Old friend S&W .38 "chiefs"

[dbldown74]

I have an old S&W .38spl Mod 36 j-frame 2 1/2in bbl acquired in the early 1970's. After a 40 year "torture test" including over-charged reloads from before I knew better, this old friend is in need of a yoke assembly screw.
I have ordered several screws from schematics and all have been over-sized. I have been told by gun techs from mail order company that the yoke screws they have for S&W mod 36 j-frames measure 0.19" at the head. The one I have on this piece measures 0.17".
I'm now planning on keeping one that is .190" and trying to take it down to .170" and hope the threads fit.
Any suggestions?

 

[rcmodel]

Forget mail order companies!

Call S&W customer Service.

1-800-331-0852 (USA)
Mon-Fri 8:00AM-8:00PM Eastern Time

And give them the model # and serial number.

They will send you the correct screw.

rc

 

[Jim K]

Do the new screws have a pointy end on them? If so, those are for the new models and the pointy part is a separate piece with a spring behind it. They won't work in the older guns. The old screws are one piece and are flat on the end; they may have to be fitted so the yoke will swing freely without being too loose.

Jim

 

[rcmodel]

That is a good point Jim.

I am not aware of any change in screw head size in the older J-Frames like the OP ask about.

I just checked 4 J-Frames.
And without taking all the screws out.

New style spring loaded yoke screw ='.186" head.

Three Old style (1953 - 1970's) J-Frame solid yoke screws = .164" heads.

PS: I don't know, but I doubt the threads are the same either.
So I wouldn't even try it!!!

You could easily ruin the frame cranking it in if it's even slightly different thread pitch.

rc

 

[dbldown74]

Thanks to all for the info. At least I now know I'm not nuts (this time).
I will be calling Numrich and S&W knowing what I looking for any why, after I carefully try to take down the "modern" screw.
Here's a pic of my old friend. Not pretty, could use some make-up, but faithful.

 

[BBBBill]

...after I carefully try to take down the "modern" screw.

Waste of time if it is the "modern" screw. As noted, wrong thread diameter, possibly wrong thread pitch, and the spring loaded pointed plunger tip will not interface correctly with the yoke slot. The old style slot is a square "U" shape. The new style is a "V" shaped slot.

 

[dbldown74]

I believe you are correct. After a lot of looking, ordering and returning.... Pictures are vague and part numbers w/o dimensions are useless. I'm thinking it is as simple as a pointed end, spring loaded or not is "modern" and will not fit. One with a flat end should.
I initially could not tell nor do I remember if the original was pointed of flat. It is now clean worn and shiny. Now that I know the difference the rest is finding it.
Another pic of old and modern side by side.

 

[rcmodel]

Again, just call S&W Customer Service and they will send you the right one!!!!

It's not rocket science!

rc

 

[Jim K]

You can't "take down" the new type screw; it is not solid, it is hollow and if you try to make it fit, you will just destroy it. Plus, the yoke on the new guns has a triangular cut to match the new pointed screw; the old type has a square cutout to fit the old style screw. Get the right screw.

Jim

 

[BBBBill]

Note how the threads are missing on the end of the old style screw. That's the fitting part. Not all will require removal of that much material. Depending on the specific yoke/frame combination often much of the thread remains. Its job is to retain the yoke with the minimum amount of yoke end shake (fore/aft movement). As near zero clearance as possible while allowing the yoke to open/close smoothly without binding.

 

[Jim K]

^^^^

Yes, and that careful fitting was done at the factory by a skilled worker. And that was the reason for the change to a screw system that is more complex to make, but requires no fitting at all, saving a significant chunk of change.

They made the new screw bigger, not only to contain the plunger and spring, but to make sure the new one won't be used in the old guns or vice versa.

Jim

 

[rcmodel]

^^^^
^^^^

Both above.

In addition, the smaller part of the screw may need to be shortened to keep it from binding on the yoke when tightened..

Factory fitting was done to the yoke screw in older guns in both diameter and length.

When you get the new screw.
Be careful and think it through before you put it in and crank it down tight!!!

rc

 

[rondog]

I bet S&W could give your old friend a wondeful makeover and make it gorgeous again! I have a Model 10 I'd love to send them, if I could afford to.

 

[dbldown74]

I have learned more about S&W Yoke Assembly Screws from this forum/thread than I ever knew existed.
After 3 tries ordering from the "professionals" @ Brownells I realize they don't know the difference between a chiefs, lady smith or bodyguard. Their latest sure fit is still over sized and spring loaded. Not even going to try it.
I know I could have the entire piece reconditioned but not only can I not afford it but it would lose it's character.
Numrich has what looks like the right screw $3.89+ I will call them to make sure they know the difference between pre and post 1970. If they can't then it's S&W.
The old-fashioned wisdom and knowledge from this forum is invaluable. Thanks to all, I will make my Old Friend okay while doing no damage.
If anybody wants a "modern" S&W yoke screw, let me know. Free with no shipping.

 

[rcmodel]

Why are you so intent on buying a screw from a used parts house??

For the third time.
Just call S&W Customer Service, give them the model & serial number, and they will very likely send you the correct one free.

Numric's $3.95 + as much as $8.00 shipping for a used old screw that has already been fitted to a different gun (or a repro) sounds like deal breaker to me.

The last time I ordered a bunch of old Winchester screws from them?

I got a bag full of new reproduction bright blue high polish screws that were in no way correct for an old Winchester rifle!!

rc

 

[dbldown74]

If I need to go to S&W I certainly will. Initially dismissed them when they list a new Model 36 for $749 and I paid $89, yes in 1970. Didn't want to get charged $19.95 just for asking.
Have one ordered from Numrich. Design, size and picture looks correct with flat end no spring and not hollow. $3.80 and no shipping. Have to try it. Again however I was talking to a 20yr old with a computer and being polite was more important than being correct. Used is fine for what I'm looking for as long as it fits.
Thanks again for your help

 

[dbldown74]

Screw from Numrich. Looks new 1 drop of lube, perfect fit. Thanks rc