have their feed lips bent inward a little to delay release of the round. The ones that stop are releasing out of the mag too early and catching against the very sharp angle of the extractor relief cut on the breech face and chamber edge. If their release was delayed by just a little bit, I should have no problems. Using a new mag completely eliminates this.
Accuracy is getting a bit worse, but that is to be expected. I never experienced fantastic accuracy from this rifle. But without cleaning, I am sure the barrel is clogging up a bit.
I will definitely be applying to SBR this gun. If WiseLite was smart, they would offer a front cap that one could tap the existing holes in the barrel trunnion plate and attach a replica or real Mk4 cap with slightly oversized cap bolts. I just don't want to buy a $500.00 or even $250.00 parts kit to get that front cap to modify. Would really make the look, but I can probably get a shop to turn a close facimile for less than $100 if I have to.
AmEngRifles
Member
Thanks for the heads up. The ones on GB still seem high, if they are the more complete kits with lots of front, perforated receiver tube.
Applegator
Member
New Sterling Pics
Here are a few pics of my Sterling with Rails. I picked up my Sterling a few weeks ago and just got a chance to shoot it this last weekend. This is one fun gun to shoot. The dual springs reduce the recoil to almost nothing. Its not like a 9mm rifle kicks that much anyway. It has a similar sensation as shooting an AR. Once I got the dot scope zeroed in, I could knock soda cans all over the range.
Added Items:
1) 6" Top Rail (AR Foregrip style)
This was interesting to mount. Removed the barrel and dropped the mounting bolts in the barrel sleeve. Used a screw driver with duct tape reversed to hold the bolts in place. Turned the bolts upside down so the flat part was facing the screw, otherwise, I could not get a tight fit. Used the front hole and center hole to mount the rail. This allows for part of the rail to be over the top of the receiver.
2) 2.25" Side Rail
The side rail is a 2-1/4" Brownells rail mount with a single 2-hole flat plate with threads. Used a dremel tool to remove material around the mounting plate thread posts so it could be pushed between two holes in the receiver. Replaced the long screws provided with the rail mount with short bolts from Lowes. I forgot the size, so take the rail mount and check the size at the hardware store. Mounted at an angle near the front sight.
3) Sig Red Dot Scope
Picked up a Sig Red Dot Sight and mounted it on the top rail. This is a nice compact red dot that seems to be well made.
4) Surefire LED Light.
Slid the light on the front rail. It was a tight fit between the two rails, but it slides on fine.
5) AR style cheap nylon sling
Still looking for a Sterling sling, but in the meantime used a key chain ring for the front mount.
6) 15 Round Magazine
I was lucky to get a brand new 15 round magazine on Gunbroker. The 34 round mags are nice as a reload, but I prefer the 15 round mag as the primary magazine for the gun. It keeps the entire gun compact and balanced.
NOTE FOR NFA UPGRADES:
Measured the sterling for a suppressor. The barrel needed to be shortened to 11" with an overall length of 30" with the stock extended for an SBR. The Tom Bowers 9mm suppressor can be mounted to the gun with no gunsmithing required (other than shortening the barrel). The Tom Bowers adapter matches the barrel nut threads and screws on tight to replace the barrel nut. The suppressor then can be threaded on the adapter. I will provide more pictures once I get my paperwork back and the work done. I am hoping that can happen in under 6 months.
Here are a few pics of my Sterling with Rails. I picked up my Sterling a few weeks ago and just got a chance to shoot it this last weekend. This is one fun gun to shoot. The dual springs reduce the recoil to almost nothing. Its not like a 9mm rifle kicks that much anyway. It has a similar sensation as shooting an AR. Once I got the dot scope zeroed in, I could knock soda cans all over the range.
Added Items:
1) 6" Top Rail (AR Foregrip style)
This was interesting to mount. Removed the barrel and dropped the mounting bolts in the barrel sleeve. Used a screw driver with duct tape reversed to hold the bolts in place. Turned the bolts upside down so the flat part was facing the screw, otherwise, I could not get a tight fit. Used the front hole and center hole to mount the rail. This allows for part of the rail to be over the top of the receiver.
2) 2.25" Side Rail
The side rail is a 2-1/4" Brownells rail mount with a single 2-hole flat plate with threads. Used a dremel tool to remove material around the mounting plate thread posts so it could be pushed between two holes in the receiver. Replaced the long screws provided with the rail mount with short bolts from Lowes. I forgot the size, so take the rail mount and check the size at the hardware store. Mounted at an angle near the front sight.
3) Sig Red Dot Scope
Picked up a Sig Red Dot Sight and mounted it on the top rail. This is a nice compact red dot that seems to be well made.
4) Surefire LED Light.
Slid the light on the front rail. It was a tight fit between the two rails, but it slides on fine.
5) AR style cheap nylon sling
Still looking for a Sterling sling, but in the meantime used a key chain ring for the front mount.
6) 15 Round Magazine
I was lucky to get a brand new 15 round magazine on Gunbroker. The 34 round mags are nice as a reload, but I prefer the 15 round mag as the primary magazine for the gun. It keeps the entire gun compact and balanced.
NOTE FOR NFA UPGRADES:
Measured the sterling for a suppressor. The barrel needed to be shortened to 11" with an overall length of 30" with the stock extended for an SBR. The Tom Bowers 9mm suppressor can be mounted to the gun with no gunsmithing required (other than shortening the barrel). The Tom Bowers adapter matches the barrel nut threads and screws on tight to replace the barrel nut. The suppressor then can be threaded on the adapter. I will provide more pictures once I get my paperwork back and the work done. I am hoping that can happen in under 6 months.
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briansmithwins
Member
- Joined
- Aug 1, 2005
- Messages
- 4,631
I just SBRed my Uzi. Went from the 16” barrel to the standard 10.2”. I didn't expect the handling to change very much but it did. Balance is much better and the weapon feels much more light than just the weight of the barrel. I suspect there would be a change for the better with the Sterling too when SBRed. BSW
Applegator
Member
Sterling Sporter with Rails Updated Pictures
I am new to posting and still figuring out how to post pictures. Here are the pictures from my previous post of my Sterling Sporter with Rails.
I am new to posting and still figuring out how to post pictures. Here are the pictures from my previous post of my Sterling Sporter with Rails.
AmEngRifles
Member
Nice work Applegator. I think the Sig sight looks just right, scale wise, on this little carbine. I have wondered about setting a rail at the 11 O'clock position so that both the reflex sight and the iron sights are visible. The weapon light could be switched over to the 2 O'clock position then.
I think similarly, if a rail was set at approximately the 7 O'clock position, then a forward hand grip could be mounted and hopefully the folding stock could still be folded forward. I have never found the "magazine grip", that one sees photographed all the time, to be either comfortable or convenient.
Wish someone would make a rail design that could be fitted without barrel removal as my barrel is so tight, I have not been able to remove it. One aspect of the Wiselite gun I am disappointed in.
Btw, I have finally settled that my feeding issues were all to do with 2 used mags. I fixed the problem by bending the feed lips inward so as to make them parallel as they direct a cartridge forward. That seemed to do the trick because those mags now feed flawlessly as well.
My observation in buying any used mag. These mags have a reputation for being smooth and reliable. The exterior finish can look dismal, but if the roller mechanism is rust free and clean and the inside of the mag is dent free and clean, then these mags can still give excellent service. If you end up with a feed issue, look at the feed lips and if they are not parallel with each other, take a small nylon or hard rubber mallet and tap the offending lip inward until it appears parallel with the other. On both my mags, it was the left side feed lip that was diverging away from the other lip. Once it was brought inward, it now feeds 100%.
I think similarly, if a rail was set at approximately the 7 O'clock position, then a forward hand grip could be mounted and hopefully the folding stock could still be folded forward. I have never found the "magazine grip", that one sees photographed all the time, to be either comfortable or convenient.
Wish someone would make a rail design that could be fitted without barrel removal as my barrel is so tight, I have not been able to remove it. One aspect of the Wiselite gun I am disappointed in.
Btw, I have finally settled that my feeding issues were all to do with 2 used mags. I fixed the problem by bending the feed lips inward so as to make them parallel as they direct a cartridge forward. That seemed to do the trick because those mags now feed flawlessly as well.
My observation in buying any used mag. These mags have a reputation for being smooth and reliable. The exterior finish can look dismal, but if the roller mechanism is rust free and clean and the inside of the mag is dent free and clean, then these mags can still give excellent service. If you end up with a feed issue, look at the feed lips and if they are not parallel with each other, take a small nylon or hard rubber mallet and tap the offending lip inward until it appears parallel with the other. On both my mags, it was the left side feed lip that was diverging away from the other lip. Once it was brought inward, it now feeds 100%.
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