Newbie help 9mm reloading

[Dudedog]

I normally shoot 124/125s in 9mm but my favorite powders for 9mm are
Universal (may be hard/impossible to find)
WSF
HP38/Win231
CFE pistol
N320 (about 40% more expensive than the first 4 and can be harder to find than some others)
All meter well thru the lee Pro Disk.

I have had really greats results with these (my new favorite 9mm practice bullet) and they are a good pricem they are 124gr bullets
http://www.shop.rmrbullets.com/9mm-...ose-Plated-500-Ct-9mm-124-RMR-HC-FLAT-500.htm
$45 for 500, $81 for 1000 shipped.
Rocky Mountain Reloading is great to do business with and they offer THR members a 5% discount. The discount code is in BDSs PIF thread here in handloading and reloading.

I have also had good results with the 125gr SWC and cones from Missouri Bullet Company. They are also good people to do business with and offer THR members a 5% discount.

Nothing wrong with Berrys bullets, just mentioning my favorites.

I think you will be really happy with the Lee turret press, I have the older "Deluxe" version and I have loaded at least 20000+ rounds on it and am very happy with it.

I like my Pro Disk and have used it a lot. You probably want to get and adjustable charge bar for it in case you want a charge between disk hole sizes.

Welcome to THR and reloading, there are lots of great people here.
If you have a question by all means ask us, better safe than sorry.

 

[someguy2800]

You forgot the riser so you can use the auto prime and the Pro Auto-Disk powder /lee drum.

Just running the numbers quickly without shopping around the items you list plus the riser on Amazon come to $194.65 + tax. The kit cost $204 yes it comes with the older Pro Auto-Disk powder vs the new drum but if you are not worried about the precision of the digital scale why worry about the precision difference with the Pro Auto-Disk powder? If you are loading for rifle or hot load pistol then maybe the Drum is a big improvement but if you are loading middle of the road loads for IDPA, other gun games or range plinking the Pro disk works now like it has been for years.

I see this advice time and time again and I disagree. You get a beam scale, a Lee manual, Cutter, Lock Stud, Chamfer Tool etc... for $10. How is that not a better deal?

The classic turret kit I see on amazon is 204.83 + 19.23 shipping. Plus the 4 die set is 47.08, for a total of $271.14.

If ordered from the Titan reloading website,

4 hole turret = 99.97
safety prime = 21.75
auto drum measure = 35.99
9mm 4 die set = 40.67
shipping = 17.51

frankford arsenal digital scale from Amazon = 29.93 shipped

total = $245.64

You do not need the riser for the auto drum, I know because I have this setup. The rest of the parts in the kit are of no use for 9mm.

 

[WVsig]

The classic turret kit I see on amazon is 204.83 + 19.23 shipping. Plus the 4 die set is 47.08, for a total of $271.14.

If ordered from the Titan reloading website,

4 hole turret = 99.97
safety prime = 21.75
auto drum measure = 35.99
9mm 4 die set = 40.67
shipping = 17.51

frankford arsenal digital scale from Amazon = 29.93 shipped

total = $245.64

You do not need the riser for the auto drum, I know because I have this setup. The rest of the parts in the kit are of no use for 9mm.

I forgot the Die... LOL

IIRC I paid $209 for the kit and no shipping + $41 for the dies. Not that this really matters for the OP because the OPs Kit is on the way.

I am expecting delivery of my press and dies on Friday and hope to have it set up by Sunday night to begin to dry run through everything until I am completely confident of how it will all work.

Even if we add the scale to the kit we are really talking about $280 vs $245.64. I guess what I am saying is with the kit you get things which are of some use. The beam scale is nice to have as a backup and a way to verify the cheap digital scale. IMHO The other items like the Lee manual are useful for new reloaders. It is not a great load data book but is a decent book on the process of reloading especially using Lee equipment. To me as a new reloader it had value for me. Down the road the chamfer tool, cutter and lube might come in handy because we all know if you like reloading you rarely stick with one caliber. LOL

The biggest advantage in your approach is the Lee Drum but if you choose your powders carefully the Pro Auto Disk included in the Kit does a great job for 9mm. From what I have read the Drum really shines for rifle and close to max loads. YMMV

 

[WessonOil]

Welcome to the world of handloading!
I'm 53 and have been handloading since I was 19.

9mm is what I handload most, as I shoot it competitively.
First off, I'm handloading 9mm at about 12 cents per round, using RMR (Rocky Mountain Reloading) 124 grain plated at 8.1 cents each, and powder and primer rounding it up to about 12 cents.

That's $6.00 per fifty.
If your friends burn a few hundred rounds a year then maybe that's not much savings, but my wife and I burn up an excess of ten of thousand rounds a year.

A few quick things:
Look at bumping up to at least a 124 grain bullet. It will get your recoil down. (I am beginning to actually use 147 grain bullets.)
Better to go on the lighter side of a load than the heavy side to keep recoil down, but still make power factor.

Lots of personal favorites among board members as far as powders.
For 124 grain I have used 231/HP38 a lot, but have started preferring TiteGroup.
With 147 grain I'm liking WST, but many other good ones out there.

It will be a good idea to venture into a progress press at some point if you're shooting competitively. (I own two Lee 100's and a Classic Turret.)

 

[tcoz]

Xtreme bullets are an excellent choice. I've loaded and shot thousands of them. Sign up for their daily email specials. Almost always 5% off a specific bullet or bullets. Shipping is a flat $5.00.

The LCT press is also a great choice, especially for a low volume and/or new reloader. It was my first press and I'm still using it years later. I use it as an indexing press for pistol and as a single stage press for rifle.

 

[Dudedog]

I think it is helpful for beginners to use a little bit bulkier powder than Titegroup.
I don't have an issue with Titegroup but for a beginner I would think it would be nice if it is easier to spot a possible double charge.
IMO Titegroup is also a little less forgiving charge wise than some other powders.

I have used lots of powders that work well, 9mm can use quite a range.

Look at your manual and get an idea of the speed range of powders you can use in 9mm.
To start I would recommend something in the middle of that range.

It is a matter of preference but I do prefer 124/125s over 115s. They seem to shoot better for me.

 

[ColoradoShooter77]

Unique is a good powder for a beginner, pretty much impossible to double charge it.

 

[Drop45]

"As stated above, the apprehension of firing your first round is intense, but if all goes well after that, it becomes a complete feeling of pride and satisfaction."

That's funny. The very first round I reloaded was 44 magnum-about mid charge. Wore a pair of welding gloves and a full face shield as well as shooting glasses to fire off that first round. Ahh, the looks I got at the range. Welcome to our brotherhood, have fun and be safe.

 

[Ghost In The Fog]

Okay... Thank you everyone for your great advice. I have learned more form all of you in the past week than I have on my own.
I am having a hard time finding powder. What are your thoughts on Accurate #7 for 115 grain barrys plated round nose bullets?
I have been chronicling my journey and will share it soon.
I have begun to set up the Lee Classic turret. The instructions that come with the Classic Turret kit are **** to say the least.
I have had a hard time figuring out the auto index and how to install the primer arm. But I have the first die in and working perfectly. (I think)
Onward from here.

Lees recommends Accurate #7 and that is the only powder i can find available that is on the list in my reloading manual. How likely am I to double charge? I want safety to be first and foremost.

Any thoughts???

Thanks to you all again for some great recommendations.

 

[evtSmtx]

Welcome!

I load at least 5K 9mm a year. I had been using berry's bullets for a while but the next 5K will be montana gold(good sale price). My favorite powders for 9 are Power Pistol, CFE Pistol and BE-86. In second place HP-38 and Titegroup. If you use titegroup be very careful to not double charge or over charge. I like Power and CFE pistol for performance but also appreciate that they mostly fill the case so a double charge would lead to obvious spillage.

LCT is a great choice. I ultimately went to a Dillon after a while but still use my LCT for small batches. I also have the micrometer powder bar since I despise the disks.

 

[johnc486]

I would like to add to your list a tool that has came in handy for me numerous times, a kinetic bullet puller, mistakes do happen and need to be undone. I started with the LCT which was a great learning tool, didn't care for the powder measure tho. This hobby has progressed to an addiction for me since retirement, I have to accomplish something in the reloading room daily. Be safe, take your time and double check everything (especially powder drops), we have all been in your shoes learning the process.

 

[WessonOil]

Ghost,
With an autoindex press such as the LCT or progressive press such as Lee 1000, it's "difficult" to get a double charge.
When you push down on the handle, it pushes the case up into the die for its powder drop, then when you bring the lever down, the turret/case holder moves that case out of the way.
However, if you experiance a glitch and do a shortstroke before turret/case holder moves moves and short stroke, you need to pay attention.
I've loaded a gazillion rounds on progressive and LCT and never double charged a single case.
But, I'm as careful about paying attention after a gazillion rounds as I am after my first several hundred I ever did.

Mount a light of some sort that shines down into the cases in your shellholder so you may see the powder in the cases easier.

 

[Cemetery21]

AA #7 is the slowest powder listed in Hornady ninth edition for 115 and heavier bullets. Generally, that means it will work, but may burn a little dirty at mid to low range charges. AA pistol powders are very fine grains and might leak some powder in Lee disk measures. If it is all that is available to you right now, it would be a decent powder to learn with until something else is available. Also, with the listed loads, one pound should load most of your 1000 bullets and give you time to find another powder/bullet deal.

 

[ku4hx]

For 380 ACP, 9mm and 40 S&W I've standardized on Ramshot true Blue. Once I work through my remaining Bullseye, TB will be my 45 ACP powder of choice also.

TB has outstanding metering consistency, good velocities, easy to ignite, provides accuracy as good as any others I've tried and when I bought my stock it was lower in price. Since the majority of my loads are mid-range using cast or plated bullets it does everything I want a powder to do and it does all very well.

 

[Dudedog]

I would like to add to your list a tool that has came in handy for me numerous times, a kinetic bullet puller

YES!

Missed you not having that on your list.
It is a must and not very expensive, sometime sooner or later you will be wondering did I or didn't I check and want to pull the round apart.

I have never used AA7 but it is around Longshots speed. Longshot worked well for me in MAX loads but not as well in the middle of the charge range. AA7 should work but I would try to get something maybe a little bit faster.
The slower powder might possibly be better with 124/125 gr bullets as well.
I seem to recall that AA7 was designed for 9mm carbine ammo loaded on the high side, but I may be mistaken.


Something around the speed of these if you can find anything
HP38, Universal, WSF, AA5, BE86, CFE-Pistol
(faster to slower)

But if you don't want to pay the hazmat fee and shipping charges sometime you need to take what you can find.

 

[Potatohead]

Looks like the fellas have doled out plenty of good advice already but I'll throw mine in too, in case you're not confused enough yet.

I recommend grabbing some check weights. How else will you know that the scale is correct when it tells you how much powder is in the pan?

Powder mishaps are much more likely than primer ones. To much powder, not enough..worry about that, not your primers.
Dont NOT worry about your primers, but the primer procedure is pretty easy to follow and if you do, youll be fine.

 

[Ghost In The Fog]

Quick update... Set up the press and ran through everything over and over until I knew and understood exactly how everything worked together. I deprimed some cases and only loaded bullets with no powder. I will uplad a picture of the first one later, it's pretty funny. Got comfortable, as comfortable as I could be anyway considering I am brand new and then took the plunge.
I gathered all my notes and reloading info, even exchanged emails with Berry's Bullets (very helpful by the way)
I loaded 25 rounds using Berry's 115gr. copper plated round nose bullets, Winchester primers and Winchester Autocomp powder.
All the load data says start at 4.4 grains which is 34 on the Lee Pro Disk and a COL of 1.130 and used the calipers on every single one as they were loaded. I had 1.127 to 1.135. With the majority of them at 1.130 to 1.132
Went to the range and shot 15 of the 25. I had 3 stovepipes and the other 12 did not eject. The bullet placement, once I opened my eyes and turned my head back around LOL JK was actually really good. I only had the target at 15 feet so I could see every hit and knew nothing was stuck in the barrel.
I am thinking that the loads were too far on the low end. I had a digital scale with calibration weights and I measured every charge. The auto disk was very inconsistent, delivering between 4.2 and 5.1 grains. I repeatedly put the powder back in the hopper unless it was 4.4 or 4.5
Is my thinking correct as to why the cases did not eject?
The range for the Autocomp powder is 4.4 to 5.1 so I am thinking I will do 10 at 4.7gr and 10 at 4.9 to see if that helps.

Thank you to everyone's great advise and input. It has made me feel at ease and confident as I am getting started.

 

[tcoz]

Did you actually weigh your charges and not just depend on the calculation to determine which disk to use? Mine always dropped .3 to .5gr less than what it said it would for the size disk I was using.

 

[Ghost In The Fog]

Did you actually weigh your charges and not just depend on the calculation to determine which disk to use? Mine always dropped .3 to .5gr less than what it said it would for the size disk I was using.

I did. I loaded a new primer and then weighed every case before and after each powder charge.
I have increase the charge to 4.7gr and #37 on the Lee pro measure. I loaded 20 rounds this time and the powder charge was more consistent. It ranged from 4.8, 4.9 with three at 5.0.
I will go to the range tomorrow and see if this is enough to eject them.
Thanks!

 

[Ghost In The Fog]

Looks like the fellas have doled out plenty of good advice already but I'll throw mine in too, in case you're not confused enough yet.

I recommend grabbing some check weights. How else will you know that the scale is correct when it tells you how much powder is in the pan?

Powder mishaps are much more likely than primer ones. To much powder, not enough..worry about that, not your primers.
Dont NOT worry about your primers, but the primer procedure is pretty easy to follow and if you do, youll be fine.

Great advise and my digital scale does have two 50 gram weights and I calibrate it every time I turn it on just to be sure and have even checked it during the loading process just to be sure.
Thanks for the tip.

 

[vaalpens]

Looks like the load data you are using (4.4gr-5.1gr) is for lead RN.

Normally if you can't find the exact load, then you can use the load data for a heavier bullet. Hodgdon has load data for a 124gr Berry's HBRNTP starting at 4.8gr with a max of 5.4gr. You should be safe to start with 4.8gr which is also the midpoint for the lead data.

I just load 124gr and has found less issues with the heavier 124gr bullet.

Another suggestion is to weigh each load for you first few reloads just to make sure you have the correct powder weight and everything works well. The less variables you have the better.

 

[Dudedog]

These are inexpensive check weights I got from Amazon
http://www.amazon.com/American-Weig...&qid=1446265705&sr=8-2&keywords=check+weights

(I got a set PIF from BDS but gave it to a friend and ordered another for myself)

About $10 + shipping

They are in gram + milligrams so if you have a digital you don't need to convert to grains but in case your wondering the set has (rounded to 2 places)
50 g =771.61 gr
20 g = 308.16 gr
10 g =154.32 gr
5 g = 77.16 gr
1 g = 15.43 gr
500 mg = 7.71 gr
200 mg = 3.08 gr
50 mg = .77 gr (3/4 of a grain)
20 mg = .31 gr
10 mg = .154 gr (a lot of digitals won't weigh the small one - GEM20 will)

For pistol powder charges you are concerned with the small ones 50mg to 500 mg because thats closer to your charge range.

Autocomp guestimate of charge weigh disk size

gr disk cc
4.1 | 0.322711
4.3 | 0.338453
4.4 | 0.346324
4.7 | 0.369937
4.8 | 0.377808
5 | 0.39355
5.1 | 0.401421
5.2 | 0.409292
5.4 | 0.425034
5.5 | 0.432905


Listed VMD for auto com is .07871
You can determine the VMD you are getting by working it out
VMD*Charge weight = cc
cc/VMD= charge weight
cc/charge weight = VMD

so if you .4 disk was throwing 5.1 gr of autocomp the listed VMD is what you are getting but say you .4 disk is throwing 4.9gr
.4/4.9 = .0816 if you check a couple disks and average the number you get for VMD that sort of gives you a working VMD that will give you a beeter idea of how much
of a given powder a disk will throw. Some powder I have found are very close to their listed VMD some are off by a noticable amount.


I attached a Excel Spreadsheet I setup to calculate disk size charge.
It also lists some data from Hodgdon, it should be accurate but double check to be safe.

There are no macros of any kind in the spread sheet.

 

[murf]

glad to see you are writing everything down. a reloading journal is a very important reference when you change from one load to another. also, making sure the correct amount of powder in the case is the most important step, imo.

and welcome to the forum!

murf

 

[Ghost In The Fog]

Alrighty- today I went to the range and test fired the next batch of ammo- This time it worked somewhat better. Somewhat. I had powder loads that ranged form 4.8 to 5.1gr.
Of the 20 rounds I had no stovepipes but 6 jams and 2 primers that did not detonate. (Winchester)

Attached is a picture of the jam. The round fired, the recoil felt right but the brass was just stuck with the slide partially open.

I had 3 rounds that were 5.0 gr and one that was 5.1 and loaded those separately and they cycled perfectly with no jams.

I also had something weird happen, as I shot all of the lower charged rounds, the cases that did eject, went in front of me and into the range. The 4.9's and higher ejected just like they should (Glock 34)

I am assuming I am correcting the ejection issue by raising the powder charge. My COL is right in the range is needs to be. I have increased the disk on my Lee pro disk to .40 and I am getting more consistent charges. Of the 20 I have;
Four at 5.2 gr.
Five at 5.3 gr
Eight at 5.4 gr
Three at 5.5 gr

Is this variation in powder charges normal? :banghead:

I read that powders can and do vary by batch as much as 20%. Maybe I just have one of those? (Winchester Autocomp)

So, I am guessing I will have to go through this entire process again when I get new powder, even if it is the same kind....

Thanks again everyone for your help.

 

[tcoz]

I had the same problem with inconsistently inconsistent charges with the Pro Auto-Disk and it finally led me to "bite the bullet" and buy an RCBS Chargemaster. It was the best $250 I've ever spent in reloading.
There are so many variables that can lead to inconsistent charges with the PAD that it would make your head spin. There were days when every charge was plus or minus 0.1gr and the next day they would be plus or minus 0.3-0.4gr. Probably one of the biggest factors I found was the stroke I used when dropping the charge. Even, consistent strokes with a little bump at the end seemed to work best but there were days when I just couldn't get into a rhythm and I'd have to pack it in hoping tomorrow would be better. It's a similar situation with the Auto-Prime as far as loading the primer into the cup on the primer arm but I don't think it's as sensitive as the PAD.
You'll get the hang of it. The Lee Turret is a great press but there's a definite technique involved in producing good consistent ammo.