non nfa pistol stock?

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I vaguely recall their being such a setup in 70s for wheelguns. I don't know if it went away due to lack of interest or the feds putting the kibosh on said though.
 
Eh... If shouldering a pistol remakes it into an SBR, I dont see how this device can fly.



Because it's a rest and not a stock, as it isn't attached to the pistol. Rather, the handgun is supported by the rest, and your hand brings it all together.

And yes, this is not a new concept. The spin here is materials, and tacticool AR-15 stocks.


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Jimmy
 
Swing

I remember seeing ads for a similar set-up like you described for revolvers back in the early 1980s. Since it didn't directly attach to the gun itself, being held in place by means of a couple of contact points and a molded grip section, it wasn't considered an SBR.
 
So cops are supposed to attach one to their duty belt? Because if I had to go back to the car for it I would grab an actual rifle instead.
 
I think this could add versatility to a pistol for someone backpacking or having a "bug out bag".

I have an extra AR adjustable stock laying around that I could add to one of these things. Could be cool if I didn't have to worry about trying educating every LEO that I came across about it's legality.
 
Time will tell how the ATF deals with it, but if the price is reasonable I'd consider trying one. But I have smallish hands so anything that "fattens" a grip will probably not work very well for me.
 
I'm thinking more and more about this thing, as in how I dislike the design but really like the concept. There's are so many different sized grips and different grip shapes and angles that it would be hard to be universal, but by having an adjustable grip angle that would allow for a lot more guns to fit it. Really the whole point is to stabilize the shooting hand, and the hand still holds the gun even in this contraption, so if it were more modular that would be awesome.
 
If I remember rightly, the Luger, Broomhandle, and Hi Power stocks were all removed from NFA for being C&R, and that they were not rifles being made into pistols, but pistols being given a shoulder rest.

But, I could be remembering wrong.
 
If I remember rightly, the Luger, Broomhandle, and Hi Power stocks were all removed from NFA for being C&R, and that they were not rifles being made into pistols, but pistols being given a shoulder rest.

But, I could be remembering wrong.

Nothing to do with being a shoulder rest. You are correct about the C&R thing.

Only the original stocks, not the reproductions are exempted.

Using a reproduction stock on any of those guns requires a $200 stamp.
(yes you can buy the reproductions pretty cheap and easily.)



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Walkalong,

Back in the day I as told that order of installation was very important for the product you linked. Installing stock but not barrel == NFA. Of course, that was just the word on the street, not necesarily an ATF finding. I believe that stock was attached to the pistol, whereas the OP's product is held in place by the shooter and not attached.
 
Yes, the stock attaches to a special mainspring housing. I always wondered about the legalities of it. Must have been OK with both attached, or they wouldn't have been selling them.
 
Much like the AR - order of assembly is important.

With the device the OP mentions there is no "assembly," it's simply held by friction and the shooters grip. Since there is no fastener and it readily falls off when released, it's not "attached."

The 1911 same as the Luger had a mechanical interlock which holds it in place.

Lets take this another step - No, I'm not writing any letters. If the buffer tube of an AR is not considered a stock by the ATF - who will classify any vertical flat surface attached to the rear of it as a "stock," then why not wear the flat vertical surface on the shoulder with a simple cup receiver to position the tube?

1) it's not attached to the tube, it's attached to the shooter.
2) recoil pads are part and parcel of "sporting uses."
3) It uses a harness shoulder pad instead of a shooter trying to place a buttstock to one side or the other
4) It can be devised to rest just above the actual shoulder pocket where the inline design of the AR puts it, reducing the amount a shooter needs to crink his head down to the sight line. Lots of AR shooters place just the toe of a normal stock in the pocket.

It would be something akin to a kydex butt plate but not directly attached to the gun.

Thats the sort of things that the law are usually never written to deal with, same as the '34 NFA never considering the mechanical innovation of the AR with it's separate upper and lower. It then causes legalistic interpretations based on case law to be made and those who do so know that concepts dreamed up without substantiation in the law will be directly challenged. Add 80 years of political wrangling and interpretations, along with court decisions which reinforce or undercut certain assumptions, and we get what we have now.

The '34 NFA started all this by attempting to ban handgun ownership completely. What got passed was a partial attempt to control misuse by legislating technology. If there is anything we should know for a fact today, it's that whatever technology a firearm exhibits has nothing to do with the intent of the user. That's why these laws are duplicative and unnecessary. It makes no difference whether a pistol has a stock or not - same as a knife having a push button to open the blade vs merely pushing the blade itself. The feature in and of itself isn't "moral," it's the users intent as expressed in what they do with it.

I carry a switchblade daily at work to open boxes, and it's a fine feature to have. It doesn't mean it's an evil or illegal device whatsoever - unless it's misused for some purpose that intrudes on the constitutionally protected freedoms of others. Same with a stock on a pistol - which certainly doesn't make it more concealable and only offers an incremental improvement in accuracy. We are talking handguns, which are in practical terms about 1/2 the power to consistently stop an attack when needed, and commonly used at close range - so close it becomes a question of "how did you miss?"

If stocks were made legal for AR pistols (which they were at one time) or any pistol, would the country become immediately endangered with shootouts in the streets and blood running in the gutters? Some would assert that we are already there - but the point is that the addition of a shoulder rest to a low powered limited range handgun isn't going to abruptly make that weapon a "game changer." The real issue is that it's about controlling the free and independent people of our nation - using privilege and financial obstacles as a gateway to ownership as proof of their character.

Since when is that High Road or even Constitutional?
 
Well, it sure is ugly. I think there was an article in American Handgunner that evaluated shoulder stocks on C&R handguns - Luger, Mauser 96, Browning Hi Power. The conclusion was, IIRC, that such devices are not game changers. One is still shooting a handgun caliber with a small increase in accuracy at the expense of convenience. By their nature, handguns are intended to be convenient. Appendages such as shoulder stocks, especially those not attached to the firearm but carried separately may degrade the convenience factor. As per Elkins post.
 
I don't see the point. If cops are supposed to carry that monstrosity on their person, then why not just give them an SMG or SBR, preferably with a folding stock? Then again, I wouldn't want to have to wrestle someone to the ground with a gun strapped to my back. And like someone already said, if they're expected to go back to their car for it, then they can just grab their carbine instead.

More than anything, this just illustrates the absurdity of the NFA. All it did was make firearms for self defense more impractical, and did nothing to protect the public from anything.:banghead:
 
These are more practical.

But if you shoulder it, then you're "constructing" an SBR. At least until a case goes to court, in which case the ATF might lose. That's the beauty of their little opinion letter. They can bully everyone into following their directives without actually proving it in court.
 
But if you shoulder it, then you're "constructing" an SBR. At least until a case goes to court, in which case the ATF might lose. That's the beauty of their little opinion letter. They can bully everyone into following their directives without actually proving it in court.
It's actually attached to the pistol though. And OF COURSE no one would shoulder it... but you can still get it close to your shoulder and get a good cheek weld. (We won't get into where your shoulder stops and the fact that bracing it against other parts of your body like the chest are technically still perfectly legal).
 
So one that just slides over an AR handgun buffer tube with no attachment would be legal?

Doesn't look like the original design would work well for lefties.
 
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