New Jersey Over Penetration Statistics

[lemaymiami]

Probably a great waste of time trying to figure the science or research behind the various firearms laws in play - in a state that has these kinds of foolish restrictions. None of them were research based - except for the minimal records or other reviews - to find "stats" and "studies" that bolstered their arguments at the time the laws were passed... That's what you're dealing with - and I forgot the emotionally based appeals that always go along with this sort of stuff...

Just as Colorado has suffered from the "California exodus".. so have we from the "Jersey and New York exodus" down here in Florida... Wish I had a nickel for every foolish proposal when I was in police work at the mid-management level and had to attend this or that committee meeting or public hearing with local residents who frequently started out their pitches with the statement... "Back in Jersey or New York (or other anti-gun state on the east coast) we did it ..... this way...."

Long out of police work and doing my own thing (which just happens to keep me on the water and away from people, mostly...) it still stands out how folks who've thoroughly messed up their home state usually bring with them the attitudes that caused all the trouble where they came from....

 

[230RN]

This is interesting because I've always felt that the concern about overpenetration was a bit overblown.

I've never advanced that opinion for fear of being dog-packed by "right-thinking" shooters... who are legitimately concerned about the issue --and the public relations effects.

But I am pleased to see a few folks here who have expressed a couple of opinions in line with my own. This, including the remarks about selective statistics brought forth by anti-firearms ax-grinders. And, of course, the single-instance events which are brought forth as evidence... or "proof."

You know, like the proverbial "That bullet whizzed right by my head by an inch and I coulda been killed."

Me? Yeah, it's a danger in some cases but some of the penetrating situations the FBI is testing for are far beyond what might happen with the single shooter ...be he good guy or bad guy.

Debate, to me, over whether a load penetrates eighteen inches or twenty inches of jello or goes through three versus four sheet rock panels, is more or less irrelevant.

There. I said it and I ain't takin' it back.

Terry runs and hides

 

[c1ogden]

Just because they live in a state with stupid laws, that doesn't mean N.J. CCW's/firearms owners are stupid.
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I have absolutely zero data to back this up, but it wouldn't surprise me a bit if Federal Expanding Full Metal Jacket ammo is very popular in New Jersey.

I've been carrying EFMJ since I retired and still do even though I no longer live in NJ but, as far as I know, most of the other retired guys I see are just using regular solid bullets.

 

[c1ogden]

I think the NJ lawyers would consider that a hollowpoint.

I did some experimentation with reversed HBWC back in the 70s. At the end I was not impressed. When they expanded (as you intended them to) they had dramatic expansion. Problem is the expansion was unreliable. They would often expand only on one side or side of the hollow base would sear off. They would sometimes start to expand and wind up tumbling as the much heavier "base" would make the bullet turn. That's basic physics you can't change. That's why FMJ or round nose bullets tumble as Odd Job explained above.

You could be charged with illegal possession of hollow points in NJ as the only charge. There are those that say you will be arrested for that single 22 hollow point rolling around in your trunk.

A hollow point charge in NJ is usually used as an add on charge. Prosecutors only use it if you're arrested for something else.

I'm not saying don't concern yourself with the law in NJ. I'm saying don't overconcern yourself.

Note that the wording of NJ's law makes possession of a hollow point bullet a felony, it doesn't even have to be a whole cartridge!
And, unfortunately, any cop that isn't a "gun guy" is likely to charge you with possession of HP ammo. In my experience (29 years NJ cop) most cops are aware that HP bullets are illegal but aren't aware of the list of exemptions that allow you to purchase HP ammo, keep it at home, and use it on the range.

 

[LookAtYou]

I've been carrying EFMJ since I retired and still do even though I no longer live in NJ but, as far as I know, most of the other retired guys I see are just using regular solid bullets.

And have they experienced "overpenetration" situations?

 

[buck460XVR]

Since New Jersey outlaws Hollow Points, I'm curious as to what they're rate of "over penetration" is , if there is some sort of statistic like that in the first place.

Since HPs have a smaller chance of over penetration than FMJs, I doubt if the rule is because of over-pentration. Probably the same reasoning behind non-use of HPs for military use.

 

[c1ogden]

And have they experienced "overpenetration" situations?

I am not aware of any NJ shooting situations involving retired cops.