Pardner Pump

[Rocketmedic]

Interesting day here- went to the El Paso gun show, found Tokarev ammo, sold my Cz52 to a good friend, and set my heart on a Pardner pump. The ones at the show were a bit pricey (249 for a new H and R Pardner Pump 12ga, 229 for a Maverick 88, 429 for a Hi Point 40 carbine) but it was totally awesome and worth it to go and meet so many people- its good to see the 2nd Amendment is going strong here.

Anyway, I made a plan for my arsenal.
1: Mainstream calibers. If I can't buy it locally, I don't need it. This also goes for 7.62x54, abeit reluctantly. I need to buy a thousand or so for the M-N.
2. No one-upmanship. I'm happy with bargain guns. Two poops if someone talks smack- its just gotta work well.
3. Nothing over $400, collection under $1500.
4. Whenever possible, common ammo.

Anyways, its going to look like this:
M44
HiPoint JHP (truck gun)
Future wants
Pistol (gf wants an xd, probably another Hi Point, possibly a revolver)
Shotgun: Pardner pump, must be 12ga. Considering 870 and Maverick-Mossberg as well.
Carbine: potentially, will be a Hi Point 45 or 40. Also eying the 30-30 levers.

Anyway, how do the Pardners compare with the Mavericks, and are there any other good shotgun options for less than 230 or so? I'm thinking a used 500 might fit in here too, potentially an 870. What do yall like about them? How accessorizeable are they? How durable and long-lasting? Where are they needing improvement? Etc.

Anyways, how do yall feel about the cheapies?

 

[Fred Fuller]

I spent years looking for a Chinese 870 clone to buy in order to evaluate it personally, but kept running across used good condition older (pre-mag tube dimples) 870 Express guns that were cheaper every time. Since I finally found the first clone, a Pardner Pump, I've picked up another used Pardner Pump and a couple of used IAC Hawks cheaper than I could find used Express guns at the time. So far the clones are working out well, but given a choice I'd still pick a good used older model Express for the same money.

The only thing I don't like about the Mossberg 500/Maverick 88 is the difficulty in getting access to the magazine tube/spring/follower for maintenance. If I were going to get a Mossberg at this point, I'd look for a 590.

Most of what needs improvement with any good reliable pump shotgun lies between the ears of the shooter... . Most of what any shotgun needs is trigger time. If you buy any pumpgun new, field strip it and give it a good cleaning/degreasing very first thing. If you buy it used- same thing. It's amazing the quantities of factory shipping grease that sometimes linger in used guns that have never been cleaned. One warning- on one of the Hawks I brought home, the shell latches weren't staked into the receiver. Fortunately I had the tool to remedy that, but...

IMHO you won't need to add much in the way of bling. The same Sidesaddles that fit 870s will fit the clones just fine, the four round version for the long forearm and the six round version for the short. It's easy to put a sling on the clones, the stock has a tapped brass insert for a machine screw type rear sling swivel stud and it's easy to install another one of the same type with a nut and LocTite in the magazine cap to keep it in place. The clones already have longer magazine tubes- no need to worry about extensions. If you find a Hawk 982, you get useable ghost ring sights from the factory. If you want a white light source on board, any of the rigs that fit an 870 will work on the clones.

fwiw,

lpl

 

[NoobCannon]

Hit some pawn shops, you may get lucky. I picked mine up for a hundred used, and I've yet to complain about build quality or performance. Mine had the dimpled magazine tube, but 45 seconds with a dremel and a chainsaw sharpening bit took care of that.

 

[Rocketmedic]

Pawn shops are awesome places for finding guns- never bought from anywhere else.

 

[Rocketmedic]

Will the clones run shot and slug? Will the domestics? I'm looking for 18" barrels, 22 at most, with no fancy turkey chokes or anything. Just looking for nice, tight patterns at 20 meters or so.

 

[Alpine]

New or Used?

If I was going the used route then there are great deals on 870's at pawn shops like others have mentioned.

Going to buy brand new then maybe I would get a Pardner Pump. Been thinking about getting one of those myself actually.

Hope you find what your looking for.

 

[Rocketmedic]

Most of the pawn shops here are on crack when it comes to weapons- filthy and overpriced as compared to Walmart.

Looking at Big 5 or Academy for some reasonable Pardners...always in stock.

 

[Omaha-BeenGlockin]

Pardner Pumps are $159 at Walmart-----might want to start your search there.

 

[PapaG]

Why would anyone buy a chinese clone when you can get a good used 870, even a wingmaster, for the same money? Doesn't make sense. More stuff available for the 870 platform than the chinese stuff anyway.

 

[Rocketmedic]

Probably because the Chinese stuff has a better fit, finish, heavier construction, uses steel instead of aluminum, and has much nicer sights for a very reasonable price, whereas the American companies are all like "well, that'll get you our entry-le vel gun, but for these nice things, you need another $200".

When I can get a new American gun of higher quality than a Chinese one for equal cost, I will. Until then, I'm buying the best bargain.

Americans won't get my business until they're competitive with superior Chinese products.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Rocketmedic

Pardner Pump
<SNIP>
Anyway, how do the Pardners compare with the Mavericks, and are there any other good shotgun options for less than 230 or so? I'm thinking a used 500 might fit in here too, potentially an 870. What do yall like about them? How accessorizeable are they? How durable and long-lasting? Where are they needing improvement? Etc.

They're great shotguns for the money. They're heavier duty than the 870 Express (btw, stay the heck away from the 870 Expresses). Everything except for the barrel is interchangeable with the 870 accessories. Don't let the hater's (and there are 'em here) dissuade you from getting one because "they're Chinese crap". They're not... Besides, Remington owns H&R which imports the Pardner.

Expect to pay around $170 for a brand new one.

 

[Girodin]

I can often find used wingmasters for less than new express models or Mossberg 500s. That would be my first choice. That said it usually takes watching your local adds closely and being ready to jump on a good deal.

I recently was looking to get to get an inexpensive knock around pump gun. Comparing and handling the new express models 870s against the new pardner pumps. The pardner pumps looked like better guns and for a good amount less. I would have left with the Pardner pump for about 170 OTD had the seller not also had a NIB 930 SPX For less than $500 OTD. I couldn't pass on that.

One thing about the foreign guns to be mindful of is depending on how you plan to accessorize/modify it you could unwittingly run afoul of 922r. Its not hard to avoid that, just something to be aware of.

I'd look for a used wingmaster first but I would feel comfortable buying a pardner pump. The Hawk 982 with ghost rings is not a bad buy at $200, and cheaper than adding them to any of the others later, if GR fit the type of shooting you'll be doing.

 

[Fred Fuller]

uses steel instead of aluminum

Whoa up now, let's not get carried away. Please tell me what parts are made of aluminum on an 870 that're made of steel on a Chinese clone? I haven't found any yet...

I sure don't cast any aspersions on the imports- in file testing field stripped parts a couple of years ago on one of my Hawks and one of my 870 Express guns, my gunsmith said that some of the parts in a Hawk seemed like better steel to him than the same parts from an 870. But we gotta be as accurate as we can be here... it's important.

lpl

 

[oneounceload]

People who only buy based on price are usually disappointed in the long run

Americans won't get my business until they're competitive with superior Chinese products

Please remember that when YOUR job is outsourced..........Chinese products might be cheaper, but they aren't superior..well, maybe their chop sticks are............

 

[Girodin]

People who only buy based on price are usually disappointed in the long run

If based solely on price I think that is often true.

Please remember that when YOUR job is outsourced

That's a good reason not to have a skill set and education that limits one to unskilled labor.

Chinese products might be cheaper, but they aren't superior

With respect to the 870 and its Chinese clones I have seen nothing to convince me that quality wise the Chinese guns aren't as good or better than the express guns.

 

[Rocketmedic]

That's why I'm a paramedic. Organic demand. No outsourcing.

When $200 dollars to Cerebus-China gets you a good shotgun and 200 gets a suspicious American gun, not much of a choice.

Perhaps Americans should do better work for less.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Why does any conversation regarding the Pardner Pump always devolve into a "I will not buy it because it's made in China"? This is suppose to be a RKBA forum not a political forum. The bottom line is that the Pardner Pump (& Protector) are great shotguns for the money. If a new 870 cost $170, I'd buy it in a heartbeat, but it doesn't and why buy used when one can buy new, especially when the quality is on par if not better and the price is less?

Besides, I would think that almost everyone knows that it is a global economy and that if your job was outsourced it wasn't because of Chinese or East Indian workers or even their governments, but more like the failure of company management to turn enough of a profit for the shareholders - and those shareholders are YOU. If you have a 401K - It's YOU. If you have a pension - It's YOU. If you have a mutual fund - It's YOU.

BTW, if it hasn't already been mentioned, H&R/NEF was owned by Marlin which is now owned by Remington which is owned by Cerberus Capital. Cerberus Capital is an AMERICAN company based in NYC. Unless you live under a rock, you have shopped in their stores (e.g. Albertsons) and watched their movies (Spyglass Entertainment). So, don't buy H&R, NEF, Marlin, or Remington products, either.

 

[JQP]

I'd take the Pardner Defender over the 870 (and Express model) every time.

A side by side comparison convinced me the Pardner Defender is a better built shotgun.

Also, do some research on who and how Cererbrus tested the Pardner; it went through torture tests to rival any firearm, and the results were quite satisfactory, to say the least (Cererbrus had planned on competing head to head with Remington for LE Agency contracts, but political issues got in the way).

People here have firearms made in Russia, Poland, Germany, Austria, Italy, Canada, Czech Republic, Poland, Hungary, Sweden, Bulgaria, Egypt, Israel, Belgium, etc....

...But the ONLY time I hear bitching and moaning is when the subject of Chinese made shotguns comes up.

I love buying American products. I love buying quality American products even more so.

But since my awful experiences of the 80s with American cars, when I first felt compelled to buy a Japanese car to get to school & work reliably and without drama or maintenance/repair costs, I've learned that not forcing American manufacturers to compete on quality and fit and finish, and buying their products 'anyways,' is NOT doing them any favors in the long run.

 

[Girodin]

Why does any conversation regarding the Pardner Pump always devolve into a "I will not buy it because it's made in China"?

I'd say it is a mix of xenophobia and/or racism (the yellow scare dates back to the 19th century and apparently dies very hard) and a lack of understanding concerning business and economics. That's just my guess though.

 

[NoobCannon]

Along the same lines of "I'll never shop at Wal-Mart because they give American Jobs to the Chinese." Bullcrap. I work for Wal-Mart. And I own a Pardner Pump. Some people need to learn to open up to the world.

BTW, my PP is a cylinder-bore weapon, I can fire whatever I want through it, and its threaded for a choke should I see fit to install one. The magazine extension, heatshield, and sidesaddle shell holder installed with 0 hassle on it, while the saddle-style scope mount required modification to fit due to the thicker gauge steel in the reciever.

Buy a Pardner Pump and try to kill it. Go ahead, I'll wait.

 

[HellFish]

Bought one of the 18.5" bbl HD Pardner Pumps and most of the Remington junk will fit on it. The Pardner does use a shorter bolt to hold the stock on and Remington shell latches work but don't fit perfectly and require some dexterity to install. The safety on my Pardner is also not removable like the safety on the 870. I did have a problem with my right side shell latch which is why I had to replace it with a Remington piece, but I did expect some problems with a $200 shotgun. Overall not a bad buy, but I wish I could find a longer barrel for it also.

Also I don't really care if it was made in China. If Remington had a cheapo division like Mossberg does I would have given my money to them, but they don't, so I didn't. Want the market share back Remington? Make super cheap shotguns too.

 

[Girodin]

Want the market share back Remington? Make super cheap shotguns too.

Read above about the company relations this is in essence their cheapo shotgun, well their cheaper than the cheapo express cheapo shotgun.

 

[FLNT4EVR]

The Pardner Protector is an excellent HD shotgun. I have taken it to the range and fired every type of 12 ga loads thru it.Slugs ,buckshot,birdshot, even steel shot,and it handled them all without a hitch. The only modification I've made on mine was to put a pistol grip butt stock on mine , simply because it gives me better control. Except for barrels any add on that will fit an 870 will fit on the pardner pump.

 

[JFrame]

Another satisfied customer of the NEF Pardner Protector...

Mine is equipped with a Knoxx SpecOps stock for the Remington 870 -- fits perfectly.

.

 

[NoobCannon]

BTW, I used to also own an 870 Express, and lemme tell you, that puppy ROCKED you with each shot(I'm 6'2" and was way heavier at the time), but the Pardner Pump I own now has very negligible kick. I noticed on mine it seems to have a thicker recoil pad, and the overall weight is a few hairs more, so that may have something to do with it.

Personally, after the epic bruise I got from a day at the range with my 870 Express, I think I'll stick to my more forgiving Pardner Pump.